Canadian telly's lack of impact in Britain

[George White]

I was just thinking about this about how unlike with Aussie telly, where seemingly every soap, cop show, kids show yet only one or two sitcoms/sketch shows, Canadian telly, despite being a prolific market in English has never quite crossed over.

Ask a Brit 'name a Canadian TV show', and you might get Due South or Degrassi, Schitt's Creek or Murdoch Mysteries, or the Raccoons, and probably some all-US shows shot in Vancouver, but chances are if they saw any Canadian show, they might think them American - the aimed at US syndication cross-breeds of Friday the 13th the Series, War of the Worlds, Highlander, Night Heat, Counterstrike, or various Nelvana/Cinar cartoons...

If Canadian shows were aired, they'd either be kids filler (from the Forest Rangers, Beachcombers, Degrassi, Adventures in Rainbow Country, Seaway, Ritter's Cove, Danger Bay, the Odyssey, and from CTV - Swiss Family Robinson and from Global - Matt and Jenny, plus Huckleberry Finn and Friends) or stuff in late night (the Collaborators, the Z Cars spinoff/remake Sidestreet, various single plays slung out to ITV regions as Fireside Theatre, and a few eps of early Global-era regional four-figure budget SCTV aired on Granada as the erroneously billed 'Second City Revue from Chicago' (sic)).
Due South was a hit, but even that was mostly set in a Chicago that looked like Toronto (when it wasn't, it was set in a Toronto that looked like Chicago).
 The BBC did air a few prestige dramas like the CBC series the National Dream (about the Pacific Railway) and Empire Inc (the story of a tyrannical Scottish business tycoon in turn of the century Quebec, that was pitched as Brideshead-meets-Dallas, if that sounds like Brass without the jokes, well, that's what the UK critics said - ironically, star Kenneth Welsh later played Truman opposite Tim West's Churchill).  and US-style miniseries like Love and Hate - the Story of Colin and Joanne Thatcher and

Why do we think it?
The reputation of Canadian TV as cheap old rubbish could equally apply to Australia. When Thames (for a six figure sum) bought the CBC's attempt to do a big BBC-style period epic, the Whiteoaks of Jalna (which the CBC franchise in Windsor were vetoed to show, in the fear that people in Detroit would see it, spoiling a US sale - a US sale that nevertheless never happened), it was described by Nancy Banks-Smith as Canadian Crossroads. Canada have tried a few soaps, never that successful, with Coronation Street being the most popular one out there , weirdly.

Having watched a few Canadian shows of the Eighventies which look like British shows, all on VT albeit on NTSC, and they are quite Acorn Antiques. A Gift to Last, a slushy period drama set in turn of the century Canada was picked up by RTE, always willing to buy anything from the Great White North but not by any British station, and The Great Detective, intended as a vehicle for Iain Cuthbertson until the Canadian actors' union ACTRA intervened, which is like a Canadian version of Sgt. Cork or Cribb. Like Uncanny Valley British TV. 
 By the late 70s, British TV, once commonplace on CBC and other channels was no longer thus, Canadian content no longer meaning merely stuff from the Commonwealth - and you tend to notice, runs of British shows for one or two seasons on CBC and then dropped - Secret Army, All Creatures, Man at the Top, Grange Hill, even) or shunted into late night slots for expats (Minder), and these Canadian shows feel like 'we got British TV at home'...

[BJBMK2]

Trailer Park Boys is pretty big in Ireland, I'm told.

[George White]

Really? I've found dvd box sets in CEX, but I'm not sure I've ever heard people chat about it.
I don't think it was shown on TV here (although Canada has always been a raiding ground for Telly Eireann, including the odd copro like Random Passage, then both CBC and RTE's most expensive drama, about the first Newfies, with Colm Meaney, one of those RTE shows that C5 would buy and label as 'an original').

[BJBMK2]

I could be talking out of my arse tbf. I'm not from Ireland, I've based that entirely on long forgotten articles I've glanced at, and at the fact they did one of there Netflix live shows in Dublin.

[The Culture Bunker]

Remember watching a few episodes of a show called 'Republic of Doyle' that was on one of those obscure channels. It was alright, I guess.

Used to watch 'Corner Gas' when it was on Amazon, think we got to the third series before they took it off.

