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December 07, 2023, 01:14:49 PM

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Israel Hamas having a war again

Started by Mobius, October 07, 2023, 10:09:57 AM

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Haven't watched this lot before but saw Lowkey was being interviewed and thought I'd give them a listen. 

Covers a lot of stuff not being discussed elsewhere -     
  • UK Israel Tech Hub - UK tax-payer funded, working out of the UK embassy in Israel and offices in London, to procure UK public contracts for Israeli tech firms - don't you have any of your own?
  • The achievements of Palestine Action - other aspects of which discussed in Alexei Sayle's recent podcast https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48HsbNy4cgQ
  • The revolving door between British (mainstream) media or US media and Israeli media - some specifics.  Also security aspects of allowing so much Israeli influence in British culture, media and defence - the MOD cancelling £250 million worth of contracts with Elbit Systems due to concerns about "operational sovereignty".

Really worth a listen.

Quote from: DelurkedToHelp on November 18, 2023, 12:33:59 AMWhy do the biggest cunts seem to get the safest seats?

Rose West could get elected as the Labour candidate in some constituencies.

Perhaps it's because safe seats are the only ones that cunts can keep. Esther McVey got kicked out of Merseyside, where they hated her, so the Tories gave her Knutsford, a constituency where a pile of sewage would get in if it had a blue rosette on top of it. That's our wonderful 'democracy' for you.

One thing that  bothers me is the way the media aren't questioning Israel's claim that it has the 'twin objectives' of rescuing the hostages and destroying Hamas. I mean, in a hostage situation, have you ever heard of the police saying they're going to rescue the hostages and also kill the hostage takers? Hostage situations are always associated with highly-trained negotiators being called in to carry out long, sensitive, carefully structured talks, ever mindful of the fact that the hostage takers hold practically all the cards.

I've  never heard of a situation where they say, "People are being held hostage in that building - let's blow the bugger to smithereens".

If there's a strong suspicion that the Israelis are content to sacrifice all those hostages, and only really care about destroying Hamas, it's time this possibility was openly discussed in the media (though I realise that expecting honesty from the mainstream media is pretty naive).

Old Nehamkin

I know that when I really want to rescue hostages the first thing I do is carpet bomb the area where the hostages are and also try to make sure they can't get any drinking water.



Quote from: Mrs Wogans lemon drizzle on November 17, 2023, 07:50:17 PMCurrently arguing with a guy in the pub who likens Hamas to the Nazis.  His argument is:  we (the allies) levelled Germany to get rid of the Nazis.  Why should we not do the same for getting rid of Hamas. 

How can you even argue with this bullshit?

Presumably, the folk making that asinine argument are also in favour of some kind well-budgetted Marshal Plan like scheme to completely rebuild Gaza and all its natives to prosper in the new post-Hamas environment.

Sebastian Cobb

Went to the Scottish national march today. There was to be estimated 10k there although I think that might not be taking into account the weather was shit today and up until now the one's I've been at were all on clear dry days.

As the big march in London was the week before, that meant Husam Zumlot, the ambassador for Palestine turned up and gave us a speech.


Quote from: Mrs Wogans lemon drizzle on November 17, 2023, 07:50:17 PMCurrently arguing with a guy in the pub who likens Hamas to the Nazis.  His argument is:  we (the allies) levelled Germany to get rid of the Nazis.  Why should we not do the same for getting rid of Hamas. 

How can you even argue with this bullshit?

Ask them whether they would say the same thing if he and his family lived in the Gaza Strip.

Quote from: DelurkedToHelp on November 16, 2023, 07:19:23 PMhttps://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/divisive-pastor-john-hagee-criticism-role-march-israel-rcna125346


The Democrats' leader in the US House of Representatives, Hakeem Jeffries trying to deflect from his stage-sharing with Hagee by accusing people of being racist towards him by the presence of watermelon symbols at pro-Palestinian protests.

QuoteNew: Andy Eichar, Jeffries' NY comms director, responds to the DSA's "watermelon" flier, saying  "the use of racially inflammatory imagery should come as no surprise given the role NYC-DSA and other gentrifiers have played in aggressively attacking Black elected officials."


QuoteWhy the watermelon is a symbol for the Palestinian cause

For people following the Israel-Gaza war, the watermelon isn't just a fruit.

In recent weeks, protesters have been carrying watermelons through the streets, handing out chunks of the fruit to demonstrators, or painting pictures of watermelons on their faces. On social media, watermelon emojis are appearing in usernames and under posts about the conflict in Gaza.

But what does the watermelon mean in this context, and why has it become such a prominent symbol for pro-Palestinian demonstrators?

