Cook'd and Bomb'd

Forums => Oscillations => Topic started by: Sebastian Cobb on May 29, 2021, 06:14:32 PM

Title: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Sebastian Cobb on May 29, 2021, 06:14:32 PM
The track that prompted me to make this is a Bamboos cover of Ride on Time (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_oi1yDAAA8) that's doing the rounds at the moment. I honestly can't make my mind up.

The LP is good and The Bamoos are a great bunch of lads in general, but I don't know, I just don't know.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Dusty Substance on May 30, 2021, 07:08:08 PM

First time I've heard this and I like it.

Can totally see why you're in two minds about this cover but it sure works for me. These kinds of covers can very easily turn into overwhelming "WE'RE A PROPER BAND COVERING A POP SONG AREN'T WE QUIRKY" but The Bamboos seem to appreciate the Black Box OG. Kind of reminds of what Mark Ronson did in the late 00s.

I remember being a little wary when someone told me that Tame Impala had covered The Blueboy's Remember Me (one of my absolute favourites) but they give it a unique enough spin to make it their own: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQkRzLSo4-k (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQkRzLSo4-k)

Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: timebug on May 31, 2021, 09:31:37 AM
I always liked the Damned's version of 'Eloise' which I remember being done by Paul and Barry Ryan (either one of them, or both!)
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: DrGreggles on May 31, 2021, 09:43:26 AM
I always liked the Damned's version of 'Eloise' which I remember being done by Paul and Barry Ryan (either one of them, or both!)

Paul AND Barry?

(https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/87c4f5ab8524726f34d3014ee3d3f56b91fbf986/0_350_1691_1014/master/1691.jpg?width=1200&height=900&quality=85&auto=format&fit=crop&s=97eca6082c03cb0fee045276b07f8428)
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: famethrowa on May 31, 2021, 10:24:48 AM
I always liked the Damned's version of 'Eloise' which I remember being done by Paul and Barry Ryan (either one of them, or both!)

I like it, should have been a Dave Vanian solo thing though because there's not much Damned about it.

I quite like Frente doing Bizarre Love Triangle, it brings out the melody well and happened before all that kind of thing became a cliche.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: holyzombiejesus on May 31, 2021, 01:34:52 PM
I quite like Frente doing Bizarre Love Triangle, it brings out the melody well and happened before all that kind of thing became a cliche.
Fellow Aussies Even As We Speak did it earlier (and better, IMO)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XH1vEZ_blo

It's a shame that John Lewis and stuff like that ruined the downbeat acoustic cover as there were a few decent examples before they just felt hackneyed. I really like Taken By Trees' version of Sweet Child O'Mine and think Victoria Bergsman has a really nice voice, but I can't imagine ever putting it on again.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Dr Rock on May 31, 2021, 02:47:20 PM
The Damned have done loads of great covers.

Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: DrGreggles on May 31, 2021, 05:23:03 PM
The Damned have done loads of great covers.

They also did Alone Again Or...
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: crankshaft on May 31, 2021, 06:31:49 PM
The track that prompted me to make this is a Bamboos cover of Ride on Time (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_oi1yDAAA8) that's doing the rounds at the moment. I honestly can't make my mind up.

The LP is good and The Bamoos are a great bunch of lads in general, but I don't know, I just don't know.

It's bollocks, a sub-Mark Ronson in 2007 attempt to gentrify what is a gloriously catchy and disrespectful piece of Italo house pop. The fact they give the "difficult" vocal sample to the saxes tells you all you need to know.

It's exactly the same as all the other post-Live Lounge cover versions that either turn dancefloor bangers into mawkish mope-a-thons or try and make fabulously throwaway pop singles "canonical" by getting humans with "chops" who know about "real music" to play them. Yes, I have a bee in my bonnet about this.

Hope this helps.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Brundle-Fly on May 31, 2021, 07:21:49 PM
The Damned have done loads of great covers.

and Vanian is really underrated as a singer.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Chicory on May 31, 2021, 08:25:32 PM
It's bollocks, a sub-Mark Ronson in 2007 attempt to gentrify what is a gloriously catchy and disrespectful piece of Italo house pop. The fact they give the "difficult" vocal sample to the saxes tells you all you need to know.

It's exactly the same as all the other post-Live Lounge cover versions that either turn dancefloor bangers into mawkish mope-a-thons or try and make fabulously throwaway pop singles "canonical" by getting humans with "chops" who know about "real music" to play them. Yes, I have a bee in my bonnet about this.

