Cook'd and Bomb'd

Forums => Deeper Into Movies => Topic started by: madhair60 on July 11, 2019, 09:51:55 AM

Title: Lion King remake
Post by: madhair60 on July 11, 2019, 09:51:55 AM
Cinematic cancer

FY, D
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Bad Ambassador on July 11, 2019, 05:21:27 PM
The AV Club (https://film.avclub.com/be-prepared-for-the-photorealistic-cruddiness-of-disney-1836271258) has absolutely ripped this to shreds.

"All the pleasures are not just secondhand but diminished. We’re watching a hollow bastardization of a blockbuster, at once completely reliant on the audience’s pre-established affection for its predecessor and strangely determined to jettison much of what made it special."

"Joyless, artless, and maybe soulless"
"The lack of expressiveness becomes a real liability"
"Basically scene for scene the same plot"
Most damningly:
"The Oscar-winning “Can You Feel The Love Tonight” now unfolds during the day"
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Twed on July 11, 2019, 07:48:54 PM
"The Oscar-winning “Can You Feel The Love Tonight” now unfolds during the day"
"Can you feel the love at 11:45am this Friday? I will share an iCal"
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: bgmnts on July 11, 2019, 11:57:03 PM
Why get mad just dont watch it?

Dont have an opinion or feel anything about it just dont watch it.

Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Twed on July 12, 2019, 12:30:49 AM
Same reason you made that post
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: madhair60 on July 12, 2019, 09:52:18 AM
Why get mad just dont watch it?

Dont have an opinion or feel anything about it just dont watch it.

you know what? fair fucks. got me bang to rights there.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: a duncandisorderly on July 12, 2019, 10:02:10 AM
Why get mad just dont watch it?

Dont have an opinion or feel anything about it just dont watch it.

jesus fucking christ fuck off out of it. people come here to rant. it's too late for him to un-see it, you dick.

i.o.w:
why get mad, just don't comment?
don't have an opinion or feel anything about it, just don't comment.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: madhair60 on July 12, 2019, 10:30:13 AM
It's a fair enough response to a recent chat in the Gremlins thread. I think it's a bit different, but I said essentially the same thing to St Eddie (I was reading more anger into the posts than was actually present)
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: phantom_power on July 12, 2019, 10:32:25 AM
If there is something to criticise then it is fair enough to do so but when there is nothing but rumour and assumption, less so
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: a duncandisorderly on July 12, 2019, 10:34:23 AM
I was triggered. getting flashbacks to my wikipedia rantings. "you what? we're wasting the internet?"
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Sebastian Cobb on July 12, 2019, 10:35:04 AM
I've not even seen the first lion king all the way through, beat that.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: a duncandisorderly on July 12, 2019, 10:42:38 AM
I've not even seen the first lion king all the way through, beat that.

hakuna matata old bean.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: phantom_power on July 12, 2019, 10:45:39 AM
Me neither. I saw an interview with Donald Glover on Jimmy Kimmel and they had a clip from the film. It did look very odd seeing photorealistic animals singing Hakuna Matata
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: up_the_hampipe on July 12, 2019, 10:49:55 AM
Me neither. I saw an interview with Donald Glover on Jimmy Kimmel and they had a clip from the film. It did look very odd seeing photorealistic animals singing Hakuna Matata

Yeah, that clip didn't look good at all. Seems to be confirmed in the AV Club review. Glover is belting out this number and it's just an expressionless lion moving its mouth. It's a jarring disconnect. Nice to see critics not just lauding it due to nostalgia, but I'm sure audiences and Disney fanatics will be creaming all over it.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: phantom_power on July 12, 2019, 11:04:38 AM
Donald Glover can't get no luck when it comes to breaking into blockbuster films can he, apart from that minor role in Spiderman
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: up_the_hampipe on July 12, 2019, 11:06:36 AM
Donald Glover can't get no luck when it comes to breaking into blockbuster films can he, apart from that minor role in Spiderman

He needs to make his own movie.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Pseudopath on July 12, 2019, 11:11:27 AM
Me neither. I saw an interview with Donald Glover on Jimmy Kimmel and they had a clip from the film. It did look very odd seeing photorealistic animals singing Hakuna Matata

