Four cleared of Colston statue criminal damage

[Buelligan]

It's amazing how easy it is to bin monuments when it comes to business though innit? No issue demolishing the lovely, historically and culturally significant Chartist mural in Newport's John Frost Square eh? Just to make room for a shitty gaudy crap retail centre to line the pockets of the kind of cunt that this slaver was.

Easy to get rid of that stuff innit?

You may want to brace yourself, bgmnts, before you read the quote below -

A parliamentary inquiry in Australia has recommended the Anglo-Australian mining company, Rio Tinto, compensate the Indigenous people in the country for the destruction of two ancient sites, and criticised the government for failing to protect the Aboriginal group.

In an interim report entitled, Never Again, released on Wednesday, the panel also recommended that the mining giant impose a moratorium on mining in the Juukan Gorge in Western Australia, and rehabilitate the sacred sites, which are estimated to be 46,000 years old.

Rio Tinto triggered a public outcry in May when it blew up parts of the Juukan Gorge, as part of an expansion to extract $135m worth of iron ore.

"Never again can we allow the destruction, the devastation and the vandalism of cultural sites as has occurred with the Juukan Gorge – never again," said Warren Entsch, House member and chairman of the panel.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/12/10/rio-tinto-government-faulted-for-blast-at-aboriginal-caves

[Ferris]

[tag]Enid Blyton's gritty modern reboot panned by critics[/tag]

[jobotic]

[bgmnts]

Ha the human instinct in how to deal with a 46000 year old site sacred to hundred of generations of people is to blow it up for a few extra bob.


Thank fuck there's going to be an inquiry though. That'll stop this happening again.

[jobotic]

Remember how terrible it was when the Taliban blew up the Buddhas of Bamiyan?

Bloody fools didn't even make any money out of it.

[Jasha]

The Colston four, hardly the Birmingham 6 is it

[Cold Meat Platter]

A rare victory for good, old-fashioned common sense.
Or is it political correctness gone mad?
Not sure.

[chveik]

I don't really understand this argument - if you agree that toppling the statue was a good and correct thing, what is the difference, in terms of righteousness, justice, value to a lawful society, between a behind-closed-doors smoke-filled-room decision not to prosecute and a judge and jury acquittal?

Why is the second option more dangerous/problematic?

shoulders is a centrist. hth

[idunnosomename]

End of the day, they're statues.  Not even statues of great artistic merit. 

the Colston one is pretty good by a top late 19th century sculptor (unlike the American civil war ones put up in the Jim Crow era, which are complete cookie-cutter shit). should've been in a museum, contextualised, twenty years ago. it's only been made more important by these people's actions though

desecrating Marx's grave is horrible (and it happens a lot). but im not negating your point that people are far more important and we shouldnt get upset about big public effigies too much.

also notice it's only 19th century monuments to British imperialism that people get upset about. although I am pretty appalled the Nancy Astor statue got put up, she profited from family slave-owning, came over here and became a socialite, then an MP who thought Hitler was a good bulwark against communism.

[imitationleather]

lol

[gib]

RIP Shoulders who died on this hill

[Buelligan]

the Colston one is pretty good by a top late 19th century sculptor (unlike the American civil war ones put up in the Jim Crow era, which are complete cookie-cutter shit). should've been in a museum, contextualised, twenty years ago. it's only been made more important by these people's actions though

desecrating Marx's grave is horrible (and it happens a lot). but im not negating your point that people are far more important and we shouldnt get upset about big public effigies too much.

also notice it's only 19th century monuments to British imperialism that people get upset about. although I am pretty appalled the Nancy Astor statue got put up, she profited from family slave-owning, came over here and became a socialite, then an MP who thought Hitler was a good bulwark against communism.

I get what you're saying and all - but you know, art... If it's about conveying ideas, what ideas did the Colston lump emit?  Even if it was dumb, was it pretty? 

Marx's memorials live untarnished in the minds of many, desecrating his statue says something about those doing it, nothing about his ideas, which continue, leaping from one living brain to the next.

[idunnosomename]

I get what you're saying and all - but you know, art... If it's about conveying ideas, what ideas did the Colston lump emit?  Even if it was dumb, was it pretty? 

I think it's just valuing the labour of the artist John Cassidy and the people who cast it. it's pretty empty in values but it's an important artefact of top-whack late 19th century bronze sculpture.


Cassidy was born in Ireland, won a scholarship to study in Milan and then was resident in Manchester, establishing himself enough there to get the commission from John Arrowsmith for the Bristol Colston statue partly to promote his printworks opposite. I mean it being pulled down and rolled into the harbour only gives it more artistic significance than ever before though. and i'm just glad no one had their lives ruined by a conviction pulling the fucking thing down.

[Goldentony]

Hate that Bristol is really a pain in the arse to get to from the North. What the fuck are any of you hiding hey. I've been there, what are you hiding from me, what's going on. Reveal the secrets to me now.

