Johnny Depp and Amber Heard trial

[touchingcloth]

There are people who use CaB and Tik Tok? What a world.

[GoblinAhFuckScary]

don't get me wrong i got this quote from tumblr, which despite its funny history is one of the best and weirdest social media platforms about right now

[Lord Mandrake]

Hey when he said he'd like to drown her burn her and rape her corpse he was just being cool like that Hunter S Thompson he's like because he's cool too. She's bitchy.

I mean, I think it's quite sad that he's adopted a caricature of HST as a substitute for a personality but carry on misunderstanding.

I also think the threats to "burn and fuck her corpse" are not credible and I don't buy him as this powerful, intimidating man. Whereas she is incontrovertably on tape as physically assaulting him, she has been caught in several indisputable lies and simply watching her in court gave me, a layman - the impression of a deeply manipulative and calculating PERSON.

[Dickie_Anders]

Not gonna lie, as someone who is definitely more sympathetic to Heard in this case, that just reads as a reaction to the hate she's got online, which is of course ugly and vile. A text message where an edgy cunt tries to be funny and fails just isn't proof of abuse. If it was, I would have been put in prison a long time ago

It seems the best evidence Heard has is friends saying that she had bruises that she covered with makeup. I was inclined to believe her, but then a photo of her with a bruise was shown that seemed pretty flagrantly doctored

It also just seems ludicrous to actually buy the Heard team's case that the op-ed/claims didn't have a negative impact on Depp's career and reputation

[the science eel]

don't get me wrong i got this quote from tumblr, which despite its funny history is one of the best and weirdest social media platforms about right now

it is absolutely the best way to waste time if you've got the app installed on your phone

I mean, it is what you want it to be, really, but it's potentially thrill after thrill

[the science eel]

I mean, I think it's quite sad that he's adopted a caricature of HST as a substitute for a personality but carry on misunderstanding.

I also think the threats to "burn and fuck her corpse" are not credible and I don't buy him as this powerful, intimidating man.

There are texts (or possibly recordings, can't remember now) of him actually saying those words.

He's clearly been advised to behave in court as a charming, low-key, humble soul because those characteristics are the exact opposite of the worst things he's being accused of. But when he's in full raging boozed-up mode - and we know from evidence that this was in fact the way he behaved many times during their relationship - he's absolutely powerful and intimidating.

[JamesTC]

Would love it if he turned up to court in full raging boozed-up mode.

[Cold Meat Platter]

DEPP GOES BEAST MODE AND DESTROYS HEARD IN FOOTAGE YOU WON'T BELIEVE

[Noodle Lizard]

He hasn't denied being a drunken/drugged arsehole and madman, but he's sort of cheekily downplayed it, which has gone over well with his fanbase and presumably the spirit of Hunter "S.hoot your colleagues and taser your bartender" Thompson is smiling down upon him, glad that someone is continuing his good work by slamming cabinets and passing out with melted ice cream. What is he like.

However, his team also knows that a lot of that stuff is circumstantial from a legal standpoint. The evidence for the specific claims that Heard made, implied within the Washington Post article in question, is fairly thin, so he may well win the defamation case. Of course, as with most things, nobody really wins.

[Dr Rock]

There are texts (or possibly recordings, can't remember now) of him actually saying those words.

It's from texts to and from actor Paul Bettany, who he had discussed his relationship with to some extent (we don't know the full extent). They start with 'she's a witch, burn her' quoting Monty Python Holy Grail and escalate to the 'fuck her corpse to make sure she's dead bit' which is not part of the Python funnymen's skit as I recall. So not in any way a real threat, nothing Amber was ever supposed to see. If he were abusing her in other ways, these texts were not any kind of abuse.

[Lord Mandrake]

There are texts (or possibly recordings, can't remember now) of him actually saying those words.

He's clearly been advised to behave in court as a charming, low-key, humble soul because those characteristics are the exact opposite of the worst things he's being accused of. But when he's in full raging boozed-up mode - and we know from evidence that this was in fact the way he behaved many times during their relationship - he's absolutely powerful and intimidating.

