Xenoblade Chronicles 3 (Don't open the wardrobe!)

[Kelvin]

This upcoming sequel has been moved forward by a couple of months, to a July 2022 release.

I seem to remember we have some others followers of the series here. I love the games, unabashedly so. Voice acting and dialogue generally sucks, but the stories and characters are always engaging, the combat's unconventional and layered, the world design is beautiful, and the soundtracks are among the best I've ever heard: XC2 especially.

I'm therefore incredibly excited about XC3's upcoming release, and also hopeful that we'll eventually get a Switch release of Xenoblade X, which remains my favourite game in the series.

Reveal Trailer for XC3:   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-iNpDKuYb8

Release Date Trailer for XC3:   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rt9pfN-2S0k

Anyone else excited? And any more general thoughts about the other Xenoblade games?

[Consignia]

Anyone else excited? And any more general thoughts about the other Xenoblade games?

I'm pretty stoked for it. It's coming pretty soon, which is a boon. I've really enjoyed both Switch outings. I just love scale of the environments and how beautiful they are, fighting against the crap graphics. And the battle system is really quite fun once you get your head round it.

It's looking less cartoony than XC2, which is pretty good, but hopefully they don't make it too dry without light-hearted bits. You can do it without making a main character a sex pest with his own fuck-bot.

From the other thread:

I will be moving on to XC2, I played about 20 hours when it came out, and dropped it because it had terrible gameplay. In a single player offline game based around collecting bad ass anthropomorphic weapons, who decided that gacha mechanics were the way to go?

I think they orignally were planning on filling the game with Microtransctions.

[Kelvin]

The ending of XC2 is almost certainly the most emotional I've ever got playing a game, I had tears running down my cheeks like a right dopey cunt. Even watching streamers playing that section makes me tear up. This music, god: 

https://youtu.be/muRgzS2HvRU?t=80

Beautiful soundtrack, and both XC and XC2 have unusually uplifting stories to tell, with positive, sincere protagonists that really got under my skin.

[Kelvin]

I'm pretty stoked for it. It's coming pretty soon, which is a boon. I've really enjoyed both Switch outings. I just love scale of the environments and how beautiful they are, fighting against the crap graphics. And the battle system is really quite fun once you get your head round it.

Ah, great, I remembered you being a fan, Consignia. XC2 certainly had crap graphics, I can cut XC:DE some slack as it was based off a wii game from over a decade ago, and it did get a decent polish up. What's really odd is that Xenoblade X on Wii U was a really impressive game, visually. XC2 was a big step backwards in that regard, although from what I've seen, XC3 seems to have much improved animations over XC2.

It's looking less cartoony than XC2, which is pretty good, but hopefully they don't make it too dry without light-hearted bits. You can do it without making a main character a sex pest with his own fuck-bot.

They should elbow those furry twats into a bin entirely. They're not remotely funny or endearing, they just ruin every scene they speak in. What kind of sicko likes them?

[Lungpuddle]

They should elbow those furry twats into a bin entirely. They're not remotely funny or endearing, they just ruin every scene they speak in. What kind of sicko likes them?

Haven't played the game in years, but yeah I remember always being uncomfortable with a Nopon present. Utterly repugnant. Sick, sick, sick.

[oggyraiding]

Playing Future Connected, really interesting how they thought we needed multiple Nopon party members, as well as a Nopon hunting major side quest, as well as replacing Chain Attacks with Nopon based attacks. Feel like they're forcing them to create an "iconic" mascot like SMT's Jack Frost or FF's moogle. I just hate them so much.

[DocDaneeka]

Sounds like some people haven't learned the true meaning of "Blushy Crushy".

[oggyraiding]

After 20 hours of revisiting XC2, I maintain that the acquisition and development of Blades is one of the worst mechanics in JRPG history. Particularly Boreas' affinity shit.

[oggyraiding]

Beat XC2. Bit of a slog in the last couple of chapters, with certain points of progression locked behind fairly high field skills levels, meaning I had to do busywork to level up my Blades' focus and leaping and whatever. Story had an almost Kingdom Hearts/MGS level of twists and excess exposition, but it was mostly very interesting and well done so I enjoyed it. Final boss was horrible, with it wiping the seals I put on it in phase 1 when it enters phase 2, and it having moves that do massive damage to the entire arena, as well as the instant game over move.