Hope this helps.

Absolutely spot on. I can't bring myself to actually hate them because I think they're good sorts but Travis have a lot to answer for with their 1999 cover of 'Baby One More Time'. I think it was done in good faith and with a genuine fondness for the sheer pop craft of the original but it unleashed an neverending stream of loose, anodyne, post ironic, Jo Whiley approved bum gravy that dominated pop culture all the way through the Noughties, aided and abetted by Nouvelle Vague, John Lewis and bank advert after coke dusted bank advert. 

I'd like to think we've turned a corner with all that bollocks but I'm bracing myself for the inevitable Yuletide cuddly heartbroken guinea pig soundtracked by a breathy, pixie voiced rendition of Wire's 'Outdoor Miner'.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Captain Z on May 31, 2021, 08:32:38 PM
Both those posts beat me to it. Would sound at home in a 2008 DFS advert.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Goldentony on May 31, 2021, 10:58:56 PM
Can never work out what's going on with the Flamin' Groovies covers of Please Please Me, Werewolves Of London and It Won't Be Wrong because every time I hear them I love em(AND IT WONT BE WROOOONG) but they're all basically note for note Gus Van Sant levels of similar
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Clatty McCutcheon on June 01, 2021, 12:16:29 AM
I heard Elton John and yer man from Years and Years’ duet version of ‘It’s a Sin’ on the radio earlier (‘Uh-school they-tut-ma-hutta-beh...’)

Elton seems to have made a decisive and seemingly irreversible move to the ‘club singer’ vocal register that he employed so devastatingly on his reimagining of ‘I’m Still Standing’.

Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: non capisco on June 01, 2021, 12:18:50 AM
The track that prompted me to make this is a Bamboos cover of Ride on Time (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_oi1yDAAA8) that's doing the rounds at the moment. I honestly can't make my mind up.

The LP is good and The Bamoos are a great bunch of lads in general, but I don't know, I just don't know.

Load of polite joyless shit.

Kind of reminds of what Mark Ronson did in the late 00s.

Exactly. Awful.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: famethrowa on June 01, 2021, 01:14:43 AM
It's bollocks, a sub-Mark Ronson

Made me think of this Kylie version of Locomotion from 2012:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ja0pBuK7CW4

Kyle's original is a iconic piece of cheese, sure, but this Winehouse/Ronson ripoff offends me way more. Making me get that upset about a bit of pop fluff.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Chriddof on June 01, 2021, 07:36:54 AM
Jesus christ, that version of Ride On Time is piss weak. No oomph of any kind to it.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Sebastian Cobb on June 01, 2021, 10:04:28 AM
Jesus christ, that version of Ride On Time is piss weak. No oomph of any kind to it.

Given the amount of piss weak dance covers on the totp reruns (the latest being a cover of Patrice Rushen's Forget me Not's) it's quite funny to see a band do the opposite and make a decades-old dance track sound thinner with real musicians.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: holyzombiejesus on July 08, 2021, 10:10:42 PM
I've only just heard this cover of My Bloody Valentine's When You Sleep and I predict that most people on here will fucking hate it, but I think I think it's good. Not 100% sure but there's something really lovely about it, even if the 'take a noisy song and make it folksy' thing is hackneyed as fuck.

https://youtu.be/I35doi5pjzg
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Neomod on July 08, 2021, 10:27:56 PM
I've only just heard this cover of My Bloody Valentine's When You Sleep and I predict that most people on here will fucking hate it, but I think I think it's good.

It's charming and guileless. Lovely stuff.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: phantom_power on July 09, 2021, 07:45:15 AM
This cover of Clam, Crab, Cockle, Cowrie - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jljxYyR5Tw

Charmingly ramshackle or what?
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: thundarrshirt on July 09, 2021, 10:54:36 AM
Norwegian poptimism stalwart Annie read this thread, covered "Just Like Honey" (https://open.spotify.com/track/6k9JUk0mHEQOm0S3R3eaJJ?si=742f24fbec224ebf), and I, too, cannot decide if this glistening synth take actually works well with those lyrics, or is big toilet

I've only just heard this cover of My Bloody Valentine's When You Sleep and I predict that most people on here will fucking hate it, but I think I think it's good. Not 100% sure but there's something really lovely about it, even if the 'take a noisy song and make it folksy' thing is hackneyed as fuck.

