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The Outlaws II (second series)

Started by Des Wigwam, June 05, 2022, 09:31:29 AM

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Des Wigwam

Just seen this is starting tonight. I thought it would be nice to be positive about the fruits of the tree that produced The Office (I've lost control of that metaphor).

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2022/jun/05/tv-tonight-the-outlaws-season-two-bbc-one-christopher-walken

I enjoyed the first series. Just read the synopsis there and realised I remember virtually nothing about it. Fingers crossed for it though.

Still think Christopher Walken is such a weird get for a small British sitcom and then I think of things like Robert De Niro advertising white sliced bread or Andi Macdowell in Cuckoo (also Taylor Thingy and Andy Samberg now I think about it. What's Greg Davies got on people?)

lauraxsynthesis

Series 1 was such a nice surprise when I didn't expect much but had it recommended by a friend in Bristol. Very much looking forward to this.

dead-ced-dead

Season one was imperfect but at times moving, funny and engaging. Looking forward to this.

olliebean

Quote from: Des Wigwam on June 05, 2022, 09:31:29 AMStill think Christopher Walken is such a weird get for a small British sitcom and then I think of things like Robert De Niro advertising white sliced bread or Andi Macdowell in Cuckoo (also Taylor Thingy and Andy Samberg now I think about it. What's Greg Davies got on people?)

Rutger Hauer in some obscure hospital sitcom on Dave.

Des Wigwam

Quote from: olliebean on June 06, 2022, 06:57:50 PMRutger Hauer in some obscure hospital sitcom on Dave.

There is no way there hasn't been a biggest name / most obscure sitcom thread. Is there? Surely.

Guardian loved this - can't find the link right now. Half agreed with their points in the abstract about Merchant. They did draw a nice parallel with him and Victoria Wood re: mundane choices and their comedy value.

If the whole thing of this hasn't landed I'll wait a while to build them up otherwise probably hoover it up tomorrow.

greencalx

Watched the first ep last night (and, characteristically, I'll be viewing this as it airs) and it was more comic than I remembered the first series being. It looks like the characters still have some mileage in them, although not sure it could sustain past this second run.

Des Wigwam

Forced into watching Derry Girls like that and savoured it more. Will see how I feel after an episode and may exercise restraint (probably won't).

greencalx

A lot of good lines in the second ep I thought ("a mortgage and a balloon"). Maybe I misremembered but seems to be playing much more for laughs in this season.

Quote from: greencalx on June 12, 2022, 10:01:27 PMA lot of good lines in the second ep I thought ("a mortgage and a balloon"). Maybe I misremembered but seems to be playing much more for laughs in this season.

Yeah,I think so too.

I've finished it and probably enjoyed this season more than the first for that reason.

Mobius

That's good to hear, I struggled with S1 because it wasn't very funny (nothing wrong with it really, just light on laughs) but might push on in that case.

cosmic-hearse

Quite enjoyed this tonight, though it might be veering into Breaking Bad territory this series (I can see Darren Boyd's character going all Walter White).

Still blows my mind that this was co-written by (notoriously tough) Boston HC musician Elgin James.

olliebean

Quote from: cosmic-hearse on June 13, 2022, 12:44:55 AMQuite enjoyed this tonight, though it might be veering into Breaking Bad territory this series

More Good Girls, I thought.

lauraxsynthesis

Radio 4 is doing their Inside... series on The Outlaws 2 and it's enjoyable so far. Interesting to learn that Merchant had planned to have the characters discuss whether the Colston statue should come down until events got ahead of the plot. 

KennyMonster

Just finished watching this on iPlayer last night.

Enjoyable enough for a BBC One tv show.

Mrs Monster did point out a glaring plot hole (possibly) unless we missed something.....

Spoiler alert
Why did they have to launder the money they were paying back?
Why couldn't they pay back The Dean's stolen cash with cash?
[close]

DrGreggles

Again, like s1, I thought this was decent.
Silly plot, but that doesn't bother me.
Merchant is an excellent physical comedian isn't he.

Just finished this, surprised it's not had more discussion. Thought it was excellent and agree with the small consensus that it was a lot funnier than the 1st series. Thought Diane was a great comic foil for Merchants character. I know this point has been made hundreds of times on the forum, but it really is incredible when you consider the gulf in quality between this and Gervais' most recent work.

greencalx

Just reached the end - really enjoyable run, one of the highlights of my week. A rare case of a second series being better than the first - more coherent (if silly) plot, better gags and a reasonable dose of peril.

I saw an interview with Merchant that suggested they might have more in store with the characters, but I'm not sure that's wise. The ending sort of left it open to continue, but sort of made that difficult as well. Probably best to leave on a high.

QuoteThe ending sort of left it open to continue, but sort of made that difficult as well.

For a second, when she wandered off to the refreshments on the train, I thought they were going to have a bleaker ending.

Enjoyed the last episode a lot even if I didn't quite like how they got there in previous episodes.

neveragain

The ending was great, be a shame to add on to it.