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ph_YQEn-z30

Christ...you're not joking. It looks like that old World's First Singing Lion (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVTpcexFbu0) meme.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: phantom_power on July 12, 2019, 11:16:15 AM
How far into the development do you think they realised it didn't work? Because they must realise surely? Maybe they though they could keep tweaking the CGI until it looked better and then 80% in there was that dawning realisation that they were fucked.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Shaky on July 12, 2019, 11:58:07 AM
Jesus, Favreau's directing in the clips so far is atrocious. Completely perfunctory, rote camera movements as each CG character moves from A to B to C.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Dex Sawash on July 12, 2019, 12:37:26 PM
I've decided to not be so critical of things I have no real interest. Genital mutilation; it's just not for me, I reckon.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: ZoyzaSorris on July 12, 2019, 12:49:57 PM
The first one was bad. I have a feeling this isnt for me.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Avril Lavigne on July 12, 2019, 04:45:41 PM
I've not even seen the first lion king all the way through, beat that.

I've only seen Lion King One-and-a-Half.

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a9/Lion_king_1_half_cover.jpg)
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Billy on July 12, 2019, 07:08:16 PM
Which from memory was retitled to just Lion King 3 (at least in the UK) which given the plot would have been even more confusing.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: bgmnts on July 13, 2019, 12:57:55 AM
jesus fucking christ fuck off out of it. people come here to rant. it's too late for him to un-see it, you dick.

i.o.w:
why get mad, just don't comment?
don't have an opinion or feel anything about it, just don't comment.

:(
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Urinal Cake on July 13, 2019, 01:11:25 AM
Jesus everyone going on and on about Beyonce. Eichner seems like the only good thing about this.

I think for the world to improve, Beyonce must fail. This is the first step.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: a duncandisorderly on July 13, 2019, 08:23:45 AM
:(

I was triggered. getting flashbacks to my wikipedia rantings. "you what? we're wasting the internet?"
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Chriddof on July 13, 2019, 09:27:44 AM
Something that's definitely worth discussing are the weird, inexplicable mental gymnastics Disney are going through pretending it's not animated:

https://www.cartoonbrew.com/feature-film/dont-let-disney-gaslight-you-the-lion-king-is-an-animated-film-heres-the-teaser-166897.html (https://www.cartoonbrew.com/feature-film/dont-let-disney-gaslight-you-the-lion-king-is-an-animated-film-heres-the-teaser-166897.html)

Quote
The Walt Disney Company continues to try and mislead audiences by suggesting that the film is live action. In the Youtube video description, they state, “From Disney Live Action,” and while it may technically be true that the film is from their live-action division, it doesn’t take a scholar to look at the trailer and realize that there are no live-action performances onscreen.

It’s a mystery to us why the company is trying to gaslight audiences and convince them that this is a live-action film. Are they expecting audiences to believe that that’s Donald Glover in make-up as Simba in the image at the top of the post? Photoreal animation is still animation – and even though there’s plenty of virtual production techniques, performance capture, and perhaps even cinematography used in the film, those are still being applied to a final result that is principally animated.

Quote
The film’s vfx supervisor is Rob Legato and the lead animation/vfx house is MPC.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: BritishHobo on July 13, 2019, 10:16:32 AM
I saw a clip on Facebook of Timon and Pumbaa finding Simba, and it just looked like one of those comedy clips where people dub silly voices over wildlife documentary footage. Weird as fuck.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Twit 2 on July 13, 2019, 10:46:00 AM
Disney gaslighting? I suppose the audience are triggered? Why don’t these internet reviewers go to psychiatric hospitals and prisons and shit in mouths of victims? Gaslighting, indeed. Fuck off.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Replies From View on July 13, 2019, 11:17:22 AM
What’s gaslighting meant to mean in that context?
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Twit 2 on July 13, 2019, 11:58:58 AM
Lion Lying for profit.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: mjwilson on July 13, 2019, 12:22:18 PM
Something that's definitely worth discussing are the weird, inexplicable mental gymnastics Disney are going through pretending it's not animated:

https://www.cartoonbrew.com/feature-film/dont-let-disney-gaslight-you-the-lion-king-is-an-animated-film-heres-the-teaser-166897.html (https://www.cartoonbrew.com/feature-film/dont-let-disney-gaslight-you-the-lion-king-is-an-animated-film-heres-the-teaser-166897.html)

Right but exactly nobody is being misled, everyone knows it's all CGI, whatever Disney choose to call it.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Chriddof on July 13, 2019, 12:33:21 PM
Agreed, but it is quite weird and a bit comical.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: TheMonk on July 13, 2019, 12:59:11 PM
That bit in The Goodies episode with the big cat where the two dogs sing Anything You Can Do I Can Do Better is more convincing that that clip.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Replies From View on July 13, 2019, 01:08:49 PM
The article is strange.  Disney aren’t pretending this isn’t CGI; there is a wider effort to promote photorealistic CGI as live action, because that’s where Hollywood films are these days.  I think that’s far from ideal but it’s a very different thing.

