Redundancy/being interviewed for own job

[Paul Calf]

Completely agree with this. Making you reapply for your own job is a cunts trick and unnecessary given you've already been doing the job. They should have a skills matrix assigned to the role and use your past performance to guide the outcome in the context of that. Making you all perform like monkeys indicates they either have no idea what they're doing or what you do on a daily basis, or they're cunts.

Wish you all the best for it but definitely look for another job regardless of the outcome. 

Also, make it clear at the exit interview that this is why you are leaving. 

[TrenterPercenter]

So where I work there are three people. One of them will be made redundant due to reduced funding. We will each be interviewed, two people will keep their jobs, the other person won't.

Yep been through exactly this.  My colleague went off on maternity leave and they got someone in who was really good, they then kept her on but then the funding dropped someone was going to have to leave.

Depends do you want redundancy and is it any good? In my situation I'm pretty sure they had already made their decisions based on performance and were just doing the interviews as a formality.  Absolutely DO NOT QUIT as someone said up thread that is the stupidest thing you can do as you will lose your redundancy AND access to social security for a time.  If you did just want to leave though you could say you would consider redundancy if they were to offer it and save them bothering with the interviews (it will be something that they will have thought about and are likely hoping someone offers) - but be clear you are not quitting you are being made redundant.

Otherwise just go for and give it your best shot : )

[gilbertharding]

Surely you all already know who it is that's going to get it, don't you?

I echo the posters who say start looking for another job now, and leave once you've got one even if you're 'successful' in keeping your current job.

[sevendaughters]

I went through this in August. 4 fixed term staff interviewed for 2 more one year fixed term roles. They asked everyone the same questions (we all checked in) about what positive changes we've brought to the role, what we would identify as a change we would make in order to please this one external measure of success, and examples of times where I overcame a challenge or successfully integrated graduate outcomes in the role.

It was, as it probably reads, pure bullshit. The outcome was all 4 of us got a 6 month extension. So more bullshit.

[H-O-W-L]

Do not quit before they give you the marching order, unless the job is utter shit (and I mean utter shit; I worked at Tesco and people who got made redundant made away with a few grand in one big whack for being redundantdeded from part-time service in far shitter roles than what you probably do) the redundancy payment will be a packet and, touch wood, will hopefully at least help tide you over for any gap between this job and your next.

But absolutely do look for another job and do fuck them over with a tactical exit for this. They are a meteor shower of cunts for doing this to you, especially inside a charity structure. Cunt's game that wastes time and makes managers look like they're doing their fucking job. They might as well hold a sodding employment tombola like Arstotzka.

Fuck, when I was in Tesco and they made a bunch of people redundant in January they hired half the pricks back at the end of the summer because they realized all the new-hires had fucked off to Uni and couldn't do the job anyway!

[Gurke and Hare]

the redundancy payment will be a packet

I think it's more likely to be the statutory minimum.

[H-O-W-L]

I think it's more likely to be the statutory minimum.

If it is then desk poo is the only answer.

[Key]

Fuck, when I was in Tesco and they made a bunch of people redundant in January they hired half the pricks back at the end of the summer because they realized all the new-hires had fucked off to Uni and couldn't do the job anyway!

They are idiots. Years ago I got fired by them, re-hired in a different job role with them (but with less contracted hours) got a lump sum of a few grand as a loss of earnings payment. My new job entailed so much overtime I was earning even more than before and it wasnt before long that even my contracted hours were restored.

[Cuellar]

[Pranet]

Surely you all already know who it is that's going to get it, don't you?

I echo the posters who say start looking for another job now, and leave once you've got one even if you're 'successful' in keeping your current job.

All three of us think we are going to be the person for the chop. I really don't know who they are going to go for.

One of us is saying fuck it even if they keep the job they might well not be around long. There are other shitty aspects of this I haven't gone into.

[WhoMe]

Not got any helpful advice but best of luck.

If all else fails tell them you are 100% faithful.

[Pranet]

So I got the job. Genuine thanks for those of you who offered help with the interview. It seems they did go by the interview in the end. Because the person who it would cost them to most to get rid of is getting the chop.

So I sort of wish I didn't get the job.

It is going to be terrible. More weekend working, 2 people doing the job of 3, also a deputy manager at a another location is also going so we will have to take on some of her work. I don't know how it is going to go. It is unclear how they expect us to be able to take annual leave even.

But also the person going, I've worked with her for years and years. Honestly can't imagine not seeing her regularly. It isn't as if we always got on swimmingly- at times she has annoyed the fuck out of me, and me her, but we have been through a lot over the years, in work and out, and as a result we do talk about stuff which is going on in our lives and generally we are going to miss each other. Me more than her if I'm honest, but she did say before the decision had been made "I don't want you to go" so you know. Lots of tears this last week. Less selfishly, I hate seeing how upset she is about this.

