The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom

[thelittlemango]

the game is just so, so fucking difficult, everything hits so hard. i am liking it though. i think playing stuff like Immortals (which is basically BOTW but baby mode) has helped me to get some kind of footing.

Are you playing it on a high difficulty? I've heard a few complaints about BOTW but never heard people talking about it being particularly hard before. I guess the survival elements can be tricky in certain terrains and take a bit of grinding to get what you need to make them comfortable but the game itself seemed to be fairly generous with weapons, health etc.

With dungeons I love the puzzle elements (although I'm glad they moved away from 2D as they got a bit repetitive with various push/pull, put thing on switch to open door puzzles), it's just the actual aesthetic of dungeons, with all of the creativity Nintendo posses the last thing I want to do after playing years and years of games is be back in another dark, gloomy, torch-lit, brown-hued dungeon for hours on end, would like them a lot more if they switched up the scenery/locations but kept the puzzles in place.

[Roxy Robinson]

The game's easy and much more fun (and illuminating) if you make use of the abilities and environment and so on. If you treat it as a third-person melee combat game, yeah, it's somewhat difficult at first.

[madhair60]

the issue is that BOTW is talked up as a fully-open go-anywhere-you-like game but the reality is that if you do that you will just get caned repeatedly, you need to very specifically follow the linear waypoints until you have enough health and armour to fuck around. there's nothing wrong with that, but no cunt will admit it because it sounds like a criticism of the "unparalelled freedom of this unique open world", as every cunt has been saying for six years.

[thelittlemango]

the issue is that BOTW is talked up as a fully-open go-anywhere-you-like game but the reality is that if you do that you will just get caned repeatedly, you need to very specifically follow the linear waypoints until you have enough health and armour to fuck around. there's nothing wrong with that, but no cunt will admit it because it sounds like a criticism of the "unparalelled freedom of this unique open world", as every cunt has been saying for six years.

I don't think meeting challenges beyond your current level mean it's not free though? It has freedom in the sense that you can climb up a snowy mountain and freeze to death while getting battered by a much stronger enemy if you want, it's just that once that happens for the first time you might be more prepared next time or think of a strategy to avoid it, freedom doesn't mean the right to wander anywhere without consequence.

[Pink Gregory]

There are different levels of challenge in different areas but running away or through is almost always an option, usually you can come away with a few spirit orbs/koroks and treasure for your trouble without even getting in a fight. 

[Replies From View]

Tears of the Paper

[madhair60]

I don't think meeting challenges beyond your current level mean it's not free though? It has freedom in the sense that you can climb up a snowy mountain and freeze to death while getting battered by a much stronger enemy if you want, it's just that once that happens for the first time you might be more prepared next time or think of a strategy to avoid it, freedom doesn't mean the right to wander anywhere without consequence.

you basically can't do anything unless you visit specific waypoints in a specific order. you're helpless for many many hours. I don't think this is a controversial point

[Roxy Robinson]

the issue is that BOTW is talked up as a fully-open go-anywhere-you-like game but the reality is that if you do that you will just get caned repeatedly, you need to very specifically follow the linear waypoints until you have enough health and armour to fuck around.

I think you can get max health and stamina without doing anything on the linear path.

Also, I don't know whether you skipped the tutorial but one good tip is if you press jump when an enemy attacks, you are 'invincible'. Or, you can just tap shield at the right time and you can easily parry anything. I missed those tips first time so hopefully that will help. I tried to play it like Hyrule Warriors for a bit and it was really difficult.

[Roxy Robinson]

you basically can't do anything unless you visit specific waypoints in a specific order. you're helpless for many many hours. I don't think this is a controversial point

What do you mean by 'do anything'?

What are these specific waypoints?

These aren't confrontational questions, I'm just checking my own memory which is very different.

If you're still stuck on the Great Plateau, you can download a save file. The game gets much better after that.

[thelittlemango]

What do you mean by 'do anything'?

What are these specific waypoints?

These aren't confrontational questions, I'm just checking my own memory which is very different.

If you're still stuck on the Great Plateau, you can download a save file. The game gets much better after that.

