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August 13, 2022, 10:58:41 AM

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Lightyear

Started by SteveDave, June 29, 2022, 08:58:08 AM

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SteveDave

I took my son to see this yesterday and for the first hour it's really good.

Then it becomes about team-work with a team that is shit and goes to Hell. If he didn't have that team then he would've gotten everything sorted a lot quicker. My wife tried to tell me that having the team got the job done in the end, but I maintain they fucked so much up that he would've and could've done it easier without them.

But messages...

The overall premise of it being the film that Andy saw in 1995 that made him want a Buzz Lightyear toy works quite well and the first things he says in the film are the first lines Tim Allen says in "Toy Story"

Also this Buzz not being voiced by Tim Allen makes sense as my son's Captain America shield doesn't have Chris Evans' voice saying overly-patriotic things, but that of a cheaper voice-over artist that sounds a bit like him.

The cowboy and the potato do not appear.

dissolute ocelot

Quote from: SteveDave on June 29, 2022, 08:58:08 AMThe cowboy and the potato do not appear.

I'm sure I've seen something about a Mr Potato Head movie, but based on a quick Google I can't quite tell if they're taking the piss. This film seems tailor-made for Disney+ anyway.

Bad Ambassador

It's been a commercial disaster. The lowest grossing Pixar film apart from Onward (which came out two weeks before the COVID lockdown) and probably won't make its budget back at the box office, which is a first for a company that's produced several billion-dollar grossers.

SteveDave

Do you think it's because there's a same-sex relationship in it? Middle America and all of China don't like it.

Bad Ambassador

#4
It hasn't been released in China at all, but a lot of blockbusters aren't. I don't think the kiss is really relevant, since Eternals and Dr Strange 2 had them and the live-action Beauty and the Beast had a specifically gay character.

I think it flopping has more to do with being unable to excite potential viewers to go to the cinema, when the last few Pixars have debuted on Disney+ instead. They've made a rod for their own backs.

Sonny_Jim

Quote from: SteveDave on June 29, 2022, 10:32:51 AMDo you think it's because there's a same-sex relationship in it? Middle America and all of China don't like it.
It's probably because it's shit (compared to their other films)

SteveDave

I enjoyed it a lot more than that one with all the fucking fast singing songs in it.

Replies From View

I sure hope that this film causes Andy to get a Buzz Lightyear doll and it doesn't change history.

idunnosomename

They thought this had a wide appeal, in tweens, milennials who are Andy's age, and even boomers by putting David Bowie on the trailer. However it's just stretched so bland it doesnt really appeal to anyone. Partly as you've got kids whove just grown up over the last couple of years watching these new movies on Disney+.

The whole marketing line that "this is the movie Andy saw!!" is so cynical and disingenuous. We can see it isn't. The subject matter is a made up toy that looks more like Stretch Armstrong rather than anything with a franchise behind it.

The 00s cartoon got it right having Emperor Zurg being a wonderfully camp supervillain voiced by Wayne Knight. Trying to make a Darth Vader ripoff into an actual existential threat (and especially with the ooh big twist) was never gonna work.

Anyway Cars is such a big skidmark (lol) on Pixar's reputation who cares, its just a shame its done poorly commercially as no doubt Disney will greenlight Toy Story 5 to make up for it.

I'd love Pixar to do something genuinely mature, or at least more very pretty low-stakes Ghibli-esque stuff like Luca, but looks like sequels and anthropomorphic blob things ahead.

I'll tell you what though, Luck that John sexpest Lasseter is doing with Skydance for another Apple+ looks absolute gash. Simon Pegg doing his Scotty voice for a talking cat. I wanted to die just watching the trailer

AsparagusTrevor

Quote from: Sonny_Jim on June 29, 2022, 01:13:33 PMIt's probably because it's shit (compared to their other films)
This is probably it. People can speculate about different reasons but the facts are the reviews aren't glowing, the marketing was shit, it all just seems meh. I've no desire to see it and I enjoy all the Toy Story films.