But mainly me. I'll miss her really badly, generally speaking I'll be doing lots of lone working, which had made me physically ill with anxiety in the past, the working weekends will make it harder for me to see friends and family, and someone I've know all the time I've been working here is going. One of my best friends died suddenly last year, parents are dead now, feeling really isolated. Fear I'm going to go a bit odd.

Sorry just wanted to put this down somewhere.

[Brian Freeze]

Aw, no, that sounds rough Pranet.

You know this already but please tell us on here when you're feeling rough and down as that will hopefully be helpful, there's some smashing people here with sometimes great advice.

[Ferris]

Really sorry to read this, @Pranet.

I work in the same sector and cuts/budget increases (aka the ability for me to do my work) seem to be at the whim of newspaper headlines.

Hope all is well, this seems like the best outcome but tbh I'd be looking for a different gig if they're willing to fuck everyone around like that.

[DrGreggles]

I worked at a hospital a few years ago and different departments would tender contracts to outsource the workforce - generally the only consideration was price. One of these was the networking team, who fell under the IT department, but were employed directly by Company A, who had won the IT tender.
Company A's contract was up for renewal, but Company B were cheaper, so they got the gig. Ordinarily there would be a straight transfer of the worker's contracts, but Company B were notoriously thrifty and decided to use the opportunity to reduce the networking team from 14 people to 12, so everyone was told they had to reapply for their jobs.
None of them applied. Cambridge is one of the biggest IT hubs in the country and network engineers are always in demand - something that Company B didn't take into account.
Company B had to bring in a team of expensive contractors (including some of those who had left, as they knew the infrastructure), which blew through their annual staff budget in 6 months, then tried to renegotiate their contract.
Long story short, Company A are now back.

The moral of the story is: any employer who makes someone reapply for their own job is a cunt, and you should get out as soon as possible.

[Asclepius]

I know it's very mixed feelings that you've kept the role Pranet, but do remember that it's much, much easier to find another job when you already have one. The attitude and confidence for someone turning up for interview who wants to be won over by a new offer/role allows you to get through these things far easier than if you're panicking about money/rent etc.

[Glebe]

Sorry to hear it what you've been through Pranet, love and hugs.

[Deano]

So I got the job. Genuine thanks for those of you who offered help with the interview. It seems they did go by the interview in the end. Because the person who it would cost them to most to get rid of is getting the chop.

So I sort of wish I didn't get the job.

It is going to be terrible. More weekend working, 2 people doing the job of 3, also a deputy manager at a another location is also going so we will have to take on some of her work. I don't know how it is going to go. It is unclear how they expect us to be able to take annual leave even.

But also the person going, I've worked with her for years and years. Honestly can't imagine not seeing her regularly. It isn't as if we always got on swimmingly- at times she has annoyed the fuck out of me, and me her, but we have been through a lot over the years, in work and out, and as a result we do talk about stuff which is going on in our lives and generally we are going to miss each other. Me more than her if I'm honest, but she did say before the decision had been made "I don't want you to go" so you know. Lots of tears this last week. Less selfishly, I hate seeing how upset she is about this.

But mainly me. I'll miss her really badly, generally speaking I'll be doing lots of lone working, which had made me physically ill with anxiety in the past, the working weekends will make it harder for me to see friends and family, and someone I've know all the time I've been working here is going. One of my best friends died suddenly last year, parents are dead now, feeling really isolated. Fear I'm going to go a bit odd.

Sorry just wanted to put this down somewhere.

It's a crap situation, but now you are "safe" it's important to push back if they're demanding more from you than can be done in the hours you have. Ask the question "what do I need to stop doing?" - they've cut resource by 33%, they should being expecting 33% less delivered. Try and get an answer as to what that should be. Doesn't need to confrontational, but it's important to be clear that some things will have to stop.

[robhug]

If I was getting interviewed for my own job there isn't a fucking cat in hells chance Id get it, so well done on getting yours.

[Pranet]

Speaking to the others I think it was decided by who was the most nervous at the interview. Bizarrely, because I am pretty permanently anxious, it seems I was probably the least nervous of the three. Very silly way to make this sort of decision. I wouldn't have got rid of the person they got rid of. If only because the two people left like her more than they like each other. So further disruption is more likely.

One of the annoying things about this situation is that I'd been thinking about things and was in an ok place mentally before this happened. Was thinking, job isn't too bad, and leaves me time and energy enough to enjoy rest of my life, so try to have a good time. This has bollocked that up. Though I can feel Marcus Aurelius and Boethius looking down on me and saying, well, what did you expect?

[AliasTheCat]

I'm glad to hear that you got the job Pranet and I'm sorry for your woes.

I know first-hand how incredibly unpleasant, stressful and anxiety-inducing a situation like this can be having had the same thing done to my department a few years ago.

The whole thing was drawn out over years but was pushed through during the first lockdown. Only two of us survived the cull (fortunately for me the other survivor was hands-down my favourite colleague) and needless to say that the result has not been what was promised and over the last couple of years all the vaunted changes and improvements to the department have fallen away and we're left doing the same thing we did before but with substantially fewer of us.