With regards to the story:

Spoiler alert

Very Kingdom Hearts/MGS in its massive amount of twists and exposition in the last couple of chapters. The stuff I've read about XC3 say it's going to connect 1 and 2, but 1 and 2 are already connected with the Klaus/Architect/Zanza thing. I feel like they're setting something up with the missing piece of the trinity processor, would be weird to draw attention to it and then do nothing with it. Also I didn't like how they set Torna up as total bastards, but then it turns out Amalthus is a bigger bastard, now Torna are actually nice lads. I was expecting it with Jin, but Akhos was a piece of shit then we're meant to feel bad for him.

[close]

Overall, very good game, just incredibly frustrating at times, and a bit long winded. Now onto Torna.

[Kelvin]

Beat XC2. Bit of a slog in the last couple of chapters, with certain points of progression locked behind fairly high field skills levels, meaning I had to do busywork to level up my Blades' focus and leaping and whatever.

I always remember the bit near the end of the game where you're climbing the World Tree, all the factions fighting each other, a grand finale to the story, then you get to a door than can only be opened if you have a field skill unlocked by eating iced buns with a character on a different continent.

Story had an almost Kingdom Hearts/MGS level of twists and excess exposition, but it was mostly very interesting and well done so I enjoyed it.

In my view, the XC games have good plots and likeable characters, but horrible dialogue. You simply have to tune out the endless exposition and overly-literal exclamations, but the stories themselves are genuinely intriguing. 

The stuff I've read about XC3 say it's going to connect 1 and 2, but 1 and 2 are already connected with...

It's not spelled out in the ending of XC2, but I think the idea is that the XC2 Titans all travel through the rift into the world of the original XC at the end, therefore merging both games. The promotional shots of XC3 clearly show the sword of the Mechonis from XC1 and the big whale Titan from XC2, and you can see races from both games in the trailers, e.g. High Entia from XC1 and Cat People from XC2.

I feel like they're setting something up with the missing piece of the trinity processor, would be weird to draw attention to it and then do nothing with it.

The theories online were that

Spoiler alert

Alvis from XC1

[close]

was the third processor. A bit of a retcon from

Spoiler alert

him being the ship's computer, instead making him more like the Mondado's equivalent of Pyra or Malos.

[close]

I suppose its also possible it will be explored more in the new game.

[oggyraiding]

One thing that I wondered about, was

Spoiler alert

Malos having a Monado when you fight him that one time, and he used Monado Buster and Monado Cyclone.

[close]

With these games I feel like there are so many layers that I'm probably reading into stuff that isn't relevant.

[oggyraiding]

Beat the Torna DLC. I enjoyed it more than the base game, I liked the mechanic of switching between Blade and Driver, and the story was a lot more focused. The penultimate boss fight,

Spoiler alert

against Malos while the mech suits are fighting in the sky

[close]

, was very gimmicky but it was done in a good way. My only major criticism was when you reach one of the two points in the story where you have to do lots of side missions to progress. Most of them were uninteresting, and it felt weird getting desserts for a food critic or testing out wacky inventions while

Spoiler alert

Malos is at the titan's core ready to destroy the world

[close]

. Also I suppose the fight with

Spoiler alert

Gort

[close]

was a bit anticlimactic being put at the very end with no real connection to the main story line.

[oggyraiding]

Reviews out for XC3, not read them beyond the score, so as to avoid spoilers. Sitting at 88 on Metacritic, below the original's 92 (89 for the Definitive Edition), but quite a bit above XC2's 83.

[DocDaneeka]

Got me preorder in. Haven't read much about it, hoping it's mainly Nopon fetch quests.

[Consignia]

I've ordered a physical copy, which I rarely do these days. Not really because I'm desprate for a collector's item, but my Switch's storage and SD card are both near capcity and I don't want to delete any of the digital games on there.

But still pretty excited for it. Really been looking forward to a JRPG to get my teeth into for a while. The last one probably was the XC1 remaster, so bit of continutity there.

[brat-sampson]

Looks fantastic. I think I might go back and finish the first one first though because I never did. I'd like to have a fresh view on it and probably check a recap of 2 then I'll feel ready to jump in, as I do remember feeling I was maybe missing something nearer the end of 2 and apparently 3 connects them both.

[DocDaneeka]

It's pretty good so far, enjoying the story although some of the cut scenes have dragged.

I really like the feeling of being in  big open areas and exploring while avoiding the lvl 80 monsters wandering about.

[Consignia]

I'm enjoying so far too, but by Christ does it bombard you with mechanics. I thought I'd have a decent handle on it because of the previous games, but they've gone and made it more complicated.

