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April 27, 2024, 02:33:10 PM

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Fiction that brings its own vernacular

Started by Vodkafone, April 22, 2023, 05:16:50 PM

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Vodkafone

Fiction that is written entirely in its own variant of language can be very good at creating a vivid world, when done well. The two that immediately spring to my mind are:

Boxy an Star by Daren King. A book that broadly fits the category of '90s drugs fiction', it's a very sweet and very funny tale of two kids in the not-too-distant future, the offspring of four generations of keen consumers of ecstasy and 'spangles' which has resulted in some pretty spectacular mental impairment in the two of them - 'born thru a sieve' in the vernacular of the book.

O where is my clobberdogs. My big ol clobberdogs. My lost ones. An my blue stinkies.
In the road with road on em.
We are walkin down the road goin away from Stars flat lookin for em. For my clobbers. Lookin every where for em. Holdin arm in arm as we walk coz we are in love. In love in this street what is -
Star says: 'Over there big man'. She has said it the words comin unexpected out of the blue. She has seen em. My clobs. 'Thats em over there'.
'O', I say. 'Star it is easy. Looking for clobberdogs when. When.' When it is day an there aint no dark blue night to open out an slip em in to. 'When it aint dark.'


The lingo really helps you to get into the world of Bole and Star and their friend Boxy, making the book slightly magical.

Riddley Walker by Russell Hoban. A classic in many ways, where again the inventive use of language really helps set the scene and bring the text to life. Set in Kent roughly 2000 years after a nuclear conflict, language has evolved or possibly devolved. Quite a lot of it is so descriptive, it has entered my every day use: 'dog frendy', 'largen in together', 'gurzle', 'trubba not'.

Both books depict a reality that we can half imagine and half not, and it feels like the use of a novel (haha) vernacular helps the reader to get a good feel for the half that would otherwise be difficult to get inside of.

But there must be more of these, right? Tell me your examples where this works well.

Elderly Sumo Prophecy


dontpaintyourteeth

The Book of Dave by Will Self. Highly indebted to Riddley Walker.

Vodkafone

Quote from: dontpaintyourteeth on April 22, 2023, 05:21:54 PMThe Book of Dave by Will Self. Highly indebted to Riddley Walker.

How does it compare? I've only read Umbrella and really liked it - very much a minority opinion on here - for its linguistic playfulness.

dontpaintyourteeth

Quote from: Vodkafone on April 22, 2023, 05:41:54 PMHow does it compare? I've only read Umbrella and really liked it - very much a minority opinion on here - for its linguistic playfulness.

Well I think Riddley Walker is a masterpiece but can't honestly remember if I even finished The Book of Dave. Which both does and doesn't answer your question I suppose.

Pranet

This is my fault but I really struggle when books do this. I read Riddley Walker years ago and I did finish it but it was an annoying slog. Recently I heard the Backlisted podcast on it, and I was thinking, hmm, maybe I should revisit this. Then they did a reading, and I was instantly right back there, bored and annoyed.

Science fiction seems to do this quite a lot, have a made up dialect, and it always makes my heart sink.

Having said that, I seem be remember quite liking A Clockwork Orange.

For an English gent like myself- Trainspotting.


Brundle-Fly

The goo goo ga ga in the graphic comics, Underwater by Chester Brown. I found it impenetrable. Even Brown gave up with it after a number of issues leaving the story with no ending

dontpaintyourteeth

Quote from: Deskbound Cunt on April 22, 2023, 06:03:52 PMFor an English gent like myself- Trainspotting.

Similarly and rather embarrassingly I had to google the word "sodjers" to find out James Kelman was talking about the police. I was probably halfway through How Late It Was, How Late by then. The unfunny forum posts write themselves sometimes don't they?

kappaaa

Maybe cheating, but Ella Minnow Pea has a unique take on language, with each section using fewer and fewer letters of the alphabet in a way that feels relatively un-gimmicky.

Also, Finnegans Wake is pretty idiosyncratic?

13 schoolyards

Jack Womack's Dryco series does a great job of this IMO. It's near future SF (or it was thirty-odd years ago) and if you read the six books in timeline order - which is different to publication order - the series basically teaches you how to read it as the stories go from "the day after tomorrow" to fifty-odd years in the future.

Or you could just read the "first" in the series (it's the first in the timeline, but was the second last published), Random Acts of Senseless Violence, where the schoolgirl narrator starts out writing in her diary in high school English and ends up writing about the collapse of the USA in future slang, only the progression has been so gradual it's perfectly understandable right the way through

dontpaintyourteeth

Quote from: 13 schoolyards on April 23, 2023, 03:41:08 PMJack Womack's Dryco series does a great job of this IMO. It's near future SF (or it was thirty-odd years ago) and if you read the six books in timeline order - which is different to publication order - the series basically teaches you how to read it as the stories go from "the day after tomorrow" to fifty-odd years in the future.

Or you could just read the "first" in the series (it's the first in the timeline, but was the second last published), Random Acts of Senseless Violence, where the schoolgirl narrator starts out writing in her diary in high school English and ends up writing about the collapse of the USA in future slang, only the progression has been so gradual it's perfectly understandable right the way through

I loved that book but haven't read -or seen- any of the rest of the series. Do the rest of them live up to it?

