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Started by Fambo Number Mive, April 19, 2022, 01:46:53 PM
Quote from: TrenterPercenter on May 26, 2022, 01:27:03 PMBecause it's stupid. Devolving people down to some fabled archetypal tory even within tory voters is problematic, there is obviously a spectrum for baby eaters to free market I'm alright jacks to law and order traditionalists. There is this childlike view that people that don't support Corbyn (and we've even seen people that do/did support him but not enough) being called tories. It's less about giving leeway and credit but having a more nuanced view on the world, mainly for purposes of progressing leftwing views.Centrism isn't really a thing there is no "centrist party" they tried it and it failed remember, what you have is a lot of well off commentators on twitter, that because their feet are further away from the fire don't have the same focus of mind as those that do. Likewise those with their feet closest to the fire invariably also make reactive, poor decisions and all too often cannibalise their own. Just another one of the divisions the ultimately powerful people benefit from. In reality the centrists many people obsess about on here (and I understand why, better the devil you know, but this again is just another helpful division) are just politically naive and are lacking in ideology, but have a platform (something we learnt about JOB for example from his interview with Owen Jones, he is an idiot, likely formed from years at boarding school where he learnt the pitfalls of ideology from elite theory and from the outside, but never understood it's necessitating role in survival for those less privileged - also see his inability to empathises with those people ideologically driven by things like Brexit). Normally in politics you earn platforms from ideology but this is the world now of Twitter where anyone with something to flog that will get them followers can tell us all their political insights.I'd say centrism is a lack of ideology above all else. Also twitter is a magnifying glass for these people, I mean shock horror that a load of comedian, actors and musicians turned out to be narcissists on twitter with crap politics, perhaps artists shouldn't always be held in such esteem (celebritised) in the first place? Over people that humbly go about their business actually making sure the country doesn't collapse in on itself.
Quote from: Blumf on May 26, 2022, 01:52:32 PMHow are you defining centrism then?https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman
Quote from: Famous Mortimer on May 26, 2022, 02:34:49 PMIf we, the people having this discussion, understand what's meant by the terms (as do you, obviously) why bother trying so intently to muddy the waters?
Quote from: TrenterPercenter on May 26, 2022, 02:35:22 PMI'm defining centrism as it is being used currently which is nebulously to define a group of generally well off non-radicals. Aside from the fact "Labour", and, "Tories" are both parties you can vote for The Lib Dems actually do have a much more formed politic. The poster boy for "centrism" is Blair yet he was the leader of the Labour Party and was/is loathed by the Lib Dems which was one of the reasons they gave (Iraq) for joining the Tories in the coalition.
Quote from: pigamus on May 26, 2022, 12:52:40 PMDifferent film I think
QuoteA Conservative MP has defended Boris Johnson and suggested it was likely NHS staff had also been "letting their hair down" during the Covid pandemic.Richard Bacon was speaking after Sue Gray's report highlighted the extent of lockdown parties at Downing Street.Mr Bacon, who represents South Norfolk, said the prime minister should not be "condemned".
Quote"You haven't gone and investigated it but there are one and a half million people who work in the NHS. I bet if you tried hard enough you could find some people letting their hair down who were working 24/7 in the NHS as well.
Quote from: Blumf on May 26, 2022, 03:19:43 PMSo the question is, why are so many people claiming to be centre left or centrist, when in fact they are, by their very actions, right wingers? Why are so many people joining a Socialist party who clearly do not believe in left wing politics?
Quote from: Sebastian Cobb on May 26, 2022, 03:26:57 PMSteadfastly rejecting 'ideology' is an ideology of sorts. It's not a very good or coherent one; centrism is relies on affirmative statements of what it isn't, and vague nebulous word-salads when attempting to define what it is.
Quote from: TrenterPercenter on May 26, 2022, 04:58:05 PM"Centrists" don't steadfastly reject ideology, I said it is a lack of, not a rejection of.
Quote from: Cerys on May 26, 2022, 11:42:04 AMThat's where I first saw Flatliners. Maybe it's an omen.
Quote from: Sebastian Cobb on May 26, 2022, 05:03:27 PMI think many do. And spare me the semantic pedantry, I didn't quote you, so what makes you think I was basing my claim they reject ideology entirely on all the shit you typed?
Quote from: Beagle 2 on May 26, 2022, 06:46:35 AMhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61584546The cynicism of the timing of this announcement. So blatant.
QuotePaul Johnson, director of the Institute for Fiscal Studies, said offering a universal payment would mean a lot of the money would go to households who "don't desperately need it".He also warned putting billions of pounds into the economy at a time when prices were rising quickly "could stoke additional demand and make inflation much more permanent".
Quote from: Johnny Yesno on May 26, 2022, 08:40:01 PMOh, look, here's a no ideology so-called 'centrist':You can't take money from rich fossil fuel corporations and give it to ordinary people to help towards the real terms decline in their incomes. We'll end up in an economic death spiral caused by people turning on more and more lights and heaters. That's just a fact and BBC news are doing well not to challenge it otherwise everyone will laugh at them.
Quote from: Sebastian Cobb on May 26, 2022, 09:38:09 PMAnything to hide the small print I suppose.
Quote from: Sebastian Cobb on May 26, 2022, 11:53:44 PMBBC https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61590957Better info here:https://twitter.com/chappersmk/status/1529838700795936769
QuoteMr Sunak said: "We should not be ideological about this, we should be pragmatic.
QuoteHe added: "There is nothing noble in burdening future generations with ever more debt today because politicians of the day were too weak to make the tough decisions."
Quote from: Blumf on May 26, 2022, 01:37:35 PMUm.. the Liberal Democrats? (itself formed from the Liberal Party and the centrist Labour breakaway Social Democratic Party). Remember how it was the party to happily cosy up to the Tories back in 2010.
Quote from: TrenterPercenter on May 27, 2022, 09:04:03 PMhttps://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/2687692/Tory-MP-Michael-Fabricant-forced-to-eat-coffee-whitener-at-gunpoint.htmlhas someone told Peter Kay?
QuoteMr Fabricant, 58, was trekking in the Santa Marta region of northern Columbia when, last Saturday, he and his travelling companion were approached by the armed soldiers, wearing full combat gear and carrying M-16 assault rifles and machine guns.He said: "They started talking to us but they were speaking in Spanish and I don't speak Spanish so things didn't go too well."Then they started looking in my backpack and came across a small jar of Coffeemate. They started to say something about raw cocaine."I was saying Coffeemate over and over and they were holding the jar up and shouting 'cocaine, cocaine'. It was extremely frightening."I asked them to try it but apparently I have learned since that raw cocaine is pretty poisonous so they made me eat it instead. I had to eat about three tablespoons of it while they watched intently to see if I was going to go loopy."It was quite vomit-inducing and I was trying not to be sick, but when they saw I wasn't going to die they relaxed a bit and let me on my way.""I'm glad I wasn't sick because that would have heightened their suspicions and who knows what would have happened."
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