https://youtu.be/I35doi5pjzg


Context partially innit? This is sufferably sweet; a Live Lounge cover or YouTuber aspiring to be a Live Lounger cover-er doing the same would be insufferable
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: icehaven on July 09, 2021, 12:01:27 PM
I really like the actual song Team by Lorde but not how it's been done, I don't like her voice, or the arrangement and the production etc. (although there's an ''80s mix'' of it on YT which I think is still Lorde which is pretty good, it's just her style of singing still isn't really my thing), so I spent a while digging up covers of it. Failed to find any amazing ones but there's a few rock-ish ones which are OK for me but I daresay would fall squarely into the hackneyed (or just plain awful) category for a lot of people. I think I'm at a stage in my appreciation of music where I can hear something and know it's fundamentally not good but still admit to myself that I like it. Otherwise known as old.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: jobotic on July 09, 2021, 12:19:01 PM
I posted Laura Cantrell's version on New Order's Love Vigilantes ae few months back and the only responses were derision.

In general I agree with the arsey posts in this thread though.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: holyzombiejesus on July 09, 2021, 03:59:41 PM
It's charming and guileless. Lovely stuff.

Yeah, I've played it lots today and am now firmly in the 'good' camp. Think I'm actually in the 'fucking gorgeous' camp; I think the father/ daughter thing makes it even more touching and it manages to do that thing which all good covers should, which is to make you look at the original in a new light.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Bongo_Christ on July 18, 2021, 01:43:03 AM
Well this thread led me to discover that Black Box themselves did a "'79 Special" disco remix of Ride On Time a few years ago, as a 30th anniversary cash-in celebration, and it's pretty bangin' - keeps the energy of the original, but sounds like they got Earth Wind & Fire to play it for them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKQm3sWSIsw (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKQm3sWSIsw)
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: popcorn on July 18, 2021, 02:09:35 AM
Yeah I'm not enjoying this Ride on Time cover either, though I'm such a fan of the original I'm probably an impossible audience. Can't help but feel it would have been more interesting if they'd used the original vocal sample again, to create more contrast.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: SpiderChrist on July 18, 2021, 07:50:13 AM
Same here, but I hated the original Ride On Time (mostly due to Heather Small’s foghorn) - this disco version sounded alright until the vocals came in.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Bongo_Christ on July 18, 2021, 11:18:19 AM
Yeah I'm not enjoying this Ride on Time cover either, though I'm such a fan of the original I'm probably an impossible audience. Can't help but feel it would have been more interesting if they'd used the original vocal sample again, to create more contrast.

Same here, but I hated the original Ride On Time (mostly due to Heather Small’s foghorn) - this disco version sounded alright until the vocals came in.

If you're talking about the link I just put up, that *IS* the original sample, they got the rights to it a few years ago.

Compare - this spot is the most noticeable difference:
Love Sensation: https://youtu.be/j38yypPLWzE?t=108
Ride On Time '79 remix: https://youtu.be/GKQm3sWSIsw?t=150
Ride On Time Heather Small version: https://youtu.be/M0quXl_od3g?t=116
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: popcorn on July 18, 2021, 11:23:16 AM
Aye, I was talking about the new cover version in the OP, which has original vocals.

Am I right in thinking the version of Ride on Time on Spotify has the original sample?
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: SpiderChrist on July 18, 2021, 11:30:14 AM
If you're talking about the link I just put up, that *IS* the original sample, they got the rights to it a few years ago.

Compare - this spot is the most noticeable difference:
Love Sensation: https://youtu.be/j38yypPLWzE?t=108
Ride On Time '79 remix: https://youtu.be/GKQm3sWSIsw?t=150
Ride On Time Heather Small version: https://youtu.be/M0quXl_od3g?t=116

Ah. Apologies.

It also might be the way the vocals are edited: WALK right in, WALK WALK WALK right in - always gets on my tits, that. Mind you, I was working in a record shop when Ride On Time came out and so was exposed to it multiple times every day for what felt like an eternity.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: popcorn on July 18, 2021, 11:38:24 AM
I think it's really interesting how the whole gimmick was the way the vocals were edited that way to create that strange inhuman effect that isn't really at all like real singing - that's the hook - but that they still had Katrin Quinol in the music video and TV performances miming along. Like audiences still needed to imagine that WALK-WALK-WALK thing was coming from a live, unedited vocalist. Or marketing people imagined audiences needed that. Dunno.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Bongo_Christ on July 18, 2021, 12:22:00 PM
Aye, I was talking about the new cover version in the OP, which has original vocals.