As ever, really loving the scale and beauty of the world, but it feels once again too ambitious for the Switch to really handle. Too often I find it goes into a blurry mess. Although, it's pretty spectacular that it plays at all.

[Thursday]

Given this a go, (My first Xenoblade game.) I'm a little bit into chapter 2 now.

Cutscenes are definitely too long, it's not as if I'm not even enjoying the story or characters, but the scenes just aren't very well written, but that's standard JRPG to over-explain everything that's happening. I think the quirk of the localization hiring mostly Brits is helping.

Enjoying the combat enough for now, although it just introduced the mechanic of characters switching classes with each other and I sort of had this feeling of "Oh do I really have to?" And then forces you to switch all of them.

I've not felt any need to use tactics yet, maybe fights would be going faster if I understood them better, but I've rarely struggled and it doesn't seem worth the risk bothering.

[oggyraiding]

Played 23 hours, mid way through Chapter 3. Really liking the world design, you can actually see the scale of it all and where everything relates to each other, which you didn't get in XC2 with its separate maps for each titan. Also it really is huge, every time I go back to the desert area with a new traversal technique it just keeps going and going. Story is probably the most interesting of the XC games, and (so far) doesn't have much of the cringe fanservice that made XC2 embarassing to play. Class changing is both good and bad - good in that it encourages you to mix up play styles, but bad because you're having to fanny about choosing all the skills and arts and accessories for everyone each time you change classes. Main criticism is the combat. I have never enjoyed XC combat, and some of the battles really drag on. Also with six playable characters + one hero, sometimes there's so much shit going on on screen that I get disorientated.

[Thursday]

I know this is standard JRPG shit, but it is absolutely baffling to me the way everyone is shouting their battle moves and things constantly with 6/7 party members it's complete an incoherent mess of noise. Then you have the handful of quips at the end that you're going to hear thousands of times and it just becomes aggravating. It's so fucking strange that this is a thing they decide to do and now it's become standard and everyone just accepts it at this point.

I generally just turn the sound down, but in a bigger battles you want certain audio cues.

Another gripe that isn't really important, it makes absolutely no sense that we're doing sidequests in this game where characters only have a few months to live... Obviously there's fast travel but in reality the characters are... running back to previous to colonies they'd been on the run from for a week and then spending days doing chores and then having to run back to where they were. It just feels very immersion breaking in this game.

Also another odd thing - there's certain sidequests which don't seem to allow you to pull out your map to fast travel for no discernible reason that I can tell.

I'm enjoying it, but man there's been so many little things in this game where I'm narrowing my eyes in puzzlement at little choices the designers/writers make. I don't know how to explain it, it's like it's been made by Aliens. I appreciate I'm diving in to the 3rd game in a series, but this is another level of odd.

[oggyraiding]

45 hours in, I'm getting bored. The class system is a bit shit. I've been switching all my party members' classes whenever they reach rank 10, but have found that their starting classes are already optimal, and the perks of levelling up other classes to do the skill link thing is not hugely worth it. It's not like, for example, Bravely Default, where you can build really interesting/powerful set ups if you're levelling up a variety of classes. Pacing is all over the place, sometimes you have to sit through a cutscene, walk 50m, then there's another cutscene, rinse and repeat.

Spoiler alert

The prison break in/break out is boring. I appreciate doing the menial tasks is to show what the prisoners are subjected to, but it doesn't make for fun or interesting gameplay. And I'm sick of every party member having crises about how they're not cool or strong enough or whatever, I want meaningful progression in the story, I don't want 5 minutes of flashbacks about why Sena is insecure.

[close]

I understand that my criticism could be applied to a lot of JRPGs, but the Xenoblade Chronicles series are even more long winded and glacially paced than your average Final Fantasy or Shin Megami Tensei etc. I will persevere because I want to see how the story develops, there's just a ton of padding to wade through.

[Thursday]

I'm only chapter 4, but it does still seem unnecessarily busy with mechanics. Maybe you can get some interesting effects with it if you really dive into it, and maybe if you were playing on hard mode it might become more needed, but playing on Normal and just doing moderate amounts of exploring and sidequests means you'll be overlevelled and will brute force anything anyway.

I have died on the major bosses that I was a few levels above, but that's because I wasn't expecting it, and went in with a bad balance of low level of classes and hadn't re-equipped people with accessories and gems and arts and things. Really just want to be able to skip the grind. As you say, standard for JRPG's but particularly excessive here.