The notion that thousands of animators aren’t being recognised for their work because of the decision to label this as live action is ridiculous.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: St_Eddie on July 13, 2019, 02:38:07 PM
Fuck you, Disney!  You're a shallow husk of your former self. (https://twitter.com/cartoonbrew/status/1149108647676522497)
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: bgmnts on July 13, 2019, 02:53:34 PM
You almost have to admire Disney's cynicism really.

This looks really shockingly dull to be fair. It will make at least $500 billion on its opening weekend so it doesnt matter but still.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: St_Eddie on July 13, 2019, 03:07:31 PM
You almost have to admire Disney's cynicism really.

Bloody well don't!

This looks really shockingly dull to be fair. It will make at least $500 billion on its opening weekend so it doesnt matter but still.

You speak the truth.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: thecuriousorange on July 13, 2019, 03:32:04 PM
Like most of these remakes/reboots of beloved and successful films, this will be a footnote in history.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: mothman on July 13, 2019, 03:44:31 PM
What’s gaslighting meant to mean in that context?

I'm not sure what gaslighting means in ANY context. I see it bandied around on social media all the time, but to admit ignorance of it apparenyl equates to denying it exists at all and therefore being guilty of it yourself (whatever it is).
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: samadriel on July 13, 2019, 04:03:24 PM
AIUI, gaslighting is when an abusive spouse tries to convince the abused partner that they're out of touch with reality, and that the abuse they suffer is "normal".
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: St_Eddie on July 13, 2019, 04:14:39 PM
AIUI, gaslighting is when an abusive spouse tries to convince the abused partner that they're out of touch with reality, and that the abuse they suffer is "normal".

Aye.  As someone who went out with a sociopath for two years, I have firsthand experience.  Having said that, it kinda sucks to put a label upon such behaviour, particularly when it's a buzzword and gets adopted for a fucking Hollywood remake of all things.  As much as I hate Disney and their remakes, I'll take their cynical, lazy, corporate bullshit over my sociopathic ex-girlfriend, any day of the week.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: BritishHobo on July 13, 2019, 04:44:13 PM
It is annoying - it's great to see awareness of the concept risig in recent times, meaning there's more help and understanding for people going through it. Less great when people then lazily broaden the term by applying it to frivolous things.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: alan nagsworth on July 13, 2019, 04:51:15 PM
the film is live action though because you're going to the cinema and sitting down and watching it, and that whole sequence of events is completely live action. even pictures moving on a screen in front of you is a live action event. everything is live action, disney was right.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: mothman on July 13, 2019, 04:55:34 PM
As much as I hate Disney and their remakes, I'll take their cynical, lazy, corporate bullshit over my sociopathic ex-girlfriend, any day of the week.

Bloody hell, she must have been REALLY bad!
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: St_Eddie on July 14, 2019, 06:15:03 AM
Bloody hell, she must have been REALLY bad!

Yppity, yippity, yip, yip, yip.

One woman managed to turn me off dating forevermore, so bad was she.  Disney are close though. Real close.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: biggytitbo on July 14, 2019, 09:59:54 AM
I hope this film is successful and they make a cartoon version of it.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Shameless Custard on July 14, 2019, 11:43:44 AM
I still haven't recovered from their Beauty and The Beast cover version. Of their own song. Still, Emma Watson. Who hasn't worked since
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Catalogue Trousers on July 14, 2019, 01:33:21 PM
Yes, astonishingly, there is a way to make The Lion King even more shite.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Blumf on July 14, 2019, 07:23:44 PM
There was a stage play of The Lion King, very well received with some clever costume work. Why didn't they do something like that? You could do some really interesting things when you loosen the look of the film instead of rigidly chasing photo realism in a story that can't really work realistically.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: bgmnts on July 15, 2019, 01:09:08 AM
Less effort.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Captain Z on July 15, 2019, 01:20:48 AM
Like most of these remakes/reboots of beloved and successful films, this will be a footnote in history.

"...and it was the release of a Disney movie1 that ultimately brought about the collapse of human society."


-------
1 The live-action remake of "The Lion King"
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Bazooka on July 15, 2019, 09:11:02 AM
Lion King on the mega drive though is top tier entertainment.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: madhair60 on July 15, 2019, 11:26:18 AM
Lion King on the mega drive though is top tier entertainment.