When TS4 was announced it seemed like a cynical cash-grab, milking the franchise past its logical conclusion - the sequel that nobody wanted (that wasn't in the Cars franchise). Luckily that film turned out good. After the failure of Lightyear you can bet there'll be a Toy Story 5 in production sooner rather than later.

Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth

Am I alone in actually quite liking Cars? I've never understood its reputation as the beginning of the end for Pixar. Is it just because it has Nascar and Larry the Cable Guy?

With that in mind, I expect I'll also enjoy Lightyear (when it turns up on Disney+).

Goldentony

#11
everyone bought the big fuck off plastic toy cat out the shops yet? big fan if fuck off big plastic cat, fucking talks, the lot, from space for fuck sake

madhair60

Quote from: Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth on June 29, 2022, 05:48:13 PMAm I alone in actually quite liking Cars? I've never understood its reputation as the beginning of the end for Pixar. Is it just because it has Nascar and Larry the Cable Guy?

it's fine. it's fucking weird how fucking weird people get over it. just total received opinion, like basically all film opinions ever in the history of communication

Replies From View

I've never seen Cars but I find cars absolutely fucking dull as all death.  They are traffic - nothing more.  And CGI cars felt tame when the Pixar film came out - smooth reflective metal, big deal.  I'm similarly cold towards the CGI spaceships and robots of WALL-E.  Already done and it didn't feel like Pixar was pioneering anything.

Plus this isn't received opinion - it's a fact and hard logic:  absolutely everyone knows that a car's eyes are in the headlamps.

madhair60

what the fuck??? the cars talk, they fucking say stuff. reflective metal??? what are you talking about?!?

shoulders

I hope the company involved go out of business. 👍

Replies From View

Quote from: madhair60 on June 29, 2022, 07:59:33 PMwhat the fuck??? the cars talk, they fucking say stuff. reflective metal??? what are you talking about?!?

Have you never seen a car before?  They're made of this reflective metallic stuff - absolutely shit as anything.

And of course they would talk in a cartoon - that's the bullshit you get with cartoons, just everything talking.  If they had the characters shut the fuck up for just one second of their lives they might have made some headlines with it.

madhair60

no i have never seen a car before, is it that hard to believe? not all of us grew up near the road.

bgmnts

I'm sure paying audiences would love to see a fun movie about cars that don't talk.

Actually, would that have made a better film? No talking, just cars driving themselves round. Could a car be animated with enough body language to convey character and a story?

dissolute ocelot

Did they learn nothing from John Carter? I'm not sure what the lesson is, since Lightyear isn't (as far as I know) based on a novel about bestiality and how great the Confederacy was, but maybe they didn't put enough bestiality and Lost Cause mythos in.

I love how Cars has inspired so much deep reflection on how its universe works (like, why are there buildings? how do the cars work?) although that isn't the mark of a good film, just an egregiously ill-thought-out one.

Could Herbie talk? Maybe Cars needed either Lindsay Lohan or Don Knotts, but how to find out which?

Replies From View

Quote from: madhair60 on June 29, 2022, 09:32:37 PMno i have never seen a car before, is it that hard to believe? not all of us grew up near the road.

don't you drag growing up into this

Noodle Lizard

Quote from: SteveDave on June 29, 2022, 10:32:51 AMDo you think it's because there's a same-sex relationship in it? Middle America and all of China don't like it.

I don't think so. I think it's probably the same reason anyone who likes Toy Story (especially children) doesn't want to see it - it's not the character we know. Aside from the fact that it doesn't look like him, different voice etc., Buzz himself is only interesting if he is, indeed, a toy. So this film isn't even that character's backstory. There's nothing appealing about it, and people would most likely rather remember the toy version from the toy movies that everyone likes.