[Kelvin]

I started this a couple of days ago, only about an hour in, if that. Just hope it stays ugly and brown!

[oggyraiding]

Spoiler: Story events up to the beginning of Chapter 6.

Spoiler alert

Was the twist of N and M being Noah and Mio meant to be so obvious? I think the first time we saw N's face, it was apparent it was an adult Noah. And he has the same gimmick of big sword actually being a sheathe for a katana. When the party realises the situation, I'd already known it for 30 hours or so. Don't think I'm showing off for predicting the twist in a stereotypically overwrought JRPG story, I just need to know if the twist was meant to shock me, or if it was so obvious intentionally.

[close]

[oggyraiding]

Finished it. Very sweet ending. Worth the 75 hours to get that resolution.

However...

The last 3 hours are terrible. The final dungeon is boring and unfun, and the final boss has a ridiculous amount of stages and gimmicks that it takes like 40 minutes and it is boring the whole time. Thematically it was solid, kind of had a Persona true villain feel to the villain's motivations and nature and stuff. But as the boss fight stages progressed, I wasn't thinking "what a tense conclusion to a thrilling game", I was thinking "if I die now and have to repeat the last 30 minutes I will throw my Switch out the window". I think Xenoblade combat is shit in all the games, so it says a lot about the exploration and narrative that I'm willing to spend over 3 days fighting hundreds of battles with that shit combat.

[Kelvin]

I'm currently about 6-7 hours into it, somewhere in the desert area. Very mixed feelings about it, but also want to give it more time, as a) I know its a long game, and b) I remember finding Xenoblade 2 a little disappointing for the first few hours.

It's definitely not wowing me visually like the previous games, though. I know the idea is that you're re-visting areas from previous Xenoblade games, but its just not as visually exciting to see the petrified remains of some fingers in a desert as it was seeing a huge metal hand in the middle of a tropical paradise.

I know you do have to stick with the games a bit, and I ended up loving 1, 2 and X at different points and for different reasons. But I'm definitely finding Xenoblade 3 to be the slowest and most unengaging at the start. I don't think the contrived "everyone's been hypnotised to hate us" stuff helps.

[Consignia]

OK, I think I'm done with this game now. 90 odd hours, all hero + assencion quests, a good chunk of the side quests and unique monsters. Might drop back in over the next couple days to see if I feel like mopping a few more monsters or blank spots on the map. Overall, a fun but flawed experience.

The Good

• The gameplay is completely streamlined, every time I got nostalgic for a previous entry a remembered all the tedious shit in comparison
• Once the combat opens up, it's actually pretty fun. It feels you get rammed to the gullet with tutorials and systems but they are best ignored and learnt as you go
• The world is big and beautiful. I enjoyed going off the critical path and finding compleltely unique locales
• The side stories were great, especially some of the hero quests which tie up plots threads introduced in the main story

The Bad

• The story I felt a bit unsatisfying. I think the pacing is too uneven, too much faffing about in the earlier chapters, a couple of big events, and then you are in the final boss's dungeon. I don't think it connects the previous games nearly as well as sold. Just glad I can sack off the main plot at times and engage in cooking comptetions and the like (just like in Yakuza games)
• Despite the scale of the world, it also feels a bit.. safe. The first game had people living on two massive monsters having a barney. The second was on and inside some crazy beasts, which made for some brillaintly weird locals. Here, it's just a continent. And with few actual settlements, it doesn't really feel occupied.
• The character designs have been rowed back a bit too much and feel more bland. I can see why people want the excesses of the second game toned down, but I think they went a little too far the other way here.
• Seven party members in your team at a time. BLIMEY, this can get confusing. It doesn't help there's so many class options that mean you spend more time in menus reading and less time having doing actual game things.

The Ugly

• The Graphics. I'm beating a dead horse with this one, but the game is beautiful and vast despite the awful graphics. Not a slight on the devs, really. It's just a tad too ambitious for the current Switch hardware.

I'm 50/50 on getting the DLC. I wouldn't mind spending a bit more time in the world, but I guess I don't have to make that choice just yet.

[Kelvin]

EDIT

[Kelvin]

I've been holding off on writing too much about the game, as I'm still only at chapter 5 and up until a few hours ago it was still introducing so many mechanics that I didn't feel I had given it enough time. However, with @Consignia's post above touching on so many of my own thoughts, and the game itself greatly cutting back on tutotials/new mechanics in chapter 4, I feel like I can speak to it a bit more fairly now.