It's shit.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Noodle Lizard on July 15, 2019, 11:32:16 AM
I saved up 20 quid in pennies for months to buy that when I was 7 or so.  Turned out to be bastard hard and unfair to boot.

I did complete it in the end, though.  I remember the final boss battle with Scar took me days to finish (you had to restart the entire game if you lost all your lives) because it involved a finishing move the game never teaches you.  Ace.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: St_Eddie on July 15, 2019, 05:05:47 PM
I did complete it in the end, though.  I remember the final boss battle with Scar took me days to finish (you had to restart the entire game if you lost all your lives) because it involved a finishing move the game never teaches you.  Ace.

Indeed, that boss fight was total bullshit!
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: TwinPeaks on July 16, 2019, 08:57:05 PM
What does Favreau do when he directs this? Seems like the entity Disney just directs it and he's off doing the Mandolorian.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: St_Eddie on July 16, 2019, 09:56:04 PM
What does Favreau do when he directs this? Seems like the entity Disney just directs it and he's off doing the Mandolorian.

Pretty much exactly the case.  Disney hires directors who will do what they're told to do.  They're not interested in hiring auteurs.  They want people who know what they're doing but aren't so big that they'll start arguing with the executives on how things should be done.  It's why so many of these movies feel bland and without a unique voice.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: bgmnts on July 16, 2019, 09:57:32 PM
I mean they gave a relatively unknown director free reign of the biggest franchise in film, they obviously did put some stock in auteurs.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: St_Eddie on July 16, 2019, 10:12:02 PM
I mean they gave a relatively unknown director free reign of the biggest franchise in film, they obviously did put some stock in auteurs.

It's an odd outlier, bgmnts.  The hiring and inordinate amount of freedom which Rian Johnson was granted for The Last Jedi was done so through Kathleen Kennedy (President of Lucasfilm).  That's a separate division/subsidiary from the executives' hiring for and overseeing the 'live action' remakes of classic Disney animations.  There are also plenty of (unconfirmed) reports that Bob Iger has pulled the leash on Kennedy, so to speak, since the debacle of how she's handled the recent Star Wars movies (audience division over The Last Jedi and firing directors, plus extensive and expensive reshoots being the main contention).  Basically Rian Johnson is the exception which proves the rule.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: bgmnts on July 16, 2019, 10:22:05 PM
Fair point.

Although look what happens when you do give one guy full control (prequels).

Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Noodle Lizard on July 16, 2019, 10:24:50 PM
A friend not too long ago was baffled by the idea that "him from Swingers" was directing these huge movies (Iron Man, Jungle Book, now this).  But aye, as per St_Eddie's post, studios are currently more interested in hiring gullible and malleable cogs to "direct" these big-budget productions - if they already have a bit of a profile for being "one of Monica's least popular romantic interests", all the better.  At the very least they can hold their own on the press circuit.

Recently, they've gone more the route of using "indie" directors whose "indie" films have essentially been desperate pleas to gain entry to and work within the major studio system (Colin Trevorrow, J. A. Bayona, Gareth Edwards etc.)

Maybe the definition of "director" is changing, though.  Maybe rather than it referring to the executor of a singular vision, it's now more akin to being a floor manager and PR face for a vision concocted by countless different people and board-rooms over countless years.  This is the strategy that allows you to churn out dreadful films which nobody really likes and still break box-office records because it's meticulously designed for nothing other than to get people to buy tickets for it.

Increasingly, I'm suspecting a trend of studios playing into how shite their films are through showcasing obviously unfinished work in early trailers and promotional images (see Jurassic World, Aladdin, Sonic etc.), deliberately garnering negative attention in order to drum up interest in an otherwise dull final product.  Honestly, these are barely even films now, they're simply aggregators of "what works".

This Lion King remake looks absolutely shit.  I guarantee you everyone working on it knew that (except the actors, perhaps).  Technologically impressive, but otherwise inane and pointless and almost comical.  Everyone still gets paid.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: bgmnts on July 16, 2019, 10:27:44 PM
Like Adam Sandler films, but not almost comical.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: St_Eddie on July 16, 2019, 11:09:14 PM
A friend not too long ago was baffled by the idea that "him from Swingers" was directing these huge movies (Iron Man, Jungle Book, now this).  But aye, as per St_Eddie's post, studios are currently more interested in hiring gullible and malleable cogs to "direct" these big-budget productions - if they already have a bit of a profile for being "one of Monica's least popular romantic interests", all the better.  At the very least they can hold their own on the press circuit.