The fruit has, in fact, served in Palestinian iconography for decades, often being used as a stand-in for the Palestinian flag, because, when cut open, the fruit displays the flag's colors of red, white, black and green. It also is a popular fruit grown locally by Palestinians.

There's a second, practical reason that the watermelon is used: Displays of the Palestinian flag frequently have been banned or restricted.




A toddler could understand that symbolism

Sebastian Cobb

Because they haven't yet learned willfully interpreting things in bad faith and creating false equivalences.

Sebastian Cobb

Forgot to add I heard the most Scottish pro-Palestine chant today.

Free Gaza, free the west bank
Netanyahu is a wank


it has been very bizarre seeing right-wing cunts (including Labour MPs) suddenly opining that "from the river to the sea" is virulently antisemitic and akin to shouting for a second Shoah.

The ADL seem pleased that Elon Musk has clarified he's just being white supremacist and NOT criticising the state of Israel, so that's hunky dory.

CNN following in the BBC's footsteps and questioning the IDF's findings at Al-Shifa

QuoteCNN analysis: Video suggests IDF might have rearranged weaponry at Al-Shifa prior to news crew visits

An Israel Defense Forces video on November 15 showing a tour of Hamas weaponry found at Al-Shifa hospital shows less weaponry at the scene than in later footage filmed by international news crews, indicating the weaponry may have been moved or placed there prior to news crews arriving. 

CNN compared footage published by the IDF online with footage taken by Fox News, which was granted access to the site in the hours afterwards. IDF spokesperson Lt. Col. Jonathan Conricus leads the tour in the IDF video and a watch on his arm shows the time to be 13:18.

Fox News foreign correspondent Trey Yingst later visits the scene when it is dark. He says in his report it is "the middle of the night."

Yingst is shown a bag located behind an MRI machine inside the hospital with two AK-47 guns visible on top of it. However, the IDF video filmed earlier shows only one AK-47 gun. It is unclear where the second AK-47 gun came from and why it is not visible in the earlier IDF clip.

In the intervening hours, the IDF also posted online a photo of the weaponry purportedly found at Al-Shifa hospital. The WhatsApp file name for this photo indicates it was taken at 17:35; this places it after the IDF tour of the MRI compound but almost certainly before the Fox News crew arrive.

It is possible the weaponry was removed from the scene and replaced prior to the news crews arriving. However this does not explain why more guns are visible when the press arrive than in the original IDF video.

The BBC was also granted access to the hospital the following day, November 16, and two AK-47 guns are still visible on top of the bag inside the MRI room.

Israeli military responds: The IDF told CNN the discrepancy between the military's own video and the BBC footage was "due to the fact that more weaponry and terrorist assets were discovered throughout the day."

"Suggestions that the IDF is manipulating the media are incorrect," it added. "We are acting with full transparency whilst maintaining the safety of our troops and operational readiness."

This post has been updated with the IDF's response to questions about the videos.


I don't know if this was already something assumed to be the case, but an Israeli investigation has found that one of their own helicopters hit some of the festival-goers on the 7th of October.

QuoteAccording to a police source, an investigation of the incident also indicates that an IDF combat helicopter that arrived at the scene from the Ramat David base fired at the terrorists, apparently hitting some of the revellers who were there. According to police, 364 people were killed at the festival.



Quote from: Buelligan on November 17, 2023, 05:52:17 PMIf they're lucky.


Cheers for sharing this! Joined the crowd outside Parliament Square for a bit earlier. Anyone still decrying any protests/demos as hate marches or whatever should really take a look at how many families there's been in attendance, really quite elderly people, parents and young kids; because, y'know, funnily enough there are actual families affected by this shit, its's not just a bunch of tofu wranglers having a self-righteous day out

(not saying I think the latter would be a negative thing, the more the mightier obviously, but I think a few media outlets are certainly trying to paint it as some kind of zeitgeisty snowflake bandwagon)

Quote from: Sebastian Cobb on November 18, 2023, 08:38:19 PMFree Gaza, free the west bank
Netanyahu is a wank

love it


Quote from: flotemysost on November 18, 2023, 10:49:44 PMAnyone still decrying any protests/demos as hate marches or whatever should really take a look at how many families there's been in attendance

Never met my family clearly.


Wanted to offer huge applause to everyone who is or has or plans to take part in any action.  I can't imagine what it's like trying to survive in Gaza (or the West Bank) at the moment.  Every tiny (or huge) action of solidarity - check the source of those clementines - contributes to the whole. 

And don't buy from America either, that is my sincere advice.  Not until they get their shit sorted, they have to stop benefitting from leading the world into slaughter.

