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Chris Morris: Transphobe?

Started by Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth, June 28, 2015, 09:32:08 PM

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Noodle Lizard

Quote from: Thomas on December 13, 2015, 08:52:46 PM
right, so

Transgender father leaves family in Toronto to start new life as six-year-old girl

Hah, the last minute or so of that video is proper Morrisian, or like something from Clickhole.  What a strange world.


Fonz

Quote from: Cheesewogg on August 07, 2015, 02:05:02 PM
Isn't "transphobe" a person who fears driving? I'm sure I've heard this of non driver/car owning celebs like Charlie Brooker and Derren Brown.
Literally homophobia isn't accurate either, is it?

I'm not homophobic. I'm not afraid of where I live.

momatt

Quote from: Shoulders?-Stomach! on June 28, 2015, 11:58:57 PM
If so, watch the film The King of Comedy.
It's fill your boots time (with cum)

I watched this (excellent) film only last night and my girlfriend commented that Sandra Bernhard looks just like Chris Morris.  It would be an enjoyable watch if you fancy either of them.
I realise that this post is 2 years old, but the coincidence is a bit mad, so had to comment.

Anyway, Chris Morris is unlikely to be a transphobe.  People chopping up their own genitals is inherently an unusual and funny thing to do.  He's just exploring that idea and seeing how far it can be taken.

fuckthepound

Definitely a horrendous transphope - I've seen him out and about with a special gun. smh..

Only eight years late to this thread.Gonna out myself as a parasocial nutter here, but I'd be pretty crushed if Morris really is a transphobe.Not sure why this is where I draw the line especially as he's done work about every other offensive thing.He spoke a bit on the Adam Buxton podcast about not seeing antivax-types-etc as "the enemy" and I thought...it's kinda easy for an old white dude say that, though. Why would I defer to people like Graham Linehan, who want my friends to die/not exist? The rest of the podcast was very enjoyable.

Dear God, the resemblance to Sandra Bernhard is uncanny. Maybe I will go watch The King of Comedy. For...science.

PERTINENT FACT/SPECULATION:
Some contributors to this thread have fallen for the auteur fallacy with Blue Jam. While he has always been a substantial creative force in all his work, Morris seldom writes without collaborators.

This is the case with Blue Jam, which has an extensive list of contributors credited for additional material—including Graham Linehan. https://www.comedy.co.uk/radio/blue_jam/cast_crew/

Obviously Morris & Linehan worked together on the IT Crowd, but they also worked together a few times in the 90s—Morris did some directing work on Big Train, for example.

Of course, it would be impossible to establish attribution for specific items without substantial primary research. However, as people have brought up, it is certainly a conspicuous trope in several Blue Jam sketches to make an exaggerated absurdity out of identifying as something other than how you're identified at birth, to the point of seeking surgery to affirm it. But we can only speculate.

It's difficult to trace the progression of Linehan's hateful attitude towards trans folk before the recent breakdown of his marriage. As Lily Simpson points out, that episode of the IT crowd does in fact humanise its trans character to a certain extent (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kO1Nxk2PmQ), but again we can't say how much of Linehan's fingerprints, as it were, are on specific details of a collaborative end product.

Interesting, though. This humour all comes from a time (which is, at last, coming to an end) when the mere existence of a trans person could serve as a punchline. I think Graham probably didn't want that to change.

CM not being a transphobe is starting to seem unlikely tbh.

Not trying to start online fights.
Just feeling fucking exhausted and defeated.

fucking ponderous

I kind of doubt it. He seems to have a lot of respect for marginalized groups given the amount of research he's put into his films, the amount of time spent making sure he portrays people the right way. I think he's smart enough to know the media panic over trans people is bullshit.

13 schoolyards

Honestly, there seems a bit of a wide gap between Morris and those guys as far as the intellectual content of their output goes. Even working at a time when a lot of dubious stuff was seen as fair game, Morris (mostly) seems to have put in the thought to make sure his overall targets were deserving ones.

Obviously I have no real idea of his personal views, but if Morris were to announce a new project today, is it more likely to be "once again the media is trying to whip the community up into a frenzy over something for their own ends" or "hey, this time the press and celebrities are right, trans people really are a menace"?

Barry Admin

Quote from: lizardsdownthewire on September 18, 2023, 02:42:42 AMCM not being a transphobe is starting to seem unlikely tbh.

Not trying to start online fights.
Just feeling fucking exhausted and defeated.


Go and watch or rewatch the Four Lions DVD extras.
Edit: https://www.cookdandbombd.co.uk/forums/index.php?msg=1326712

There is no way.

Quote from: 13 schoolyards on September 18, 2023, 05:50:54 AMHonestly, there seems a bit of a wide gap between Morris and those guys as far as the intellectual content of their output goes. Even working at a time when a lot of dubious stuff was seen as fair game, Morris (mostly) seems to have put in the thought to make sure his overall targets were deserving ones.