They are texts sent to his mate Paul Bettany, none sent to Heard. So not threats and not credible. As for this booze fuelled rage monster... The guy is on a permanent cocktail of prescribed sedatives and was apparently also on "a handful of ecstasy pills" and missing a fingertip
when the most egregious of Heards accusations is alleged to have occured, the assault she never sought medical attention for, not that that necessarily rules it out.

[Mister Six]

TikTok comments often read like a combination of the worst of YouTube and Reddit, due to being mainly populated by teenagers, and one of the worst things that I've noticed is how credulous younger people seem to be. I wonder if perhaps the lesson of not believing everything you see online (which other people have observed was taught to us by a generation who have since collectively been driven insane by ignoring their own advice) hasn't been passed down effectively.

Teenagers (and early twentysomethings) have always been credulous idiots though. How many of them read something written in an authoritative voice and immediately parrot it? I did. So did plenty of my friends.

[GoblinAhFuckScary]

been deeply concerned about how this case will enable misogynists and disempower victims of domestic abuse

just got a weird reply on youtube to a comment i made about klaus kinski being a rapist paedophile eight years ago

"i bet you even believe Amber Heard. Anyways, Pola Kinski deserved it."

fuck man

[Dr Rock]

If it does, it's Amber Heard's fault.

[Lord Mandrake]

been deeply concerned about how this case will enable misogynists and disempower victims of domestic abuse

just got a weird reply on youtube to a comment i made about klaus kinski being a rapist paedophile eight years ago

"i bet you even believe Amber Heard. Anyways, Pola Kinski deserved it."

fuck man

"Go on Johnny, tell the world your the victim of domestic violence, see how many people beleive you" - Amber Heard.

[TrenterPercenter]

I think the problem is doubling down on absolutist positions and dismissing any counter arguments as exceptions to rules or irrelevant in the face of "the greater good".  This is exactly how not to create consensus and faith in concerns.  Throwing a few innocent people in jail or under the bus is both important to consider and a inevitable outcome, we have tried to build systems that reduce these outcomes (jury by peers, innocent until proven guilty, the right to representation, appeal and really importantly proportionality in the law) presenting yourself as having no interest in these protective progressive factors, unless they impact on the interest population of the group, breeds distrust.

In short it is always about one side winning and not building consensus around the best we can do.  This is why all of this lives online as working in any professional capacity would see you out on your arse pretty sharpish, you can't in reality create these perfect moral judgements.  Something about MRAs, and Neo-lib and (sadly some) Rad-feminists is that underneath the flashy activism it really all seems to be about blame and trying to assert a sense of self worth through the blaming of others (this is why the piece I posted refers to a "backlash").  This is all well and good for bored people online but it isn't really what will help women (and men) suffering from domestic abuse, or rather, there are much more tangible and important things people could be doing than putting all of their eggs in whether or not a trial of two very rich, famous and attractive people has bearing on this all.  There are literally so many things that could be being done and fought for rather than engaging in this trash (which I appreciate I am doing now).

[Paul Calf]

"Go on Johnny, tell the world your the victim of domestic violence, see how many people beleive you" - Amber Heard.

Not sure of the context, but this doesn't necessarily mean that he was a DV victim, does it?

[Pimhole]

been deeply concerned about how this case will enable misogynists and disempower victims of domestic abuse

just got a weird reply on youtube to a comment i made about klaus kinski being a rapist paedophile eight years ago

"i bet you even believe Amber Heard. Anyways, Pola Kinski deserved it."

fuck man

I wouldn't bother, Goblin. The men are off on one.

But thanks for reposting that thoughtful stuff from tumblr, very enlightening.

[Pimhole]

If it does, it's Amber Heard's fault.

Beyond parody.

[Lord Mandrake]

Not sure of the context, but this doesn't necessarily mean that he was a DV victim, does it?

No but the context is Amber Heard admitting on tape to hitting him, throwing cans and vases at him.

[Lord Mandrake]

I wouldn't bother, Goblin. The men are off on one.

But thanks for reposting that thoughtful stuff from tumblr, very enlightening.

Yes that anonymous tumblr opinion is truly enlightening but the evidence presented in court is "men off on one".

[Paul Calf]

No but the context is Amber Heard admitting on tape to hitting him, throwing cans and vases at him.

Oh, right. Fair enough.

[jobotic]

Beyond parody.

I thought it was a parody.

[Lord Mandrake]

Here comes this prat on his trusty steed.

