Is this the end of the BBC?

[Ron Maels Moustache]

Mixing It was another genius R3 cull.

Similar story with BBC Lancs legendary experimental music show "On The Wire", which was quietly axed under cover of Lockdown. Yet another case of idiot management not knowing what they've got and binning off all their most unique programming

One thing that bothers me is that if you've ever browsed BBC Sounds it's apparent the corporation has gone all out on podcasting in a massive way. Not including all the actual radio shows, there's hundreds of podcast episodes on there, more than anyone could ever listen to. And they always seem to be announcing another one. They've basically used their resources and reach to flood the market, and with these potential massive cuts looming you kind-of have to wonder if it's been money well spent.

[Sebastian Cobb]

BBC Sounds is a fucking mess in itself isn't it? Zet summed it up well:

Hope we get a long read one day on what the fuck BBC Sounds is and why no one was able to stop it.

[Sebastian Cobb]

If we're talking niche gems of local radio I reckon BBC Shropshire won that one with Colin Young's show. Up there with Tony Blackburn on the nerdy white guys who earnestly promoted soul music.

[Malcy]

Why is this big news all of a sudden? I read this months ago and it was just someone's opinion. Is it still the case or has something been set in concrete?

[13 schoolyards]

Knowing fuck-all about the BBC but loads about how right-wing politicians love a distraction when they've been caught being massively shit - I'm in Australia - it looks a lot like exactly the kind of "news" they'd drop to try and change the conversation from something they didn't like. Anything especially crap the Tories have been caught doing in the last few days?

[notjosh]

BBC Sounds is a fucking mess in itself isn't it? Zet summed it up well:

There's some great content on there but it's near-impossible to sift through. Try finding any new comedy on there without having to scroll past 200 episodes of The News Quiz and Just a Minute first.

If the BBC wants to save money, stop updating idents all the time. I find it baffling how they keep updating them, who cares if the programme is introduced by a shot of hippies in a circle or a large number 2 with cloth ripping?

Yeah, this bugs the shit out of me. Probably a very minor expenditure in the grand scheme of things, but it's not a good look is it? Just a parade of their own vanity.

Clearly a lot that ought to change about the BBC, and maybe there is a useful conversation to be had about the best way to manage its funding, but these venal fuckwits aren't the ones to have it with.

[idunnosomename]

Sounds was clearly made as a way to rebrand their content to look more like podcasts: ironically, something they invented c.2004.

The radio player service, both app and web player, broken off from iplayer, had its problems at first but by 2017 had just overcome them. Sounds took it back to square one, and they ended the old radio player app regardless the year after its launch, despite the problems not getting resolved

You STILL cannot link to timecodes in Sounds. Pointless for linking to segments in 3-hour shows.

This is something I object to with the BBC, the bods often waste money on stupid projects like this

[gilbertharding]

It's all shades of Alan Rubbisher wasting millions making the Guardian a berliner format, isn't it? And you can hear it every last time someone complains about something on the BBC, on Radio 4 Feedback: "We're sorry you feel that way, but we're right." Liberal brain in action.

[greencalx]

I grew up in a household where R3 was on for much of the time, and over the last ~40 years it has oscillated between two basic states. When under fire for being too niche, it tends to go through a phase of trying to be aggressively listener-friendly, with lots of chatty guests, sticking to a fairly standard repertoire and (latterly) trying to "reach" its audience through Twitter or what-have-you. Must leave the retired vicar contingent feeling somewhat at sea. After a period of this, inevitably it gets criticised for not differentiating itself from Classic FM, at which point you're subjected to wall-to-wall musique concrète and twelve-tone serialism for a few months until the listenership has reverted to a historical low and so the cycle goes round.

In the transitions between these two states it briefly gets to be the station it wants to be, which is one that plays fairly standard repertoire without much chat during the day, has a concert in the evening, and then switches over to weird but interesting stuff at night. Shows like Mixing It and The Late Junction are prime examples of things that only the BBC could do, which is why it's so mystifying that they always seem to be first in line for an axing.

[jamiefairlie]

I never understood why a podcast wasn't just a radio show you could download, there's no difference really is there?

[Kankurette]

I see sucking up to the Tories has really helped.

[Gurke and Hare]

I never understood why a podcast wasn't just a radio show you could download, there's no difference really is there?

Well specifically a podcast is that but described in a specific format of RSS file. Which the BBC didn't invent.

[Replies From View]

Or the farmer and the viper.

Or the gingerbread man.

[idunnosomename]

I THINK THE BBC IS A LOAD OF CRAP!!!

[Ferris]

I imagine it's like ITV cubed.

Watching North American telly is so jarring and obnoxious I have never been interested in subscribing. Whenever I watch baseball (the only thing worth watching on cable) at the in-laws, the audio/visual assault of loud adverts every 5 minutes is brutal, but the old boy seems not to notice. Completely used to it.

...or I can subscribe to the MLB app directly, watch it anywhere in the house, and no adverts for me. It's a wonder cable companies are able to operate at all. They don't have a service anyone under 55 is interested in.

British telly is far better in general. ITV/Channel 4 know they can't take the piss with adverts because the competition is the BBC that doesn't have any and people will switch over if they go too mad with it. It tacitly holds the entire market in check. I'd guess a switch to 4 ad breaks per half hour like the US on commercial channels pretty quick if the BBC stops making watchable telly.

