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March 28, 2024, 06:11:35 PM

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The Shiternals

Started by madhair60, October 30, 2021, 05:54:32 PM

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madhair60

first marvel movie to be "rotten" on some website. not the first marvel movie to be "rotten" in my heart

who's up for it

Mister Six

This doesn't look good for Kirby.

Shit Good Nose

Unfortunately there will need to be several back-to-back mega box office disasters before the Marvel/superhero/multiverse train crashes.

Magnum Valentino

Did Thor 2 not get absolutely slated as well?

For doubling down on Kat 'Kat Dennings' Dennings as "Kat Dennings"?

Butchers Blind

Do you have to see this one to underst......

Custard

The thing is, the trailer makes it look so run of the mill and boring. Guardians did really well because it looked colourful and different and fresh at the time. This just looks so straight and bland

I think I've properly gone off Marvel for now, as I didn't bother seeing the one with the rings either. Before these films and the mediocre TV shows, I'd watch all of it without question. I can't get past the fact that I think it climaxed with Thanos and Endgame. They'll never top it

Goldentony

absolutely mental how you can take something as exciting as the original comic and make a grey montage of cunts jumping in fog

Small Man Big Horse

Quote from: Shit Good Nose on October 30, 2021, 06:07:02 PM
Unfortunately there will need to be several back-to-back mega box office disasters before the Marvel/superhero/multiverse train crashes.

I imagine they'll be very careful with the release schedule so for every movie with new characters that might not be successful, there'll be a big name sequel coming along straight afterwards. Right now it looks that way anyhow as the next films are Spider-Man: No Way Home, Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness, Thor: Love and Thunder and Black Panther: Wakanda Forever and I doubt any of those will flop, then there's The Marvels but straight after that will be the third Guardians of the Galaxy and Ant-Man films, all of which will presumably make a ridiculous amount of money.

Edit: Just discovered The Marvels is just a Captain Marvel sequel. So yeah, this is never going to end.

peanutbutter

Seen a lot of reviews defending Chloe Zhao for this one, but at the same time I'm not sure she's done anything to suggest she's that good of a filmmaker. Her three previous films are all extremely similar from her side of things. She definitely set herself up for failure going straight from those to a Marvel film.

bgmnts

Quote from: Goldentony on October 30, 2021, 06:45:42 PM
absolutely mental how you can take something as exciting as the original comic and make a grey montage of cunts jumping in fog

Presumably the people making the comics were some dickhead weirdos having fun and being creative whereas this film is one of many massive projects for a huge corporation designed by committee, created to make as much profit as possible.

Goldentony

Quote from: peanutbutter on October 30, 2021, 06:52:56 PM
Seen a lot of reviews defending Chloe Zhao for this one, but at the same time I'm not sure she's done anything to suggest she's that good of a filmmaker. Her three previous films are all extremely similar from her side of things. She definitely set herself up for failure going straight from those to a Marvel film.

that's the method now though isnt it? the last Spiderman film was directed by the guy who did Cop Car which I think had three people and two cars total in the entire thing, and before that the shite Clown film. Now he OWNS Spiderman.

Mister Six

#11
Quote from: Shameless Custard on October 30, 2021, 06:44:39 PM
The thing is, the trailer makes it look so run of the mill and boring. Guardians did really well because it looked colourful and different and fresh at the time. This just looks so straight and bland

Honestly, that's kind of why I'm interested in it. Every other superhero trailer since Guardians has been ironically repurposed 1970s/80s hit singles chopped and changed with quips and action, and the rest are just quips and action with a modern track.

Something that looks a bit slower, a bit more subdued, a bit more expansive, with a dash of character humour here and there - that interests me more than the inevitable Thor 4 trailer that's wall-to-wall gags played over Chas & Dave's "Rabbit", even if I know I'm going to really enjoy Thor 4...

Quote from: peanutbutter on October 30, 2021, 06:52:56 PM
Seen a lot of reviews defending Chloe Zhao for this one, but at the same time I'm not sure she's done anything to suggest she's that good of a filmmaker. Her three previous films are all extremely similar from her side of things. She definitely set herself up for failure going straight from those to a Marvel film.

She's a very, very good filmmaker, she's probably just ill-suited to superhero flicks, or mainstream blockbusters of any kind. Her aesthetic interests (stillness, nature, wide scenery shots) and storytelling modes (small, human stories) are well outside the Marvel mould. But that's exactly why this looks interesting to me, even if it's ultimately not that good a superhero flick.