[Paul Calf]

really haven't followed this too much buy my instinct has been that the reaction to this has been massively if not all based on garden variety misogyny.

I'll quote what i read earlier from someone on the internets i follow

"As a verdict is possibly hours away, a sense of dread has been building in my stomach for what it will mean for Amber's future, as well as all victims of intimate partner violence (IPV), particularly as women's basic rights continue to be under attack in the United States. Like many people who are following the case, I have personal experiences with abuse. Much of my research focuses on IPV, specifically, the disparities in resources and services that are available for survivors to leave their abusers, such as economic, social, geographical barriers. It's a topic which is deeply tied to my own personal experiences and academic career.

I initially was ambivalent to Amber Heard. Before I began to research the case, I was firmly in the "they both suck" camp, having only briefly glanced through articles. I started to pay more attention to the media coverage over the past six weeks and was really staggered by how Heard was being portrayed as a lying, crazy, gold-digging woman through narratives that were not only going unchallenged, but were heavily perpetuated in the public discourse. Even worse, that the abuse she experienced had been capitalized on by "true crime" junkies and mocked in TikTok videos and Youtube compilations. So I began watching the trial live and found that there was far more evidence and far more substantial evidence which shows that JD was the perpetrator of abuse within their relationship.

The evidence collected through JD's personal texts and emails show an early pattern of abuse. He exerted control over the clothes Amber wore and would become angry when she didn't dress "conservatively". He would consistently accuse her of having affairs with acquaintances, friends, and various co-stars, even with an openly gay director, Clive Barker. He didn't like that she was ambitious and would scorn her when she took opportunities to advance her career. He would constantly refer to her with misogynistic language. He also referred to Amber, an openly bisexual woman, as a "lesbian camp counsellor". He messaged other men to discuss killing her through drowning and burning her, and then raping her burnt corpse to prove that she was truly dead. This all occurred while they were still dating. She was in her early 20s and he was in 50s. All of these coercive, paranoid, jealous, controlling behaviours are deeply and unequivocally abusive.

None of this includes the evidence which shows physical and sexual abuse. There are audio tapes in which he admits to headbutting her, so hard that she was concerned her nose was broken. In another recording, they discuss how her family and friends have seen her bruises, broken blood vessels, and bald spots from her hair being torn out of her scalp. In another one, she screams "stop hitting me!" Another shows him stating "I will smack the ugly c**t before I let her in." A video shows him aggressively breaking and smashing furniture near her. One interaction reveals that Stephen Deuters, his assistant, begged her to come back to him after her assaulted her on a plane in front of his bodyguards, pleading to her that JD was remorseful for his actions. Heard also has stated he sexually assaulted her multiple times. Remember, he previously discussed violently raping her in those infamous messages to Paul Bettany.

As for witnesses, several testified to seeing bruises on her numerous times, including JD's witnesses, such as their marriage counsellor. A makeup artist, Melanie Inglessis, testified to covering swelling on her lip and two black eyes. Raquel Pennington saw several injuries, including bloodied bald spots on her head, a swollen nose, and cut lip. She expressed fear JD would eventually kill Amber if she didn't leave. Josh Drew also testified to seeing her with injuries, including black eyes, a swollen cheek, and a busted lip. iO Tillet Wright (who Depp misgenders throughout his testimony) recalled hearing JD assault Amber and scream "oh, you think I hit you? You think I fucking hit you? What if I peel your fucking hair back". iO then called 911. This was the incident which led Heard to file for a divorce and a restraining order, two days afterwards. It is worth noting that Pennington, Drew, and Wright all corroborated this incident in their depositions, as did iO's 2016 essay.

Is she guilty of fighting back? Absolutely. She never lied about doing so, even dating back to her 2016 deposition. However, fighting back against a man who has beaten you, sexually assaulted you, controlled your career, finances, and who you can associate with does not equate to being an abuser. It's simply surviving. And yes, I've heard those audio tapes, the in which she's expresses her incredulity at him for stating their fights were fair when she feared he would kill her.