The gameplay is completely streamlined, every time I got nostalgic for a previous entry a remembered all the tedious shit in comparison

Definitely. Despite the number of mechanics, things like heroes, skill trees, side quests, and even exploration are greatly refined over previous entries. Side quests are especially improved; the little collectopedia cards you complete are so much better than the typical collectathons you get in these types of game, and there's just generally less filler overall.

Bonus XP is great too. Completely removes grinding - you can play at the level of the area you're in, or use your bonus XP to bump you up a few levels when you get stuck. An absolute must for all Xenoblade games moving forward.     

Once the combat opens up, it's actually pretty fun. It feels you get rammed to the gullet with tutorials and systems but they are best ignored and learnt as you go

Absolutely. As with every Xenoblade game, the combat starts slow, confusing and cluttered with tutorials, but around the half-way mark develops into something deeply satisfying and unique. I do think XC3 has lost its way a bit, though - positioning feels completely irrelevant later in the game, as other mechanics are so much more powerful and/or useful, and although I like flicking between characters quickly to charge up their fusion arts and carry out a level 3 interlinked chain attack, I'm generally not putting anywhere near as much thought into the moves I choose now, because my priority is fusion arts, not a chain combo like in previous games. There's less strategy overall, and combined with the new class mechanic, no real reason to change arts/builds for a character. I did that a lot in the older games, because it made such a difference. Whereas here it feels irrelevant.   

Classes I'm mixed on. I like the fact it encourages you to try new styles, and it keep the characters varied, as they never play the same way for too long. But on the other hand, I still don't think it gives you enough reason to learn the moves or benefits of a class, because - as stated above - the fusion arts, character swapping, and interlinking/chain combos are so easy to pull off that there's no real need to learn the benefits of one class or one character.

It's a mixed bag overall, the combat. Interesting and ambitious as usual, but unbalanced and probably a bit too easy now.   

The story I felt a bit unsatisfying. I think the pacing is too uneven, too much faffing about in the earlier chapters, a couple of big events, and then you are in the final boss's dungeon.

I'm only at chapter 5, but this is my biggest problem with the game, and the reason why, at least currently, it's my least favourite in the series. The story just feels very one note compared to previous entries. The war seems virtually non-existent after the opening; a few occasional skirmishes, lots of talking, but very little in the way of tension or stakes until chapter 4, around 30 hours in.

There's also very little of the factional politics that I liked about previous entries. The two nations aren't at war over political differences, but to fill up their flame clocks. And with mind control (and other similar contrivances) providing a lot of the motivations early on, it robs the situation of any interpersonal tensions.   

I also have no idea why these silly cunts care so much about their flame clocks. If it wasn't tied to their own lifeforce why were they unquestioningly going to war to keep it filled up, and why does destroying it suddenly free them to grow potatoes? This is a key plot point of the story, and I honestly have no idea why it matters to anyone. Noah wrecking the clocks seems about as pointless a gesture as a guy knocking on your door and tearing up your council tax bills, saying, "Ah, now you are free! Haha!" But how does destroying the clock itself set them free; their governments didn't magically disappear! It's a stupid, flawed concept at the very heart of the plot.     

Overall, I just think the story lacks tension or surprises. Like XC1, it's a story of characters crossing the world on a quest, but unlike XC1, it lacks any interesting twists or complications along the way. And the Consuls seem like total idiots compared to the threats in other games.

I like the characters, and I'm more engaged after some of the stuff I learned in chapter 4, but that's over half the game I played with very little to pull me forward. 

The Graphics. I'm beating a dead horse with this one, but the game is beautiful and vast despite the awful graphics. Not a slight on the devs, really. It's just a tad too ambitious for the current Switch hardware.

I don't think the graphics are awful, but I do think the environments are much less interesting, less memorable, and much more desolate. I know its meant to be a war-torn continent, but so many of the areas are just rocky outcrops, with overcast skies. Previous games always had such interesting, beautiful landscapes, with iconic, eye-catching imagery, like a giant hand, or arcing ridges, or a city in a stomach... whereas here, the graphics are better, but the world design feels so much messier, cluttered and unremarkable. Not bad, but certainly not on the same level as the previous games.     

Anyway, I am enjoying it a lot more now, I think around chapter 4 things started to pick up, with higher stakes in the story and more fleshed out combat options. Mechanically it's not a bad game, but they do need to strip back some of the clutter they've built up over the series before the next game.