[Pink Gregory]

Hate that Bristol is really a pain in the arse to get to from the North. What the fuck are any of you hiding hey. I've been there, what are you hiding from me, what's going on. Reveal the secrets to me now.

I can show you where Michael Hutchence used to live, apparently.

[Pink Gregory]

I suppose if there have been repeated peaceful and legal attempts to bin a Marx monument that have been ignored then I guess it should go? Unsure.

Presumably it's on a private grave plot as well?

[Zetetic]

Not sure that's a great route to go down given the general trend for making public spaces privately owned.

Don't really want "actually it's owned by the Canary Wharf Holding Corporation" to be considered argument-ending.

[shoulders]

RIP Shoulders who died on this hill

Lol what

[olliebean]

Darren Grimes literally advocating the desecration of a grave, there.

[Porky]

Hate that Bristol is really a pain in the arse to get to from the North. What the fuck are any of you hiding hey. I've been there, what are you hiding from me, what's going on. Reveal the secrets to me now.

Easy enough to get to from the North .. A1(M), M1, A38, M5 or M6, M5 or easy enough by train with direct trains from the North East or Manchester. Bristol is not my favourite place.

[H-O-W-L]

It doesn't set any precedent at all. No jury is bound by the verdict of any previous jury.

ahh but if people do one thing once aaaahhhh we're all fucked aaaahhhhhh this means that they can legalize having everyone bummed by captain tom's ghost!!!!!!

[H-O-W-L]

IF YOU DON'T COME HARD ON THESE CLOWNS WE ARE GOING TO BE UP TO OUR BALLS IN JUGGLERS

grimacing under the high-flec of his megaplas visor, the Bo-Judge™ looms down at you. "DID YOU JUST WALK PAST THE BLOBBY-THATCHER-MOORE MONUMENT WITHOUT SALUTING HAND-OUT AND SINGING GOD SAVE THE GRACIOUS QUEEN? I'LL HAVE YOU KNOW A JURY FOUND THAT ILLEGAL." he yells as he prods at your sternum with a daystick. your memories of lemon sorbet, of sticky toffee, of childhood treats, melt away to be replaced by the mental straitjacket of a fear of the awaiting cold, dim cell in the basement of Terror-Block Nine; which is broadcast live on BBC3 as episodes of well-known comedy Two Life Sentences & A Packet Of Screams. falling to your knees -- breaking them on the PFI contracted concrete -- you weep into the man's galoshes. "Please, do not send me to the Big Block!" you cry. "Please! I promise I'm a good citizen! I love statues! I love flags! I love it all! Tea! The MechaQueen! I love it all!"

"No... son..... a jURY SED SO. ONCE. TO THE HELL YOU GO."

and all because some daft lefties got cleared for toppling a racist.... doesn't look good for corbyn!!!!!!

[Buelligan]

I think it's just valuing the labour of the artist John Cassidy and the people who cast it. it's pretty empty in values but it's an important artefact of top-whack late 19th century bronze sculpture.


Cassidy was born in Ireland, won a scholarship to study in Milan and then was resident in Manchester, establishing himself enough there to get the commission from John Arrowsmith for the Bristol Colston statue partly to promote his printworks opposite. I mean it being pulled down and rolled into the harbour only gives it more artistic significance than ever before though. and i'm just glad no one had their lives ruined by a conviction pulling the fucking thing down.

My brother worked as a bronze-caster - even did a thing for old Chirac - so I have some appreciation of the craft and the work poured (heh) into it.  However, it's a bit like celebrating the amazing machining skills of the lad (or woman) that made the casings for Little Boy, I'm sure (s)he did a great job but sadly, all that skill and work is overshadowed by the overall story.

Agree totally about the artistic significance and value of the statue now, hope very much Mr Cassidy and his nameless minions are smiling in their sleep.

[jobotic]

We'll be seeing an end to trial by jury soon, so this sort of awful thing won't happen again.

[Pink Gregory]

Not sure that's a great route to go down given the general trend for making public spaces privately owned.

Don't really want "actually it's owned by the Canary Wharf Holding Corporation" to be considered argument-ending.

oh, it isn't, but I'm making the fairly obvious point that Colston's Statue and the bust of Marx on his grave aren't equivalent.

If Colston's statue was on his grave plot in a churchyard somewhere I don't think people would advocate removing it in quite the same way.

[Psybro]

Imo natural justice dictates the verdict should be set aside until the statue has had the chance to have the evidence of its witnesses properly heard.

[Buelligan]

Lol what

Thought it was pretty funny, myself.

Genuine big laugh.

[shoulders]

Thought it was pretty funny, myself.

Genuine big laugh.

Whatever pleases you. Ultimately some people are unwilling to recognise nuance on issues that are emotive or tribal for them.

[Dex Sawash]

A man

[Buelligan]

Whatever pleases you. Ultimately some people are unwilling to recognise nuance on issues that are emotive or tribal for them.

I don't know what you mean.  I found the remark witty, funny, it made me laugh.  If that's wrong, sorry.