[George White]

I'd say there is an audience for it but probably amongst Culchies - Hardy Bucks is essentially an Irish version. From what I've seen, there are stuff that feels very close to home (the Rita McNeill bit, Working Man was a no 8 hit in Ireland, as opposed to no 11 in UK - again because we love that kind of shite).

Republic of Doyle  weirdly never got picked up by RTE or TV3, despite having Sean McGinley (one of those guys who always hear lads here going, 'why isn't he a bigger star? He's been in everything but he never quite rose to a Gleeson or even a Cunningham or Hinds).


RE:stuff set in Newfoundland, has anyone ever seen CODCO, long-running CBC sketch show for a Newfie comedy troupe. Was aired in the same comedy hour slot as The Kids in the Hall on the CBC, but although there were attempts to sell it to Britain, it never got picked up. Some of it sounds quite appealing (apparently, the big controversy was over a sketch about Irish priests, after the revelations of the Irish Christian Brothers' 'wonderment' at Mount Cashel.

Yes, I can see why Telly Eireann never bought this. They refused to show the Mount Cashel miniseries the Boys of St. Vincent, claiming that because Channel 4 had shown it, then that Irish people interested in such things would have seen it, presumably forgetting not only two-channel land but the many Irish people who could only get S4C, and then after the various exposes on the industrial schools, they basically went, 'Alright, we will' and showed the series.

Weird to see an 'Oirish' comedy sketch where the accents sound authentic. That's Newfies for you.

[Psybro]

I bloody loved ReBoot, me.

[The Culture Bunker]

Checked after a vague memory resurfaced and, yep, 'The Raccoons' was Canadian. That was a big show for those my age.

[George White]

I used to have a ReBoot eggcup.

The Raccoons are Canada's cartoon icons.
Aired on CBC in primetime, weirdly (so did the weird Ryan Reynolds-starring C4 dystopia Odyssey - because of budgeting, I believe).

[Magnum Valentino]

Aye I know a lot of comedy fans and friend groups here in Northern Ireland that love Trailer Park Boys.

Isn't it said that it's directly responsible for the conception of Hardy Bucks?

[Gurke and Hare]

Didn't Corner Gas get a showing here a few years ago? If that was ten years older it would have been a shoo-in for Friday night on Channel Four.

[Glebe]

[George White]

The most popular Canadian drama of its era so maybe that answers the question. Their Emmerdale or Glenroe.
A staple of RTE.
In the UK, it was a frequent ITV filler, but I don't think UK people (Tim Worthington's pretty derisive of it, always writing it off) have the same affection as people from 2 channel land.

[Glebe]

The Beachcombers was referenced once when I was mocked in school for having long hair!

[studpuppet]

Ahem...

[George White]

Yes, but it was a YTV (the Canadian kids TV network not Yorkshire)/CITV coproduction and I believe most of the production was CITV.
YTV just bought loads of British telly. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_programs_broadcast_by_YTV

[Mr Banlon]

I remember Beachcombers being on Sundays, either just before, or just after Weekend World. Looked like it was filmed through a dirty screen door.

[George White]

I remember Beachcombers being on Sundays, either just before, or just after Weekend World. Looked like it was filmed through a dirty screen door.

Well, it was shot entirely on film at a time when most CBC shows were still VT/film mix.
So it would have been cheap/dodgy 16mm.

[centristmelt]

The original "Run with Us" from The Raccoons is still not on Spotify!

[Theoretical Dentist]

I didn't know The Raccoons or ReBoot were Canadian, but yeah, they seemed fairly big when I was a kid.

More recently there's been Cardinal – I don't know how many people watched it in the UK but all four series were shown so I guess it wasn't a flop. Interestingly (possibly) it was shown in the BBC Four Saturday night slot usually filled by Nordic noirs and other foreign-language dramas, despite being in English. (Have any French-language Canadian shows been broadcast in the UK?)

Orphan Black was a co-production between BBC America and the Canadian channel Space, and shown in the UK on BBC Three as an import. It had one of those weird generic North American settings, filmed in Canada and I think it was semi-open about being set there, I don't think it ever mentioned Toronto by name but did mention some more obscure places in the greater Toronto area, and I think some details like police ranks were more American than Canadian.