I don't remember this either, obviously there are the bosses which unlock special abilities but they're not essential and I don't remember anything else stopping you doing "anything". You can grab weapons, branches, food and fire for warmth from the off and boost your health by going to whichever shrines you encounter on your way. As Roxy said, I'm guessing you mean being stuck on the great plateau?

[madhair60]

no it's not the plateau. you get off the plateau and you go north, you get one-shotted. you go south, you get one-shotted. everywhere you go you will just die unless you go to the waypoint marked on the map and visit the village, kakariko, to get armour etc. you cannot explore until you are significantly more powerful, which means hours of linearity...

[Roxy Robinson]

That's not my experience. I completely missed Kakariko for about fifty hours. I just ignored the old guy.

You can easily avoid direct combat by using the environment, the abilities and creative endeavour. That's a strength of the game, in my opinion. It felt a bit like MGSV for a good while.

I just legged it round the map for ages doing shrines and climbing towers, battering baddies with rocks and traps and the like. Didn't do any Beasts for ages. By the time I got to Kak, I was dyeing my sick clobber I'd got from a load of other places and I had two stamina wheels.

[madhair60]

you didn't go to the waypoint brightly lit on the map for 50 hours? chinny.

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Is it worth playing this if you have already completed links awakening, the original black and white version

[thelittlemango]

Is it worth playing this if you have already completed links awakening, the original black and white version

No, it's like that one but without dungeons.

[Roxy Robinson]

you didn't go to the waypoint brightly lit on the map for 50 hours? chinny.

Probably something like that, give or take ten hours. I just kept going and going and finding new places. It's one of my happiest memories of the game.

I think I played about ninety hours mostly just running around exploring and experimenting and then thirty hours doing the beasts, mopping up puzzle quests and Ganon.

It also takes about an hour to get to and past Kakariko. Again, what is essential about it in your mind? What can you not do otherwise?

I think you'll find the answer is nothing more than loosening your psychological chains. But you are already free to enjoy yourself.

[Pink Gregory]

Probably something like that, give or take ten hours. I just kept going and going and finding new places. It's one of my happiest memories of the game.

I think I played about ninety hours mostly just running around exploring and experimenting and then thirty hours doing the beasts, mopping up puzzle quests and Ganon.

It also takes about an hour to get to and past Kakariko. Again, what is essential about it in your mind? What can you not do otherwise?

I think you'll find the answer is nothing more than loosening your psychological chains. But you are already free to enjoy yourself.

did Zelda's memories activate or did that only happen after talking to Impa?

[Timothy]

no it's not the plateau. you get off the plateau and you go north, you get one-shotted. you go south, you get one-shotted. everywhere you go you will just die unless you go to the waypoint marked on the map and visit the village, kakariko, to get armour etc. you cannot explore until you are significantly more powerful, which means hours of linearity...

I had the same mindset and really disliked the game. Then I decided to start over, just try to forget about processing and just tried to lose myself in the world. Discover a shrine here and there, open a chest. Forget about the waypoints and missions. Don't try too engage too much with monsters and Boboklins until it feels you have a bit more health and such. I enjoyed it a lot more after that.

I still think the story and the Divine Beast dungeons were quite crap but wandering around Hyrule, just climbing mountains and doing those Shrine puzzles etc was quite fun. Don't worry too much about progress and focus on exploring, it's way more fun that way.

[Roxy Robinson]

did Zelda's memories activate or did that only happen after talking to Impa?

Good question, I didn't do any of that stuff except accidentally. I actually did the memories after beating Ganon, just mopping up. May be a false memory but I think I got a slightly different ending after doing them and beating Ganon again.

[RetroRobot]

I'm not even saying I hate BotW but I've played a ubisoft game before so it isn't really that novel to me

[Roxy Robinson]

Same but The Legend of Zelda.

[Thursday]

no it's not the plateau. you get off the plateau and you go north, you get one-shotted. you go south, you get one-shotted. everywhere you go you will just die unless you go to the waypoint marked on the map and visit the village, kakariko, to get armour etc. you cannot explore until you are significantly more powerful, which means hours of linearity...