Recently, they've gone more the route of using "indie" directors whose "indie" films have essentially been desperate pleas to gain entry to and work within the major studio system (Colin Trevorrow, J. A. Bayona, Gareth Edwards etc.)

Aye.  Ridley Scott talked about this in a recent intereview with Vulture...

Quote from: Vulture
VULTURE: You’ve watched other people take over franchises you’ve made. How often are you asked to do that? Has Kathleen Kennedy offered you a Star Wars movie?

RIDLEY SCOTT: No, no. I’m too dangerous for that.

VULTURE: Why is that?

RIDLEY SCOTT: Because I know what I’m doing. [Laughs.] I think they like to be in control, and I like to be in control myself. When you get a guy who’s done a low-budget movie and you suddenly give him $180 million, it makes no sense whatsoever. It’s fuckin’ stupid. You know what the reshoots cost?

VULTURE: I can’t imagine.

RIDLEY SCOTT: Millions! Millions. You can get me for my fee, which is heavy, but I’ll be under budget and on time. This is where experience does matter, it’s as simple as that! It can make you dull as dishwater, but if you’re really experienced and you know what you’re doing, it’s fucking essential. Grow into it, little by little. Start low-budget, get a little bit bigger, maybe after $20 million, you can go to $80. But don’t suddenly go to $160.

VULTURE: One of the problems with the studio system at present is that there isn’t that middle ground anymore. There’s low-budget, and there’s $160 million.

RIDLEY SCOTT: And you get killed.

Increasingly, I'm suspecting a trend of studios playing into how shite their films are through showcasing obviously unfinished work in early trailers and promotional images (see Jurassic World, Aladdin, Sonic etc.), deliberately garnering negative attention in order to drum up interest in an otherwise dull final product.  Honestly, these are barely even films now, they're simply aggregators of "what works".

I agree with this 100%.  I've long said the art of popcorn movie making is dead, generally speaking.  By and large, they're not movies anymore; they're bland sausages, designed by committee and focus tested to death, in order to offend no-one and appeal to everyone, rolling down a conveyor belt and straight into the consumer's mouth.  To an extent, populist entertainment has always been this way, but there used be different flavoured sausages; ones with herbs; others with spices.  They'd have a unique flavour and certain people would prefer certain styles of sausages to others.  Nowadays, all the sausages are the same; pale and without taste.  If you've had one, you've had them all.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: colacentral on July 17, 2019, 03:20:24 AM
Yeah but Ridley Scott is thick as shit so I wouldn't listen to a word he says about anything.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Urinal Cake on July 17, 2019, 09:37:20 AM
Luckily the world is so shite they get away with it.

The Internet and digital video were supposed to solve a lot of the mid-tier issues but apart from Netflix I don't see that happening.

Movies are becoming what I guess the circus was before tv etc. A bit of everything to entertain yourself and the kids.

Internet based serialisation is essentially killing the format off artistically.

Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Josef K on July 23, 2019, 08:55:27 AM
Saw this yesterday. It looked stunning, the environments were photorealistic in places and you'd be forgiven for mistaking it for real life (if you were middle aged and your eyesight was starting to go bad).

Other than that, entirely pointless. Missed out a lot of the better comedic beats from the original, new music was fine, Beyonce was kinda bad.

Billy Eichner & Seth Rogen as Timon and Pumbaa is the only thing that makes it worth seeing. I'd watch a spinoff with their characters. If only there was a precedent for it.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: BritishHobo on July 23, 2019, 09:20:15 PM
It is a shame, all this. I remember reading a good article a few years back springing from Colin Trevorrow, about what's been discussed here, directors of small but well-received indie movies being thrust onto enormous productions. There's a big gang of directors who've had kind of an artificial trajectory; what could have been a career where they learned and grew, telling unique and personal stories, learning different ways to frame and edit them, becomes something where they're just handed insane amounts of cash and have to pretty much bland their way through a film every aspect of which has already been planned and approved by one of the biggest corporations in the world. Then again they must make shitloads of money, and I work for fuck-all, so I can't exactly turn my nose up.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: St_Eddie on July 24, 2019, 01:52:25 AM
Billy Eichner & Seth Rogen as Timon and Pumbaa is the only thing that makes it worth seeing. I'd watch a spinoff with their characters. If only there was a precedent for it.