Des Wigwam

Finally got round to watching this and did it in 3 sittings. Glad I didn't do it in one go as (as mentioned above) it was getting a bit Good Girls at times and when that happens I just plough through. Was a little worried from about ep4 that it was going to turn into an extended episode of Hustle too.

As others have said - I think it's a stronger series. It feels like it has more confidence to be funny and dramatic. I also enjoyed hearing more of Merchant's voice in a lot of the lines (from what I remember of his standup and also bits of interviews). It becomes Rani's show a little (which maybe it always was) but I really enjoyed the ensemble and one character didn't overshadow another. In fact, he seemed to be able to turn all of the characters up quite a bit and not lose anything. And I liked how no-one actually got a completely happy ending. They're all quite broad characters but it felt quiet a grounded ending (except for
Spoiler alert
the joy riding ending that's bound to have very negative consequences.
[close]
I also liked the escape plan although was pretty annoyed at the ultimate
Spoiler alert
switch over since I can guarantee that car's boot would lock while the car is in motion and even if it didn't it just isn't realistic to do that unnoticed.
[close]

I thought of loads of ways that this is vastly superior in content and structure to Gervais' work but although that's an endless source of fascination for me it's too hot to type it all out. I will say though that I think Merchant has evolved even from S1 - there seems a lot less of the "that's a bit gay" style shock humour in this one and better structured lines.  Not that there was loads in the first series but I seem to remember it was easier to see the lineage back to The Office than in this series. It just feels more mature. There were also a few bits of genuine emotion in it that were thousands of times more moving than in After Life - a show specifically written about a man who is quite sad. Just the
Spoiler alert
look Rani gives Ben on the train, for example.
[close]

Darren Boyd's gradual descent into depression was really good too. Didn't really appreciate it until the end.

Can't wait for Merchant's next thing - hopefully with different characters.

greencalx

According to Wikipedia, Merchant did less writing for S2 (sole credit for E1 and E6, joint credit for E3), so I'm not sure to what extent one can describe this as maturation - unless he had some sort of 'showrunner' type role for the series?

Ignatius_S

Quote from: greencalx on July 15, 2022, 06:05:16 PMAccording to Wikipedia, Merchant did less writing for S2 (sole credit for E1 and E6, joint credit for E3), so I'm not sure to what extent one can describe this as maturation - unless he had some sort of 'showrunner' type role for the series?

He did and has discussed this in various interviews.

Merchant has discussed how his interest in writers' room from being in the States and after having one for Hello ladies, opted for that approach. One of the interviews was in the Radio Times, I think - he also mentions about The Office 'running out of steam' because of him and Gervais were so embedded in the show but if they have taken a break, they likely could have continued and sounds like it's that kind of experience led him to liking a more American approach.

Also, those credited for writing an episode won't necessarily reflect all the people involved in the writing process. For example, with Breaking Bad, Vince Gilligan was in his rights to  claim a number of writing credits due to the revisions and extra work he did on them, but he chose not to - partly, because he felt this was part of his role to guide and nurture writers on the show. There is some interesting footage of the writers' room for The Shield as DVD extras, which shows how multiple people discuss the development of an episode and are very involved in the creative process before one or two people would write the script.

greencalx

Thanks for that. With such multi-authored shows I assumed there must be someone acting as a kind of editor to maintain consistency in the characterisation at least.

Ignatius_S

Quote from: greencalx on July 16, 2022, 05:53:17 PMThanks for that. With such multi-authored shows I assumed there must be someone acting as a kind of editor to maintain consistency in the characterisation at least.

No problem! I've been meaning to link to a few interviews for the show (and also say what I thought about the second series!) as there has been some interesting stuff and feel answers (partially at least), like why did Walken sign up to it. Something Merchant said is that with so many characters and their own stories, this approach helped them keep track about those plot lines.

dead-ced-dead

I'm two episodes in and I'm really enjoying it. I liked the first season as well, but you can see Merchant's development.

He's really good at keeping track of all the many subplots. No one feels like they're getting lost in the shuffle.

dead-ced-dead

Darren Boyd is so good this series. Broad though his character is, his descent is deftly played.

neveragain

I love Darren Boyd. He's always had bags of talent.

madhair60

The only thing I have ever experienced of this show is my parents watching it and loudly agreeing with a long rant a character went on about not being transphobic, or homophobic or something. So I will never be watching this as long as I live

dead-ced-dead

Quote from: madhair60 on July 17, 2022, 06:20:24 PMThe only thing I have ever experienced of this show is my parents watching it and loudly agreeing with a long rant a character went on about not being transphobic, or homophobic or something. So I will never be watching this as long as I live

It's funny, because I read that as not something we were meant to agree with but the character ranting it losing the plot. Like he's clearly in the wrong.

Kind of like how people miss the point of Fight Club. But I can understand not wanting to watch it because of that.

And I'm just saying that's my reading and it could be wrong.

madhair60

Yeah, my parents are absolutely fucking stupid.