His case has relied upon deeply misogynistic narratives to discredit both her claims and her character. She was after his money all along, even though she refused the 30 million dollar fortune she was legally entitled to, as there was no prenup. She painted on bruises, even though a makeup artist testified to covering up her swollen lip and two black eyes. She cut off his finger, even though multiple texts and even an audio recording showcase him admitting to doing it in the midst of a bender. She didn't donate her money, even though she and the organization created a 10 year plan for her to make yearly payments (in my personal opinion, what she does with her money either way is nobody's fucking business). Also worth noting, an ACLU representative testified to her being ahead of schedule until Depp began suing her. She made up a hoax, because she documented her abuse - as we advise all people who are in abusive situations to do. She's a liar, because women are inherently deceitful liars.

None of the evidence that JD's attorneys presented has proven that she defamed him through her op-ed piece. That's likely because their goal was never to prove that her article - which never explicitly references him or their relationship - impacted his career. Those who watched the trial will know, Tracy Jacobs, his agent of 30 years stated that it was his drug and alcohol abuse, anger issues, chronic lateness (7 or 8 hours late to set each day), and unprofessionalism that led to his career decline. Film crews grew tired of working around these problems, and eventually, so did Hollywood. Tina Newman, a Disney Corporate Representative who worked on POTC stated no one knew of Amber's op-ed until Depp sued her.

The trial was always meant to humiliate, shame, and terrorize her. We are witnessing in a powerful man terrorize his ex-wife through the legal system, all while the world makes TikToks of her sexual assault testimony. JD has a documented history of violence and is due for another court date after assaulting a crew member of the set of City of Lies. To quote his own words, "If I'm angry and I've got to lash out or hit somebody, I'm going to do it and I don't care what the repercussions are. Anger doesn't pay rent, it's gotta go. It's gotta be evicted."

I don't know whether Amber Heard will win her case. We're witnessing a radical right-wing political swing to control and criminalize women's bodies with Roe v. Wade under attack right now. To be blunt, I have very little faith in the justice system and that a jury - in Virginia of all places - will rule in favour of an abused woman over her charismatic, powerful ex-husband. However, I think it's important to remember that Amber did everything right, that is, everything we tell women to do. She documented her abuse, left her abusive partner, and was granted a restraining order - and she's continuing to be punished for doing so. If Amber, a privileged white woman with access to economic resources, is still struggling to escape her abuser, how can we expect women without those privileges to?"

When an author consistently calls one party by their first name and the other by their initials, you know you've got stone-cold objectivity.

[Indomitable Spirit]

When the right wing press astroturf stories about how innocent and great a person is, you know they must DEFINITELY be a very good person.

Anyway, just ignore those texts where he talks about commit bone-chilling levels of violence against his partner - just some classic bantz in the style of his hero (also accused of violence against women - charges later withdrawn. KERCHING ey fellas!). He only sent them to his mate anyway, so she couldn't possibly have anything to worry about.

[Lord Mandrake]

Mate. The Sun and Dan Wooton.

[the science eel]

When the right wing press astroturf stories about how innocent and great a person is, you know they must DEFINITELY be a very good person.

Anyway, just ignore those texts where he talks about commit bone-chilling levels of violence against his partner - just some classic bantz in the style of his hero (also accused of violence against women - charges later withdrawn. KERCHING ey fellas!). He only sent them to his mate anyway, so she couldn't possibly have anything to worry about.

well....that could have happened as a release, he sent the very worst thoughts to his mate so they were expunged, he could then behave himself in front of Amber.

I mean I'm in no way defending them, but actually - yeah, 'he only sent them to his mate' is key here.

[Cuellar]

well....that could have happened as a release, he sent the very worst thoughts to his mate so they were expunged, he could then behave himself in front of Amber.

Yeah...could have been, if he had actually 'behaved himself' in front of Amber, instead of assaulting her.

edit: and needless to say, talking about raping your girlfriend's burnt corpse is an insane thing to say, even 'just to a mate' and if you have thoughts like that you need to get help and at the very least get away from the person you're talking about.

[The Ombudsman]

Both arseholes. A bit like with the Rittenhouse case, it's not as black and while as everyone wants to make it, but on the evidence I've seen I think Depp should win. Not saying I sign off on his behaviour at all, but on defamation alone I think it's proven her article defamed him.

I should also add, also think it unlikely Depp was as abusive to Heard as she claims. For someone so keen and eager to record him all the time, I find it very strange there is no actual recording of anything.