13 schoolyards

I love the whole series but if you had to only read one then that's the one. The one before - Elvissy - is probably my favourite and equal-best, but it's very different and it probably helps to be a bit of an Elvis fan there (especially as Elvis isn't the cultural force now that he was when the book was written in the early 90s).

Anyway, I recommend you read the lot if you can track them down. The only problem might be that Senseless Violence was clearly designed to be a "and now we're going to focus on a very minor character from earlier in the series" novel, and if you've read it first then getting the rest of her story in (the later-set) Ambient doesn't quite work
Spoiler alert
unless the plan is to both piss off the reader and break their heart
[close]

Shaxberd

Feersum Endjinn by Iain M Banks does a similar thing to Boxy an Star for one of its four narrators - it's been a long time since I read it so I can't remember why Bascule writes the way he does, it did make those sections a slog unfortunately. With Irvine Welsh it's easy enough once you slip into the rhythm of the accent but for science fiction where there is no pre-existing accent, you don't have that reference point.

I've also been reading Cordwainer Smith short stories recently and invented language is a huge part of that, but in a different way. He doesn't invent a dialect but his stories always contain a variety of futuristic jargon, some of which is explained and some of which the reader is left to guess at through contextual clues. It generally works; you usually have enough idea to get the gist while leaving some aspects up to the imagination. I don't think his stories would work in any medium other than text because of that aspect - the descriptions and the sense of knowing less than the narrator are an important part of the atmosphere.

Vodkafone

Some great-sounding suggestions here CaB.

Pranet

Quote from: Shaxberd on April 23, 2023, 04:39:51 PMFeersum Endjinn by Iain M Banks does a similar thing to Boxy an Star for one of its four narrators - it's been a long time since I read it so I can't remember why Bascule writes the way he does, it did make those sections a slog unfortunately.

It's been years since I read it but I remember hating those bits.

Quote from: dontpaintyourteeth on April 22, 2023, 07:18:11 PMSimilarly and rather embarrassingly I had to google the word "sodjers" to find out James Kelman was talking about the police. I was probably halfway through How Late It Was, How Late by then. The unfunny forum posts write themselves sometimes don't they?

Sodjers are soldiers. I've never heard anyone use that word for police, unless there is some kind of Kelman-specific context I'm missing here.

Vodkafone

Quote from: Clatty McCutcheon on April 26, 2023, 10:15:20 PMSodjers are soldiers. I've never heard anyone use that word for police, unless there is some kind of Kelman-specific context I'm missing here.

My reading of it was police as well. This article says it's Glaswegian dialect for plain clothes filth. But I dunno.

Certainly reads as though it's referring to police here. Maybe its a usage that's fallen out of use. Even "sodjers" in the literal sense meaning soldiers seems quite dated - the kind of word an old-timer might use.

dontpaintyourteeth

It's definitely referring to police in that book. Maybe it's not a well known thing after all and I'm not a stupid twat*. I'm okay with that





*in this particular instance

SweetPomPom

And The Ass Saw The Angel is a right old hotch potch, especially as the character is mute. It does demand a little commitment but is really satisfying once you're into it.

Pawspero

Definitely adding Riddley Walker to my list. I heard about it a few years ago and never got around to reading it. The more I've heard, the better it sounds.

Pranet

I suppose the Molesworth books count.

Vodkafone

Quote from: Pranet on May 20, 2023, 09:57:11 AMI suppose the Molesworth books count.

Yeah I reckon they do, because they build a convincing world from a particular use of unusual language.

Quote from: Vodkafone on May 21, 2023, 06:01:52 PMYeah I reckon they do, because they build a convincing world from a particular use of unusual language.

I've always recalled one of them containing the phrase 'cave!  Here comes the Pukon!'

I still don't know the derivation of that final word, though it was clear they spoke of a teacher.

Rizla

Quote from: Pawspero on April 30, 2023, 05:55:16 PMDefinitely adding Riddley Walker to my list. I heard about it a few years ago and never got around to reading it. The more I've heard, the better it sounds.
Absolutely brilliant book, possibly my favourite novel ever. My mate sold me on it when I was 18 - "Its set in the future after a nuclear war, everyone wears anoraks and trades in hash and rizlas." The mrs got me a 1st edition for my 40th. I love the names of some of the side characters. Nimbel Potter (son of Durster). Fister Crunchman. Skyway Moaters.

Weirdly, although its dystopian as fuck, its a world I keep wanting to revisit. I'm forever dipping into it. There's a good resource here that will help get the most out of your first (of many) goes. 

Shaxberd

Quote from: Phoenix Lazarus on May 21, 2023, 06:17:38 PMI've always recalled one of them containing the phrase 'cave!  Here comes the Pukon!'

I still don't know the derivation of that final word, though it was clear they spoke of a teacher.

Probably a combo of 'puke' and 'Mekon', as in the evil aliens from Dan Dare. Fun to think that he probably made a little more sense to the first readers and the further away you get from his specific 1950s schoolboy milieu, the more confusing he gets. Took me ages to realise that Grabber Ma is Grabber Major, ie the elder of two Grabber brothers, and it wasn't part of his actual name.

Senior Baiano