Eventually Disney will run out of popular films to remake, so look forward to the "live action" remake of The Lion King 1½ (2027), at which point failure to bow down to our all-conquering-all-knowing-almighty Mouse Overlord, by buying multiple tickets and mountains of merchandise, will be punishable by death.  Such a happy, bright and cheerful future awaits us.  Almost like a Disney cartoon...
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: phantom_power on July 24, 2019, 07:53:52 AM
A friend not too long ago was baffled by the idea that "him from Swingers" was directing these huge movies (Iron Man, Jungle Book, now this).  But aye, as per St_Eddie's post, studios are currently more interested in hiring gullible and malleable cogs to "direct" these big-budget productions - if they already have a bit of a profile for being "one of Monica's least popular romantic interests", all the better.  At the very least they can hold their own on the press circuit.

Recently, they've gone more the route of using "indie" directors whose "indie" films have essentially been desperate pleas to gain entry to and work within the major studio system (Colin Trevorrow, J. A. Bayona, Gareth Edwards etc.)

Maybe the definition of "director" is changing, though.  Maybe rather than it referring to the executor of a singular vision, it's now more akin to being a floor manager and PR face for a vision concocted by countless different people and board-rooms over countless years.  This is the strategy that allows you to churn out dreadful films which nobody really likes and still break box-office records because it's meticulously designed for nothing other than to get people to buy tickets for it.

Increasingly, I'm suspecting a trend of studios playing into how shite their films are through showcasing obviously unfinished work in early trailers and promotional images (see Jurassic World, Aladdin, Sonic etc.), deliberately garnering negative attention in order to drum up interest in an otherwise dull final product.  Honestly, these are barely even films now, they're simply aggregators of "what works".

This Lion King remake looks absolutely shit.  I guarantee you everyone working on it knew that (except the actors, perhaps).  Technologically impressive, but otherwise inane and pointless and almost comical.  Everyone still gets paid.

I'm not sure this is anything different to how things have always been. Certainly in the days of the studio system before your Coppolas and Spielbergs changed things up. How many directors did The Wizard of Oz have?
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Mister Six on July 24, 2019, 11:55:09 AM
I think the point is that the studio system was a bad thing, and we don't want a return to that.

Although things tend to come and go in cycles, and I imagine we'll see the rise of new Coppolas in a few decades, as the current model of spending $250 million on eight films in the hope that one of them will break a billion is patently unsustainable.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Timothy on July 24, 2019, 12:50:20 PM
Eventually Disney will run out of popular films to remake, so look forward to the "live action" remake of The Lion King 1½ (2027)

That would be awesome. Especially if they add dialogue. That film was great.

Jungle Book, Beauty Beast and Aladdin were great.
Mary Poppins 2, Winnie the Pooh and Dumbo were quite dull.

Might see this next week with unlimited cinema pass to escape the heat but don't have high expectations.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: greenman on July 24, 2019, 12:54:39 PM
I'm not sure Scott is the best advert for a "sensible" older director given that his best film was notoriously over budget and his more recent career would at best be viewed as one of bland competence.

The idea that mid budget films have dried up I think has more credence although I would say its moreso ambitious mid budget films that have largely vanished, replaced by bland adult dramas(normally staring Hanks or Streep) and probably based on some worthy cause 95% of the audience already agree with. Actually Scott as producer is another good example of that in the way Blade Runner 2049 couldn't stay around say $50-60 million, it had to balloon up to $180 million.

Honestly I think blockbuster wise the recent era isn't nearly as monolithic as its talked up as. Its true that you generally have more studio control than the 80's but I think stylistically there is a massive difference between say JJ Abrams and the better Marvel films. The former is horrible formaulic blandness resorting to every cheap trick it can but the latter I think has often shown a good deal more ambition and risk.

The real successes with Marvel have tended to be comedy directors since I think shows you the franchise has far more in common with say Zemeckis or Reitman than it does Lucas or Spielberg.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: phantom_power on July 24, 2019, 01:00:27 PM
I think the point is that the studio system was a bad thing, and we don't want a return to that.


Tell that to the golden age of cinema
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Shit Good Nose on July 24, 2019, 01:02:27 PM
Mrs Nose and little Nose saw this yesterday.

Mrs Nose thought it was okay, surprisingly so as she'd worked her expectations down very low after reading some reviews.

Little Nose was bored through most of it, apparently.


I have no desire to see it whatsoever.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: EOLAN on July 25, 2019, 11:19:02 AM
I'm not sure this is anything different to how things have always been. Certainly in the days of the studio system before your Coppolas and Spielbergs changed things up. How many directors did The Wizard of Oz have?