Obviously I have no real idea of his personal views, but if Morris were to announce a new project today, is it more likely to be "once again the media is trying to whip the community up into a frenzy over something for their own ends" or "hey, this time the press and celebrities are right, trans people really are a menace"?

Absolutely.

TheGingerAlien

Morris understands nuance and is therefore unsuitable for transphobia. I think it's fair to say he has people in his life who are "asking questions", but that's about as far as it goes. I assume the concern comes from this latter detail and the fact that Glinner has specifically baited this forum with his "I've spoken to Chris" BS, but I don't think there is much to worry about here.

Shaxberd

Blimey, the first page of this thread is an impressive illustration of how CaB's culture has changed over the years.

DrumsAndWires

Quote from: Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth on June 28, 2015, 09:32:08 PMYou'd certainly hope not but, listening again to Blue Jam, there are quite a few sketches about people switching genitals. I can't think what other subtext there would be to them. Is it just a bit of silliness or, as internet types are fond of saying, is it 'problematic'?

those sketches were way ahead of their time. in fact, i'd say they were almost prophetic.

Quote from: Barry Admin on September 18, 2023, 01:48:40 PMGo and watch or rewatch the Four Lions DVD extras.
Edit: https://www.cookdandbombd.co.uk/forums/index.php?msg=1326712

There is no way.

Absolutely.

I no longer have a DVD player. Is there any place online where I could access these and which bit in particular should I be looking for?

#46
Quote from: TheGingerAlien on September 18, 2023, 06:51:05 PMMorris understands nuance and is therefore unsuitable for transphobia. I think it's fair to say he has people in his life who are "asking questions", but that's about as far as it goes. I assume the concern comes from this latter detail and the fact that Glinner has specifically baited this forum with his "I've spoken to Chris" BS, but I don't think there is much to worry about here.

I have people in my life who are "asking questions" as well because I am weak willed tbh. The ones I know, are not actively inciting harm against trans people,though.

Chris, Richard Ayoade and Noel Fielding have made/been in media that was/is very important to me. But Richard wrote the book blurb and Noel's a long-time friend of a possible serial rapist.

I'm questioning that entire group of creators and what's wrong with me to relate so much to their works.

Obviously, I'd like it not to be true. I can rarely get through a day without thinking of a Chris Morris reference.

Kelvin

Quote from: lizardsdownthewire on September 18, 2023, 02:42:42 AMCM not being a transphobe is starting to seem unlikely tbh.

Not trying to start online fights.
Just feeling fucking exhausted and defeated.


What does any of that have to do with Morris? I can't see that he's mentioned in the article (although I only skim-read it, so willing to be corrected), and none of the book quotes are from him either.

Is your logic that some of his former colleagues are arseholes, so he must be too?

Quote from: Kelvin on September 20, 2023, 04:38:07 AMWhat does any of that have to do with Morris? I can't see that he's mentioned in the article (although I only skim-read it, so willing to be corrected), and none of the book quotes are from him either.

Is your logic that some of his former colleagues are arseholes, so he must be too?

I admit that I'm jumping to conclusions and no he wasn't mentioned in the article. My distaste for Glinner might be spilling over.

Quote from: lizardsdownthewire on September 20, 2023, 04:56:52 AMI admit that I'm jumping to conclusions and no he wasn't mentioned in the article. My distaste for Glinner might be spilling over.

How the fuck did I just quote myself? Jesus.

Barry Admin

Quote from: lizardsdownthewire on September 20, 2023, 04:10:07 AMI no longer have a DVD player. Is there any place online where I could access these and which bit in particular should I be looking for?

I dunno, and just any of it, there isn't any specific bit - none of it is directly about transphobia or trans people btw - I haven't read back my old posts or seen the extras in years myself, I just remember being amazed at what an empathic and sympathetic study CM had performed of a marganlised and demonised community.

Anyway look, there's just no chance Chris Morris would be in the grip of a moral panic - one which has been whipped up by the American religious right. His work speaks for itself in this regard.
 

13 schoolyards

Quote from: Barry Admin on September 20, 2023, 07:48:55 AMAnyway look, there's just no chance Chris Morris would be in the grip of a moral panic - one which has been whipped up by the American religious right. His work speaks for itself in this regard.
 

Exactly this - once you go beyond the mates sticking by mates and the rubbish being said and look at it as yet another moral panic stirred up by the powerful for their own nakedly political ends, it's obvious what view Morris would have of it

Cloud

There are so many overt transphobes out there, it honestly seems like madness to look for it in someone if they've shown little to no evidence of it, like you're trying to prove them innocent to give yourself permission to like them.

I'd say just give benefit of the doubt.  The JKs and Glinners of the world soon make themselves be known, and then you can cancel them.

All fair points.
I'll try to find a way to re-watch the Four Lions extras.


Glebe

I cannot imagine CM being transphobic. At the very least he'd surely offer a balanced and reasonable opinion on the subject. Unlike one of his former collaborators need it be said...