[Steven88]

Most of the sitcoms i've recently go into have been Canadian. Trailer Park Boys, Schitt's Creek, Corner Gas, Letterkenny and Kim's Convenience.

[George White]

I didn't know The Raccoons or ReBoot were Canadian, but yeah, they seemed fairly big when I was a kid.

More recently there's been Cardinal – I don't know how many people watched it in the UK but all four series were shown so I guess it wasn't a flop. Interestingly (possibly) it was shown in the BBC Four Saturday night slot usually filled by Nordic noirs and other foreign-language dramas, despite being in English. (Have any French-language Canadian shows been broadcast in the UK?)

Orphan Black was a co-production between BBC America and the Canadian channel Space, and shown in the UK on BBC Three as an import. It had one of those weird generic North American settings, filmed in Canada and I think it was semi-open about being set there, I don't think it ever mentioned Toronto by name but did mention some more obscure places in the greater Toronto area, and I think some details like police ranks were more American than Canadian.

RE:Quebecois shows being shown in Britain, I was curious if the 80s miniseries, the Plouffe Family was, at the time the most expensive TV production made in Canada, released abroad as a 3 hour film, a remake of a 50s Quebecois telenovela or teleroman. Got a single showing at the NFT, supported by an ep of beloved Canadian sitcom King of Kensington.

[sevendaughters]

Sharky and George was French Canadian, I enjoyed that.

Canada's lack of visual arts impact really, they are a young country with a relatively small population that is internally fractured between Anglo, Franco, and First Nations. They're also stuck between UK and US in terms of sensibility, which means exporting is a bit more difficult and they experience a permanent talent drain.

Corner Gas is a great example - looks kinda American, but as said above, has this low key UK early 90s late night humour. Here's the first scene. Maybe it doesn't help that Brent Butt looks like a Canadian dad?

[Robot DeNiro]

The Littlest Hobo was Canadian.

[George White]

Orphan Black was a co-production between BBC America and the Canadian channel Space, and shown in the UK on BBC Three as an import. It had one of those weird generic North American settings, filmed in Canada and I think it was semi-open about being set there, I don't think it ever mentioned Toronto by name but did mention some more obscure places in the greater Toronto area, and I think some details like police ranks were more American than Canadian.

Known on TVTropes as Canada does not Exist.
The pioneering example being CBS/CTV copro Night Heat set in a generic Northeast city somewhere in the vicinity of Niagara Falls, with badges that weren't quite eagles or beavers.

Then Highlander the Series had 'Seacouver, WA', at least trying to say it's America, while the series was also a German-French-Italian copro with a mostly British cast.


Yep, that's the thing, being stuck in the middle. I think I once described Australian exploitation films from the 70s/80s as 'looking American but feeling British', with a lot of Canadian films from the same era, especially those shot
in old Toronto or Montreal, they 'look British but feel American'.

See, as I said, it seems that Canadian TV until about the dawn of colour is basically lots of British stuff. The Forsyte Saga, Dr. Finlay's Casebook and Hancock's Half Hour (both of those as daytime filler), Z Cars, some early Hartnell Dr Whos, variety specials for the Seekers, obviously ITC stuff aimed at the international market (I see Dial 999 was still being shown into the mid-60s, a series about a Canadian mountie in London). TBH it's less than I expected, but I suppose wiping/telerecording costs are part of that. Weeks pass by without more than or two British series. It seems that British films were far more commonplace than British TV.

CTV are showing the Avengers (VT-era), Maigret, Thunderbirds, Fireball XL5, etc.

You often find that CBC will pick up the Professionals or Minder, often in late night slots (much annoyance in Calgary when Nigel Havers period rammel  A Horseman Riding by airs at 1.45am) and then just show one or two series. See also the Onedin Line, Colditz, Secret Army, All Creatures.
Seems that the most succcessful runs were  short-run shows like Fawlty Towers and miniseries (Elizabeth R, Forsyte Saga, Henry VIII, Edward the Seventh and Edward and Mrs. Simpson (though those were in the US, syndicated before going to PBS), Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy and Brideshead Revisisted. It does seem by the 80s, Granada is the main supplier of British shows -  The Jewel in the Crown, Lost Empires, First Among Equals, Game, Set and Match and of course, that daytime staple -Coronation Street. Channel 4 dramas too - the Camomile Lawn, Tusitala (an Aussie copro), GBH, A Very British Coup all get CBC time.