Are you playing on Master Mode or something? If you try and go to the very furthest parts of the map maybe, but this sounds very odd to me.

[Pink Gregory]

I'm not even saying I hate BotW but I've played a ubisoft game before so it isn't really that novel to me

i was taking a break from BOTW but I'm going to pick it up again tonight purely to spite you

[Kelvin]

no it's not the plateau. you get off the plateau and you go north, you get one-shotted. you go south, you get one-shotted. everywhere you go you will just die unless you go to the waypoint marked on the map and visit the village, kakariko, to get armour etc. you cannot explore until you are significantly more powerful, which means hours of linearity...

The enemies don't level up for ages, so how can you be getting one-shotted by red and blue bokoblins and your basic lizalfos? Those populate most areas in any direction. Tougher enemies like the rock monsters, cyclops and lynels exist, but that's your incentive to get orbs and hearts, find better weapons and get creative. The only areas that are really hard early on are the desert and the area around the castle. If you're doing shrines and getting hearts you should be fine in most other areas. Plus, I'm not sure it is linear to go to Kakariko first, when I bet all of us took different, convoluted, round-about routes to get there. I arrived over the hills at the back and exited via the "entrance", its not a "linear" experience, even if you do follow those nudging waypoints.   

[Dickie_Anders]

The game fairly early on teaches you that it's as legitimate to use stealth/evasion as it is to fight enemies directly, so I never got the sense that I wasn't allowed to go where I wanted because the enemies in some directions were stronger than elsewhere, I just hid and ran away from them

My memory is that early on almost all enemies are fairly strong and can come close to two-hitting you, which is why it feels rewarding to slowly gain health points so that it isn't so much of an issue later

[Kelvin]

The game definitely has a weird difficulty curve, with a very high challenge at the start, then a low difficulty level from the point you have a bunch of hearts and health potions. But that's not reliant on visiting kakariko, its reliant on earning hearts, finding weapons, making potions, all of which can be done in any direction. It's just a hard game at the start, regardless of which area you explore first.   

[AzureSky]

I agree it is difficult at first. First time I played Master Mode it felt impossible so I 'cheated' and got Majora's Mask. But then I was determined to do it properly and you do end up running from almost everything for a long time until you have a chance to build yourself up, but it's all doable.

I persevered and even finally managed to complete the Master Trials in MM which took me forever to do. Has anyone done 'straight to Ganon' in MM? I couldn't get past Thunderblight phase 2 and gave up last year.

However good TOTK is - and it looks phenomenal to me - I just can't see it surpassing the overall affect BOTW has had on me, or by any other game in the future, for that matter.

[Johnny Textface]

I know someone who also finds BOTW quite a difficult game. It seemed to get the challenge just right for me. I experimented with cooking quite early so quickly realised certain combinations will help in some environments. He said he just kept going into snow and dying.

He really wants to like it so goes back again and again. Gets stuck and gives up. I always found it peculiar as the freedom the game gives you makes it feel easier than most Zelda games, to me.

Another mate who loved it didn't really bother cooking and just ate apples for the most part.

I've played it for almost 300 hours and still not got around to finishing it lol

[Kelvin]

I do think TotK is going to be extremely divisive for a lot of people. BotW really did seem to click with a very broad audience, I've never known a game that so engrossed the non-gamers in my life. Little kids, teenagers, people who haven't played games before or in years. I've known three people who bought switches just because of a few hours playing it on mine. I assume a combination of the open-endedness, the stripped back simplicity and it's overall relaxing vibe made it a good game for people who would find other games stressful. But I very much doubt the new game's building mechanics - however stripped back - are going to have the same broad appeal. 

[Dickie_Anders]

Just watched the video and it looks amazing imo. Just the idea of slowly scaling upside-down asian temples floating in the sky has sold me on it, the mad abilities are a bonus. BotW at its best felt like you were moving through an immense serene dreamscape and this looks like it has pushed that to the nth degree

Only problem is I haven't got a Switch now. Legitimately might buy one for this