Butchers Blind

Quote from: Mister Six on October 30, 2021, 07:40:23 PM
the inevitable Thor 4 trailer that's wall-to-wall gags played over Chas & Dave's "Rabbit",

If its half as good as this, I'm in.

peanutbutter

Quote from: Mister Six on October 30, 2021, 07:40:23 PM
She's a very, very good filmmaker, she's probably just ill-suited to superhero flicks, or mainstream blockbusters of any kind. Her aesthetic interests (stillness, nature, wide scenery shots) and storytelling modes (small, human stories) are well outside the Marvel mould. But that's exactly why this looks interesting to me, even if it's ultimately not that good a superhero flick.
I haven't seen anything to suggest more than she's just kinda good at a thing that doesn't really work as a feature. Her aesthetics don't really stand out at all for me beyond all the other people that people compare to Malick either. Hasn't really progressed at all in any way from her debut film either.

The Rider is easily the best film she's done imo and I'll be surprised if she tops it (although it's really totally dependent on her finding the correct person to feed off as her process is obviously very collaborative on an intimate scale).

Anyways, according to wikipedia her next project is Dracula...


Quote from: Goldentony on October 30, 2021, 06:56:50 PM
that's the method now though isnt it? the last Spiderman film was directed by the guy who did Cop Car which I think had three people and two cars total in the entire thing, and before that the shite Clown film. Now he OWNS Spiderman.
Barry Jenkins wasting himself on "Untitled Lion King Prequel" at the moment too.


I'm sure they're all lured in by the promise of a (until now) rather low risk project and the future ability to raise way more funding, I've yet to see any especially talented indie director actually pull any major gains from this play though.

George White

The one joy I noticed is that Kingo's manager is played by Harish Patel, who although a veteran of Bollywood since the 80s and indeed previously appeared in Shekhar Kapur's 1987 superhero flick Mr. India (with Amrish Puri as the baddie), is probably best known round here as Dev's Uncle Umed off Coronation Street.

chveik

Quote from: peanutbutter on October 30, 2021, 08:36:15 PM
I haven't seen anything to suggest more than she's just kinda good at a thing that doesn't really work as a feature. Her aesthetics don't really stand out at all for me beyond all the other people that people compare to Malick either. Hasn't really progressed at all in any way from her debut film either.

yes there's no way a truly good filmmaker would waste their time with such a project

Mister Six

Quote from: peanutbutter on October 30, 2021, 08:36:15 PM
I haven't seen anything to suggest more than she's just kinda good at a thing that doesn't really work as a feature. Her aesthetics don't really stand out at all for me beyond all the other people that people compare to Malick either. Hasn't really progressed at all in any way from her debut film either.

Well so far she's only released three films in five years, so it's a bit premature to talk about how much she's progressed. I'm not sure what you mean by "doesn't really work as a feature" either.

The Rider is easily the best film she's done imo and I'll be surprised if she tops it (although it's really totally dependent on her finding the correct person to feed off as her process is obviously very collaborative on an intimate scale).

QuoteI've yet to see any especially talented indie director actually pull any major gains from this play though.

This model hasn't been in use long, at least as applied to proper indie filmmakers, so again it's a bit early to say.  But I think the fucked nature of the film industry is going to make it an uphill struggle. Can't really blame them for wanting to see how the Hollywood sausage is made, though.

Mister Six

Quote from: chveik on October 30, 2021, 08:47:26 PM
yes there's no way a truly good filmmaker would waste their time with such a project

What does talent have to do with whether or not they choose to make one of these films? Especially with Hollywood the way it is now.

(I didn't even rate Nomadland as much as everyone else on reflection, but what I'm seeing in these threads is absurd contrarianism even by CaB standards.)

madhair60

Quote from: chveik on October 30, 2021, 08:47:26 PM
yes there's no way a truly good filmmaker would waste their time with such a project

☝️☝️☝️☝️☝️

mothman

👇👇👇👇👇👇👇👇👇👇
Quote from: Mister Six on October 30, 2021, 10:57:46 PM
What does talent have to do with whether or not they choose to make one of these films? Especially with Hollywood the way it is now.