Also you do get weird kids shows - just noticed Just William got shown on CBC mornings in the late 70s. The Lost Islands (Aussie but...) was shown for a bit, Barbapapa (BBC-distributed internatioanlly), and for a few years in the early 80s, Grange Hill, which surely must have influenced Degrassi.


The Two Ronnies does seem to have prospered, bizarrely for a few years, though.

Surprised that Dixon of Dock Green, Steptoe and Son never got shown. The films of Porridge, Steptoe and Dad's Army got releases, but not the series.


Yes, I forgot to put the Littlest Hobo, even though it's a perennial of my newspaper searches, but that was CTV. And yet that's a perfect example - because it was shot on dreary OB VT.

I wasn't surprised when I saw Dick Emery having a run on CBC, considering he later made a film there, Find the Lady with Peter Cook, Mickey Rooney and a nascent John Candy.

Reminded that HTV with Global in Canada (the third network, initially a Toronto regional station with delusions of grandeur) did a version of A Child's Christmas in Wales.

Anyone ever watched Wayne and Shuster, Canada's Morecambe and Wise, and a fixture of early Channel 4?

Reminded of an unusual BBC/Canadian copro - Songs of a Sourdough, filmed in Canada, starring Fulton Mackay as writer Robert Service, with a mix of Canadian faces like Gordon Pinsent, Barry Morse(dual citizen but...) and Gary Reineke, and Rentayanks like John Ratzenberger and Canadian-born Tony Sibbald. Shown on BBC Schools.

Just remembered that despite being shown by the BBC and with Time-Life involvement, the Malcolm Muggeridge series A Third Testament was made by the CBC.

Found a 1975 CBC season announcemtn - BBC shows include Python and Complete Victor Borge, plus Vision On - ITV shows the Flaxton Boys, Upstairs Downstairs and Black Beauty. Vision On was a CBC/BBC copro.

[Alberon]

Doctor Who had some Canadian money in it when it returned in 2005. IIRC, it was from Canada that the leak of the first episode occured.

[George White]

Yes, but by the 2000s, a lot of BBC stuff was Canadian cofinanced.
But as I said before, like in the 60s, the CBC dropped it after one or two series.

[dissolute ocelot]

Others have mentioned kids TV shows, but there's definitely been a lot of quirky kids shows, albeit mainly coproductions, and teen/youth-oriented shows like Clone High and the Total Drama franchise. Other kids co-productions (almost everything seems to have been made with an international partner) coming to mind include Ed, Edd and Eddy, Angela Anaconda, Johnny Test, and Atomic Betty. Also, shows like stuff like Arthur which some people seem to really like but I've never got into, and the 90s Rupert Bear, but sources suggest Canada also made or co-made Bill and Ted and Robocop cartoons. 

I think one reason for lack of impact is that Canadian material mixes so much with US material, thanks to co-productions and a lot of shows made in Canada but set in the US, making it very hard to discern their origin.

A lot of the kids' animation was done in both English and French versions, but that's harder with other genres.

[George White]

Others have mentioned kids TV shows, but there's definitely been a lot of quirky kids shows, albeit mainly coproductions, and teen/youth-oriented shows like Clone High and the Total Drama franchise. Other kids co-productions (almost everything seems to have been made with an international partner) coming to mind include Ed, Edd and Eddy, Angela Anaconda, Johnny Test, and Atomic Betty. Also, shows like stuff like Arthur which some people seem to really like but I've never got into, and the 90s Rupert Bear, but sources suggest Canada also made or co-made Bill and Ted and Robocop cartoons. 

I think one reason for lack of impact is that Canadian material mixes so much with US material, thanks to co-productions and a lot of shows made in Canada but set in the US, making it very hard to discern their origin.

A lot of the kids' animation was done in both English and French versions, but that's harder with other genres.

YTV,  Family channel and companies like Nelvana and Cinar are why.

[boki]

DIC made quite the impression in the 80s.

_{I am a 49 year old child, yes.}