And don't forget today -

Sunday 19 November 2023

Caernarfon: The steps end (opposite end from Castle) in from top of the Gisda charity building, 6.30 pm

Cambridge: Assemble at 1pm on Parker's Piece to Form a Human Chain to Support a Ceasefire.

Colchester: Vigil,Colchester War Memorial, 12noon

Falmouth: Demonstration for a Free Palestine, The Moor, Falmouth, 4pm

London, Lewisham: Concert for Gaza, in aid of Medical Aid for Palestinians, Amersham Arms, New Cross, 5pm. Tickets here.

Peterborough: Cathedral Square, 12PM

Southend: Assemble at Pier Hill, 12noon

Stoke: Blue Clock, Hanley at 1pm

Swansea: Castle Square, 2 pm



OH and just so's you can start planning - think about next week my lovelies -

Ready to go again?  Course you are!  Bring your mum.



Quote from: Sebastian Cobb on November 18, 2023, 08:38:19 PMForgot to add I heard the most Scottish pro-Palestine chant today.

Free Gaza, free the west bank
Netanyahu is a wank

Too long for a thread title?  I do hope not.

Just checked, it ain't.  Could I suggest, respectfully - FREE Gaza, FREE t'West Bank, Netanyahu is a wank !  Has an undoubted ring to it.


Old Antonio Guterres issued a statement yesterday -

QuoteWithout entering into discussing the accuracy of the figures released by the health ministry in Gaza, which are regarded by UN agencies as reliable, he said that "what is clear is that we have had in a few weeks thousands of children killed."

Latest reports from health authorities indicate that more than 13,000 civilians in total have died in the enclave since the 7 October terror attacks by Hamas, and subsequent Israeli offensive.

"This is what matters. We are witnessing a killing of civilians that is unparalleled and unprecedented in any conflict since I have been Secretary-General."

So that's something new achieved.  And it's not even like we're finished.  Who knows how many will be dead or injured in terrible ways before they decide to stop?

Make sure you do whatever you can, boycott, divest, protest.  Stop the slaughter.



Yeah, it's the Muslim girl with the cuddly octopus who's the bigot, not the people who see a lass in a hijab and assume she must hate Jews.

Tangentially, it's impossible for me not to read that "you allow this student" statement in the same tone as that tweet about Miette the cat going "you kick Miette like the football?"

You allow student to have cuddly octopus? Octopus like in old propaganda image I heard of a month ago? Jail for University Challenge! Jail for one thousand years!

Sebastian Cobb

Quote"For the avoidance of doubt, this episode was filmed in March. The mascot is one of many chosen by the team during the course of the series and is one of their favourite animals.

"The jacket worn by one of the contestants was navy blue, orange, pink and green, bought from a High Street retailer. It has no connection to any flag."

"ah well, nevertheless"


Why don't we really get down to the bottom of who's making those cheap octopus toys they sell on market stalls? It's all a front to fund Hamas no doubt! I bet they even make the octopuses in their secret underground lairs, underneath hospitals and schools.

Video Game Fan 2000

Quote from: Shaxberd on November 21, 2023, 04:01:02 PMYou allow student to have cuddly octopus? Octopus like in old propaganda image I heard of a month ago? Jail for University Challenge! Jail for one thousand years!

wasnt this also a wedge issue during Occupy? where people were calling the protestors populist fascists because of octopus and fat cat imagery on banners and protest material?

and yet again its not hard to find actual antisemitic octopus/tendril imagery online and in media, yet we never hear a fuss being made about that.

also the octopus has been used as an anti-asian too but we dont hear about that do we

Fambo Number Mive

Quote from: Sebastian Cobb on November 21, 2023, 04:03:51 PM"ah well, nevertheless"

It's quite alarming how far down the LBC story the clarification is. I wonder how many people will read past several paragraphs of people's social media responses to it.


The day after the Secretary General of the United Nations says

QuoteWe are witnessing a killing of civilians that is unparalleled and unprecedented in any conflict since I have been Secretary-General.

Five thousand babies and children dead and it's continuing, with full support of the "civilised world".

But what's really outragous, what's really worth getting your vile old arse out about is THE FEATURING OF A YOUNG WOMAN WEARING HIJAB ON NORMAL MIDDLE CLASS TELEVISION.

No fuck given about the cuddly toy.  Not really.  This is just reaching.  It's about making make sure this group of people are never seen as human or normal ever.

Because you can't just murder humans, you can't just murder University Challenge contestants.  You can murder Nazis.  Even nice people agree.


The UK's funny-men are about to go octopi (And probably other soft-toy Cephalopods) CRAZY! Haha. Just wait.


Nicholson'll lose her shit when she finds out about Blåhaj.