I'm now almost completely burned out and incredibly resentful of my employer- I am still working there though because the effort of finding something else has been too much to face and my self-confidence has taken quite a beating, though that's hopefully starting to change.

One of the things I'm only now starting to accept is the need to talk to my managers to assert what I need to be able to function in my job, and that's only because of how bad it's gotten- otherwise I'm a "turn up and get on with it and don't make a fuss" kind of person, so I'd echo what Deano and Asclepius have said above, though I realise how difficult it can be.

Also, stupid as it sounds, I hope you know that you did not create this situation and are not responsible for its shitty outcome.

Wishing you all the best

[Spudgun]

1) Do 'new' job for a bit.
2) Complain a lot about workload since restructuring.
3) Resign, citing mental health issues caused by interview process and restructuring.
4) Sue for constructive dismissal.

Not legal advice, obviously, and I know that looks flippant written down like that. But being forced to re-apply for your own job (as long as you'd been doing it for years) used to be an automatic open-and-shut case of constructive dismissal.

Commiserations either way.

[Pranet]

Helpfully, the other person left is the sort of person to grumble about things so that will be helpful when dealing with managers etc.

The old cv has been dusted off for the first time in years. I won't rush into anything- unless the situation becomes utterly intolerable- but I will be keeping an eye out.

Anyone know if potential new employers still ask old employers how many sick days you have had? Back in the day that used to be a common question on application forms. But I wondered if asking that was still legal. Reason being, my sickness record is pretty good but a few tactical sick days might be in order, if they won't bugger up my chances of getting a different job.

[TheAssassin]

The level I'm working at is at the bottom, just a support worker. There is a form of words on the redundancy policy about the interview, something like "skills and values based" (I don't have the information with me right now but can get it if needed). Asked about what they could tell us about the interview and was told there will be 6-8 questions which will be scored. If you think you can tell me anything, great thank you.

Skills and value based?  In other words, are you able to recycle funding to keep us employed, yet not actually help the homeless situation?  I have seen these organisations inside and out, same people, different funding, different company name.  Get a new direction for yourself.

[Pranet]

There are genuine questions to be asked about the role of supported housing and of the organisations that supply it but I've always tried my best and so have most of the people I've worked with. Not saying I'm perfect but I've always tried to help people. Thanks for the career advice though.

[Ignatius_S]

Helpfully, the other person left is the sort of person to grumble about things so that will be helpful when dealing with managers etc.

The old cv has been dusted off for the first time in years. I won't rush into anything- unless the situation becomes utterly intolerable- but I will be keeping an eye out.

Anyone know if potential new employers still ask old employers how many sick days you have had? Back in the day that used to be a common question on application forms. But I wondered if asking that was still legal. Reason being, my sickness record is pretty good but a few tactical sick days might be in order, if they won't bugger up my chances of getting a different job.

If they do, they shouldn't be!

During the application phase, generally speaking, employers should not ask about disability or health - asking how many sick days an applicant has had, would obviously fall under this.

However, there are specific circumstances where an employer is able to ask about health and/or disability. For instance, as part of my application process, if I'm guaranteeing an interview for anyone who considers themself to have a disability and who meets the criteria for the whole, then inviting people to disclose that in some way is permitted.

Once a job offer is made (or conditionally made) these kind of things can be discussed. From a recruitment point of view, days off ill or incidences of absence, aren't fantastically illuminating in themselves.

[Pranet]

I did wonder. As I say, I remember seeing the question on application forms, and somehow I remember seeing a document about making recruitment decisions that said they wouldn't consider someone with over x number of days off in the last year. But the more I thought about this the dodgier it seemed legally, considering how careful I hear companies are about what they say in references for old employees.

[Ignatius_S]

I did wonder. As I say, I remember seeing the question on application forms, and somehow I remember seeing a document about making recruitment decisions that said they wouldn't consider someone with over x number of days off in the last year. But the more I thought about this the dodgier it seemed legally, considering how careful I hear companies are about what they say in references for old employees.

It did used to be standard, for sure. Personally, if I saw something like that (even if it was allowed), I would think 'do I really want to work for a place like that?'

Days off is such a crude measurement. If someone has had time off the previous year solely due to both parents passing away, for instance, I wouldn't be thinking 'poor commitment to the company.' There can be an attitude of 'I must come in even if I'm really well' with some people, where in my experience, they can be spreading germs around and potentially making others unwell, prolonging how long they are ill for and/or making themselves more unwell and have to take off more time than if they had gone off sick in the first place.

Going back to my first point, I would also stress - apologies if this is stating the obvious, but I find a lot of people overlook it - that recruitment process works both ways; you're working out whether you would like to work for them. Keeping this in mind, I think helps keeping positive about it and help people find roles that they would actually like to do.