4 I believe. With one of the biggest films of all time 'Gone With the Wind' having a big impact.
Richard Thorpe started; wasn't liked by the producer and was fired. Dorothy was in a blonde wig in that version so little of his stuff would have made the film. George Cukor took over; changed a bit of the design but having helped set up the film he had to leave to do with 'Gone with the Wind'. Victor Fleming took over and filmed a lot of the film; but his predecessor Cukor was fired from 'Gone With the Wind' so Fleming got the call to take over King Vidor came in and primarily did a lot of the B&W Kansas scenes. Meanwhile Fleming having filmed predominant amounts of 'Gone With the Wind' couldn't finish it with Sam Wood finishing that off.
Still two of the most revered films today; although 'Gone With the Wind's Civil War and somewhat romanticism of the Old South and the empowerment of the husband over his wife makes it somewhat problematic; while no one really cares all that much about the Silver/Gold standard allegory of the 'Wizard of Oz'.

Anyway; going to see the Lion King next week. Really want to hate it but fear I am going to think it's grand (in the Irish sense of it being meh - alright rather than grandiose).
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: St_Eddie on July 25, 2019, 01:30:47 PM
...while no one really cares all that much about the Silver/Gold standard allegory of the 'Wizard of Oz'.

Pray, tell?
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Shit Good Nose on July 25, 2019, 01:40:02 PM
Pray, tell?

This article on Wiki gives a good version of events, plus an alternative reading - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_interpretations_of_The_Wonderful_Wizard_of_Oz (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_interpretations_of_The_Wonderful_Wizard_of_Oz)

All of which really just shows that people can (and will) read into it whatever they want - also cf. Jim Muro's Street Trash.  Sometimes a film is just about alcoholic tramps melting into a shitter, and playing catch with a dismembered cock and nothing more.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: St_Eddie on July 25, 2019, 01:49:39 PM
This article on Wiki gives a good version of events, plus an alternative reading - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_interpretations_of_The_Wonderful_Wizard_of_Oz (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_interpretations_of_The_Wonderful_Wizard_of_Oz)

All of which really just shows that people can (and will) read into it whatever they want - also cf. Jim Muro's Street Trash.  Sometimes a film is just about alcoholic tramps melting into a shitter, and playing catch with a dismembered cock and nothing more.

Ah, okay.  Thanks for the link.  I read a couple of paragraphs and that was enough.  Film studenty wanky bollocks.  No, thanks.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Dex Sawash on July 26, 2019, 12:20:20 PM
Yes, astonishingly, there is a way to make The Lion King even more shite.

Elton John's new lyrics "too cynical"
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: EOLAN on July 26, 2019, 04:12:10 PM
Elton John's new lyrics "too cynical"

Tim Rice's lyrics surely - or maybe Elton got good old Bernie to do his own spin on them.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: EOLAN on July 30, 2019, 11:23:48 AM
Well I saw it.

From the opening; well the photo realistic images were quite underwhelming. I mean the images as in stills were fine but the movements were very computer and not very realistic. Especially the giraffes. As stated in some podcasts; you lost a lot of the emoting in the animals; particularly the lions with the same expression whether they be angry, playful, sad, dead. Also a lot harder to tell the character apart. Donald Glover was very erm, meh; especially when he had to sing. The Beyoncé song seemed to just be a rip-off of circle of life with a little ballady bit in the middle. A lot of the time watching feeling like what was the point having seen the original. The hyenas weren't as humorous this time either.

On the positives. Billy Eichner was excellent and Seth Rogen was surprisingly decent. Somewhat restrained and not much of his chat-show laugh. There part in "Can You Feel the Love (In this Sunlight)" was so much better than Glover and Knowles-Carter. John Oliver maybe not quite as dynamic as Rowan Atkinson but was decent especially when he was being faded out/ignored. While the animal imagery was underwhelming some of the landscape shots were quite good.

Overall; I felt while the film is about how Scar takes over the kingdom from Mufasa and ruins it; I do wonder if the film is anti-monarchy by showing the land of Pumba and Timon seemingly being managed like a co-operative without any ruler being perfectly and beautifully maintained without any threat of  the wrong successor taking over. Although I do support Scar offering an opportunity to the neglected lower classes of the hyenas from a moral viewpoint.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Twed on July 30, 2019, 04:59:57 PM
Do any of the cats in this get cancer?
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: EOLAN on July 30, 2019, 05:51:30 PM
Do any of the cats in this get cancer?

Maybe testicular cancer; because they all seem to have fallen off.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: C_Larence on August 01, 2019, 10:26:07 AM
Do any of the cats in this get cancer?