(I didn't even rate Nomadland as much as everyone else on reflection, but what I'm seeing in these threads is absurd contrarianism even by CaB standards.)
👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆😉

I'm sure it'd be great for all artists to hew to some ideal of pure artistic integrity, eschewing all notions of commercial success. But most people working in film will have grown up exposed to commercial cinema and could easily dream of the chance to get to make a big Hollywood blockbuster, if even just once. Of course they may well come to regret it if the experience is not to their taste nor the end result and the rewards what they hoped for.

There is an old Vulcan proverb: "Even Clooney wanted to be Batman."

Butchers Blind


Quote from: chveik on October 30, 2021, 08:47:26 PM
yes there's no way a truly good filmmaker would waste their time with such a project

100%. Delusional to think that anyone with genuine talent would be happy keeping the 'shiny slop for 13-year old boys that is inexplicably enthused over by adults' mill running for anything other than totally mercenary reasons

Although having said that the fact that this film is getting mixed reviews suggests that it might actually stand a chance of being interesting. Some of the more negative reviews seem to have the same complaint about it being too slow, which is sometimes a euphemism for 'moves like a film made by and for people with grown-up attention spans'

peanutbutter

Quote from: chveik on October 30, 2021, 08:47:26 PM
yes there's no way a truly good filmmaker would waste their time with such a project
I'm def not saying that, some great filmmakers were merceneries, some had to absolutely slum it to get the things they wanted to get made funded

Quote from: Mister Six on October 30, 2021, 10:54:06 PM
Well so far she's only released three films in five years, so it's a bit premature to talk about how much she's progressed. I'm not sure what you mean by "doesn't really work as a feature" either.
It's def a bit premature, but that's 3 feature length films of increasingly large budgets and pretty much no progress whatsoever. The most underwhelming thing to me about Nomadland was how it completely failed to surprise me in any way, a vague kind of melancholic feelgood empathy that's not really getting into anything.
One possible excuse I could give is that there's a fair chance Nomadland was far more Frances McDormand's project and Zhao was explicitly brought in to do more of the same, which seems plausible.

I feel like moving closer to outright documentary filmmaking would make more sense than fiction because obviously she's able to work very well with amateurs and get themselves to bring themselves out on screen but I also guess it'd be a lot easier to backtrack to that side of things after exploring some of the opportunities afforded via the backing of McDormand and Disney too.

Quote from: Kermit the Frog on October 31, 2021, 12:49:05 AM
Although having said that the fact that this film is getting mixed reviews suggests that it might actually stand a chance of being interesting. Some of the more negative reviews seem to have the same complaint about it being too slow, which is sometimes a euphemism for 'moves like a film made by and for people with grown-up attention spans'
The issue here would be it's slow and it's the same bloated length as every other Marvel film?

Mister Six

Quote from: peanutbutter on October 31, 2021, 01:29:35 AM
It's def a bit premature, but that's 3 feature length films of increasingly large budgets and pretty much no progress whatsoever.

What would constitute progress for you?

And I think you're massively underselling the genuine talent on display in these films. It's no small thing to get convincing performances out of amateurs, even if they're playing (a version of) themselves, and her choices in terms of composition, cinematography, editing are all great. Her major weakness is as a screenwriter, I think, more than as a director.

Lord Mandrake

Quote from: Kermit the Frog on October 31, 2021, 12:28:54 AM
shiny slop for 13-year old boys that is inexplicably enthused over by adults

It's not inexplicable if you're the only one that can't understand it.

bgmnts

Quote from: Lord Mandrake on October 31, 2021, 08:49:56 AM
It's not inexplicable if you're the only one that can't understand it.

Well he can understand it, it's shiny slop? If you've seen piglets go for the bucket of slop poured into their trough, you know.

Lord Mandrake

Quote from: bgmnts on October 31, 2021, 09:14:47 AM
Well he can understand it, it's shiny slop? If you've seen piglets go for the bucket of slop poured into their trough, you know.

So it's not Inexplicable then is it? It can be explained. "These people are idiots and I'm better than them".

Enjoyed? Understandable, they are entertaining films, decently scripted with good casts. But discussed and dissected endlessly, salivated over and slavishly defended by men in their 30s/40s? Absolutely inexplicable.

Lord Mandrake

As for the film, big gamble that looks to have backfired this time, critically at least. I guess it takes more than composing pretty shots and hiring a pretty cast and 'mercenary' directors like Waititi and Coogler and Gunn and Favereau must have something else, like maybe having a deep understanding and love for the charachters. Back to formula.