It's a misguided (though understandable) attempt by Disney to cash in on the idea that everyone loves origin stories and extended universes at the moment, but that only works under certain circumstances. If Disney decide to blame its failure on the gay kiss, that's incredibly cynical.

idunnosomename

sorry the problem with Cars is the universe. it's cars. I want to know what the rules of the world are. but these are just a load of vehicles with faces. can they die? do they fuck and get pregnant with baby cars? I know this sounds pedantic but it really does mean a lot if you want me to invest in the stakes of the story you're telling me.
I mean the first film and its beats are fine (not seen the other two), but it's also so ridiculously capitalist white manifest destiny American and worshipping the internal combustion engine. first public sign Lasseter was a wrong 'un imo

It's not "the beginning of the end" by any means though. they have mediocre films before and after, and some of their best have been in the last five years. Coco, Onward, Luca and Turning Red I will bang about how good they are until grave, Soul and The Incredibles 2 weren't bad either.

Replies From View

Is the exhaust pipe of a gentleman car his penis?  Which part of the lady car does he insert it into?  From where is the baby car birthed?

Goldentony

how does Cars stand up next to Two Lane Blacktop?

madhair60

Quote from: idunnosomename on June 29, 2022, 11:04:29 PMThe Incredibles 2 (wasn't) bad either.

sorry but it was. i agree with you about the others so I can only assume this is a momentary lapse

idunnosomename

#26
I cant say The Incredibles 2 was bad. I held off watching it for a while, as The Incredibles is simply one of my favourite films ever. but when I finally saw it I was engaged and entertained and didn't hate it.

I liked seeing the characters again of course. it managed to tell a new story with new ideas (mainly Bob learning more about caring for his family), but ultimately, yes, it was mediocre. it shouldn't have left off right after the first one, it should've been a year or so later. no probs with Helen taking the lead, loved the super-modernist house too. but it felt a bit direct-to-video. nothing like Buddy Pine/Syndrome and the threat he brought to the Parrs

I've not watched Finding Dory (which the director of Lightyear, Angus MacLane, co-directed) really because I think Finding Nemo is a perfect film and I don't want to see any more. Same with Toy Story 4. I'll watch them at some point I guess.

13 schoolyards

I can get why they said this was the movie Andy saw back in 1995 - marketing tie in and all - but it makes absolutely no sense once this film begins. The 1995 film was obviously some space ranger action adventure thrill ride with a non-comedic Zap Brannigan as the solo hero (why else would he be constantly narrating his own adventures?), but 25 years later there's no way Disney or anyone else is going to make a kids movie like that.

Seeing a movie about a pre-established character where the moral is "don't be like your pre-established self" is bound to be a bit shit.

Sonny_Jim

I think the general premise put a lot of people off (it's the film-within-a-film) and it's kind of a warning sign that it's probably going to be shit, or at least leave a sad mark on the Pixar legacy.  It's like going to see a Spielberg film and it turns out to be a bit shit (*cough* Crystal Skull *cough*), you start to think 'was Schindlers List actually good tho?'

It's a shame as Pixar were tip top at coming up with new franchises and not running them into the ground.  Wall-E, Up, even when they fucked with the already perfect Toy Story trilogy (just ignore Cars as it breaks my argument).

Thomas

Quote from: 13 schoolyards on June 30, 2022, 07:25:31 AMI can get why they said this was the movie Andy saw back in 1995 - marketing tie in and all - but it makes absolutely no sense once this film begins. The 1995 film was obviously some space ranger action adventure thrill ride with a non-comedic Zap Brannigan as the solo hero (why else would he be constantly narrating his own adventures?), but 25 years later there's no way Disney or anyone else is going to make a kids movie like that.

My suspicion is that the opening 'Andy saw this movie in 1995' statement was a late-stage addition. For a while, everybody seemed confused about what this film was supposed to be. If I remember rightly, the actors and the director were issuing contradictory interpretations. At one point, the director clarified:

QuoteThe movie doesn't end and then you see Andy eating popcorn [...] This is its own thing. This is standalone.

Except now it does effectively, in spirit, end with Andy eating popcorn, and isn't quite its 'own thing' since it's meant to be a film-within-a-film.

I think the framing was slapped on at the last minute to clear things up for audiences - which jars with the fact that it neither looks nor feels like a 1995 film. I've seen some suggestions that it should've opened with a present-day Andy shepherding his own kids into the cinema, to see this 2022 reimagining of the character he loved as a child.

I haven't seen it.