SPOILERS:

In the post credits scene, Simba and Beyoncé’s baby is born, and as the camera pans over him being held aloft by rikishi on pride rock, a white glow emanates from his left eye, seemingly hinting at retinoblastoma and methinks a possible sequel
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Replies From View on August 01, 2019, 10:30:38 AM
What kind of animal would Marie Curie be portrayed as, do you reckon?
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: thecuriousorange on August 01, 2019, 08:43:01 PM
rikishi

... who proceeds to do a "stinkface" on a photo-realistic depiction of Elton John.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Golden E. Pump on August 01, 2019, 09:47:17 PM
I love it in the future when they go to give Moira Kelly an award and Kanye will be on stage saying 'yo I'mma let you finish bitch but Beyoncé had the best Nala voice all goddamn time yo'.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Twed on August 02, 2019, 12:52:38 AM
SPOILERS:

In the post credits scene, Simba and Beyoncé’s baby is born, and as the camera pans over him being held aloft by rikishi on pride rock, a white glow emanates from his left eye, seemingly hinting at retinoblastoma and methinks a possible sequel
Do you think any of the cats had cancer at the beginning of the movie?

Please, this is important.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: druss on August 03, 2019, 11:27:02 AM
Did anyone else laugh when Scar confessed and they did the flashback? I know it was in the original but it just seemed weirdly comical and took the tension out of the scene in this one.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Replies From View on August 03, 2019, 11:34:21 AM
Next time why don’t they just film it using real lions?  The BBC used a real-life Aslan in 1980s Narnia and it looked fine.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: BritishHobo on August 03, 2019, 03:14:07 PM
Is that lion still working today?
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Replies From View on August 03, 2019, 05:14:15 PM
Is that lion still working today?

In Bob Mortimer's youth, yes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CY4bGJJD_hQ

(https://external-preview.redd.it/V9iPgOGwudCx4NLvgAeUp1hSEGlDPVy4vEf1MA0PKYY.jpg?auto=webp&s=0802f30f78d46afcfad3f774e29144cf2a9772b9)
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: idunnosomename on August 03, 2019, 07:06:20 PM
Did anyone else laugh when Scar confessed and they did the flashback? I know it was in the original but it just seemed weirdly comical and took the tension out of the scene in this one.

hope they referenced this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmPmpUTr22c
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: thecuriousorange on August 11, 2019, 08:27:43 PM
I saw it and the only affect was reminding me the cartoon was good.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: thecuriousorange on August 11, 2019, 10:15:14 PM
And these are actual images of the upcoming Lady and the Tramp.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EBc45ziW4AI1tDC?format=jpg&name=900x900)
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Twit 2 on August 12, 2019, 01:12:39 PM
Aye.  Ridley Scott talked about this in a recent intereview with Vulture...

I agree with this 100%.  I've long said the art of popcorn movie making is dead, generally speaking.  By and large, they're not movies anymore; they're bland sausages, designed by committee and focus tested to death, in order to offend no-one and appeal to everyone, rolling down a conveyor belt and straight into the consumer's mouth.  To an extent, populist entertainment has always been this way, but there used be different flavoured sausages; ones with herbs; others with spices.  They'd have a unique flavour and certain people would prefer certain styles of sausages to others.  Nowadays, all the sausages are the same; pale and without taste.  If you've had one, you've had them all.

If the studio could find a way to not actually make the movie, they would. The production stage is just an inconvenient part of the selling process.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Replies From View on August 13, 2019, 01:46:33 PM
The annoying thing about CGI animals is not being able to console yourself that they are dead by now.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Crabwalk on August 15, 2019, 11:10:02 PM
What they’ve done to ‘Be Prepared’ is a fucking disgrace.

Entirely fitting though, since they’ve removed all the fun and personality from Scar and the hyenas.

‘Be Prepared’ to wish you were watching the original.
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: rue the polywhirl on August 15, 2019, 11:33:13 PM
What’s the most desperate CGI remake Disney could do before they have to finally come up with an original story. Bambi? Song of the South? Hercules? Fantasia with photorealistic Mickey Mouse, shoe-shining satyrs and ballerina hippoes and ostriches?
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: idunnosomename on August 16, 2019, 11:41:28 AM
photorealistic Inside Out
Title: Re: Lion King remake
Post by: Replies From View on August 16, 2019, 11:42:43 PM
photorealistic Inside Out

And it’s 85 minutes of that baboon in The Fly.