[wooders1978]

6 music has gone to shit IMO - Radcliffe and maconi one of the only good shows left but they will be gone when their contract is up

The likes of mastermind, university challenge, Masterchef and Great British menu willfind a home easily at the likes of C4 I am sure - most of those shows would probably benefit from a few fresh faces as well to be honest

Their other decent output has either been largely produced by the likes of hbo or they've managed to hit the bullseye a couple of times with some comedies like this country and people just do nothing - but if you throw enough darts at the blackboard you'll strike lucky a couple of times

[olliebean]

British telly is far better in general. ITV/Channel 4 know they can't take the piss with adverts because the competition is the BBC that doesn't have any and people will switch over if they go too mad with it. It tacitly holds the entire market in check. I'd guess a switch to 4 ad breaks per half hour like the US on commercial channels pretty quick if the BBC stops making watchable telly.

Advertising on British telly is limited by Ofcom regulations to 12 minutes per hour (not including ads for the broadcaster's own programmes). I think they also allow only one break per half-hour during certain types of programme. ITV and Channel 4 know they can't take the piss with adverts because they're not allowed to.

Ofcom is probably relatively safe for the moment as I doubt Dorries has the slightest idea what it does.

[Ferris]

Ah, I stand corrected!

[Gurke and Hare]

Advertising on British telly is limited by Ofcom regulations to 12 minutes per hour (not including ads for the broadcaster's own programmes).

Is this averaged out over the day? There are US wrestling shows that definitely have all the native ad breaks included in the UK broadcast and it's more than 12 minutes per hour.

[Sebastian Cobb]

Advertising on British telly is limited by Ofcom regulations to 12 minutes per hour (not including ads for the broadcaster's own programmes). I think they also allow only one break per half-hour during certain types of programme. ITV and Channel 4 know they can't take the piss with adverts because they're not allowed to.

Ofcom is probably relatively safe for the moment as I doubt Dorries has the slightest idea what it does.

There are fewer minutes of ads allowed when a film is on I think, which is why ITV try and take the piss by splitting the film in two with a couple of minutes of 'entertainment news' in between.

[olliebean]

Is this averaged out over the day? There are US wrestling shows that definitely have all the native ad breaks included in the UK broadcast and it's more than 12 minutes per hour.

It's every individual hour. Averaged out over the day they're not allowed to show more than 9 minutes per hour. I daresay this doesn't apply to broadcasters operating outside the UK, e.g. US channels available on UK TV services such as Sky.

The code is here, if you want to check the details: https://www.ofcom.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0014/32162/COSTA-311220.pdf

[olliebean]

Didn't notice this at the time but it now seems to have come into operation: https://www.chortle.co.uk/news/2022/01/27/50058/bbc-pulls-its-friday-night-comedy-podcasts-from-apple-and-google

Basically the BBC seem to be deprecating their podcasts, either getting rid of them entirely or putting stuff on the feed 28 days late even though it's topical. It's essentially "Use BBC Sounds or fuck off."

'We want more people to use BBC Sounds to listen to their favourite BBC audio, and to easily discover more from the BBC. This gives licence fee payers even more value.

How, exactly, does removing options give more value?

'The world of audio listening is constantly changing, and the global tech giants are more routinely publishing content exclusively on their platforms. We want to make sure people can easily find new things from the BBC and can't rely on other platforms, who have their own exclusive content and a global catalogue to promote, to do this for us.

"Other platforms are doing this shitty exclusive thing, so we're going to do it too."

'We're doing this as a trial to see what the impact is on listening on BBC Sounds and we hope listeners do use this as an opportunity to try out Sounds, and discover and enjoy more brilliant BBC audio.

The impact will probably be that more people will use BBC Sounds, because they've got no other choice. But I daresay overall listening will drop, as not everyone currently using the podcast feeds will be arsed to switch.

'We know people have established ways of listening to on-demand audio but we also know many people already use multiple apps and platforms to listen to their favourite content.

Yes, by necessity, because some things that pretend to be "podcasts" restrict their availability. Not by choice. Nobody actually wants to have to use half a dozen different apps to listen to half a dozen exclusive "podcasts". The BBC is making this situation worse, not better.

[McDead]

They spent a fortune on that piece of shit app, so by god you're going to use it.

[jobotic]

before BBC Sounds you could find a huge amount of episodes of Composer of the Week to download, now there only seems to be a very limited amount and they're really hard to find.

I also have no idea how to look at what's being played on a programme as it's being broadcast, which used to be simple.

[Ferris]

What the fuck is bbc sounds?

[McDead]

A very bad BBC app that folds the old BBC radio app (which was excellent) into an essentially broken podcast service. Nothing about it works well.

[Ferris]

Is it subscription or do I have to be in the UK (like iplayer)?

[mjwilson]

I don't know if this really count as "end of the BBC" stuff, but Kermode and Mayo are leaving, presumably to set up somewhere else. I know some people have their criticisms of the show, but it is pretty popular, and Kermod knows his stuff (I find him better value on his own podcasts to be honest, where he can talk more about films and less about all the other stuff which tends to fil up Wittertainment).

[Fambo Number Mive]

Given this push to make everyone use BBC Sounds doesn't save the BBC any money, and as a public service they should be required to make their content as easily accessible as possible, its disgusting they are doing this. Where is the logic?

[GolazoDan]

I don't know if this really count as "end of the BBC" stuff, but Kermode and Mayo are leaving, presumably to set up somewhere else. I know some people have their criticisms of the show, but it is pretty popular, and Kermod knows his stuff (I find him better value on his own podcasts to be honest, where he can talk more about films and less about all the other stuff which tends to fil up Wittertainment).

I've loved their show for years so I was mortified when I read the announcement yesterday but then you see the clip (and their wording) and it's basically wink wink, nudge nudge, "you'll need to subscribe to a new podcast feed". Definitely all feels linked, lots of podcasts are going independent from the BBC or hooking up with the established podcast companies at the moment, e.g. Peter Crouch. At a point it makes complete sense (both financially and creatively) and the BBC's probably holding them back.

Kermode's great at speeding through a review when there's 90 seconds before the news but I'm not gonna complain if he has more time when the new thing gets going.