Gotcha. It's hard to follow which one everyone's talking about here.

Quote
Am I right in thinking the version of Ride on Time on Spotify has the original sample?

Sounds like it now. For years the only version offically available was the Heather version, but it seems like since the got the rights to Loleatta's vocals they've quietly switched it for the original again.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Bongo_Christ on July 18, 2021, 12:30:10 PM
I think it's really interesting how the whole gimmick was the way the vocals were edited that way to create that strange inhuman effect that isn't really at all like real singing - that's the hook - but that they still had Katrin Quinol in the music video and TV performances miming along. Like audiences still needed to imagine that WALK-WALK-WALK thing was coming from a live, unedited vocalist. Or marketing people imagined audiences needed that. Dunno.

They just needed someone to front it for tv/videos. I doubt most people would really have paid that much attention.

It's a bit like watching specail effects in old movies now and thinking how fake and unbelievale they look, when at the time they were impressive. We've had decades of getting used to sampling and processed vocals that most people can spot that something's been done even if they don't know what. But back then the idea that some djs took an acapella recording from an older song, cut it up and layered over a new track, then got someone else to mime to it was not something most people would ever think of.

Also, lots of people wouldn't care, they just liked the song.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: PlanktonSideburns on July 18, 2021, 12:33:59 PM
Made me think of this Kylie version of Locomotion from 2012:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ja0pBuK7CW4

Kyle's original is a iconic piece of cheese, sure, but this Winehouse/Ronson ripoff offends me way more. Making me get that upset about a bit of pop fluff.

Best locomotion version

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SEDPgmOeLZA
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: OnlyRegisteredSoICanRead on July 18, 2021, 12:49:08 PM
I heard about 12 seconds of a Foo Fighters BeeGees cover. It was even worse than I was expecting.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Shameless Custard on July 18, 2021, 01:01:01 PM
The Fall's cover of Lost In Music seems to divide people. Maybe it helps that I'm not a huge Fall fan, but I really like it

Their version of Victoria feels a bit more pointless, mind

The Stranglers' go at All Day and All Of The Night feels a bit pointless, too

I tend to prefer covers that are either radically different from the original version, have a completely different style of voice singing it, or change the tempo. Just anything that makes it a bit different, and give it a reason for existing. Identical cover versions are lazy and a bit pointless
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Greg Torso on July 18, 2021, 01:29:34 PM
On the topic of covers of Ride On Time, my favourite is this one by Xper.Xr, a Hong Kong musician/artist who did a whole album of chart pop songs using traditional Chinese instruments.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VN2zPynitOw (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VN2zPynitOw)
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: The Mollusk on July 18, 2021, 02:01:37 PM
The Stranglers' go at All Day and All Of The Night feels a bit pointless, too

Their cover of “Walk On By” though, fffffuckin scorcher
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Shameless Custard on July 18, 2021, 02:11:57 PM
Yep, true!
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Neomod on July 18, 2021, 09:45:01 PM
I know this is a bit "Thank you, we're Sausalito' but I still love it's country twang.

Mademoiselle Fizz (yikes) Being Boring

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPCXc8YH-Ew
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: Sebastian Cobb on July 18, 2021, 09:52:37 PM
I think it's really interesting how the whole gimmick was the way the vocals were edited that way to create that strange inhuman effect that isn't really at all like real singing - that's the hook - but that they still had Katrin Quinol in the music video and TV performances miming along. Like audiences still needed to imagine that WALK-WALK-WALK thing was coming from a live, unedited vocalist. Or marketing people imagined audiences needed that. Dunno.

I always thought it was intentionally choppy because samplers were still a relatively new toy.

Bit like how when stereo was new everyone got carried away and panned everything to fuck (or in film where colour grading first came out everything looked teal and orange).

I actually quite like it.
Title: Re: Cover versions you can't work out are good or hackneyed.
Post by: popcorn on July 19, 2021, 12:02:57 AM
I always thought it was intentionally choppy because samplers were still a relatively new toy.

Definitely! So it's silly to have a real person mime to it.