A thread for moaning on and on about how the Marvel films are shite

[Mister Six]

Go on, get it out of your systems in here, you tedious bastards.

"Ooh, I watch proper cinema."

Well go start a thread about that then, and stop saying the same thing over and over every time a Marvel thread starts.

Jesus.

[popcorn]

I think the Marvel films are fine and I think all the moaning about them is daft.

I've only seen three of them ever. The last one I watched was one of the Spider-Mans and I thought it was a bit boring - but less boring than the raft of other big-budget action films that come out every year.

It used to be that a film like Superman or Jaws would come out, and it would have decent special effects and a snappy script and glamorous people, and everyone would have a good time and make loads of money - and then they'd make a sequel but it wouldn't be as good but still make money, so they'd do another one, and another one, and before you know it you're filming something completely dysfunctional in Stoke on Trent on a budget of fifty quid making one of the worst films of all time. Marvel have fixed that. You know what you're getting with a Marvel and it's going to be fine.

Crowdpleasing blockbuster movies are, on the whole, so much better than they used to be. Marvel films work. The kids love em. Your dad loves em. The cinemas love em. I'd resent them too if I felt I was losing out somehow, but every year more interesting films come out than I ever get round to watching, and it's easier to find them than ever before in history. What's the problem?????

[Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth]

I've only seen three of them ever. The last one I watched was one of the Spider-Mans and I thought it was a bit boring - but less boring than the raft of other big-budget action films that come out every year.

Ah. I'm afraid you are wrong: You have actually watched all of them, because it is impossible to not watch any of them, because then you wouldn't know what was happening in the next one - even though you don't want to watch the next one.

[ImmaculateClump]

It's a fair comment.
I watched "Iron Man" when that came out and thought "yep, I can see the appeal, but that's enough for me"
Haven't thought about a marvel film since.
It was as simple as that.

[chveik]

"Ooh, I watch proper cinema."

Well go start a thread about that then, and stop saying the same thing over and over every time a Marvel thread starts.

those threads get very little engagement, there's a reason why most people don't bother anymore

[Dex Sawash]

I'm quite pleased that they are not good but will not go on and on

[Dex Sawash]

Is there a new one?

[Goldentony]

fuckin what a load of fuckin crap

[Goldentony]

I feel like ive seen load of these things at the actual cinema and then on the otherr hand I also like Lancelot Du Lac and Savage Water so where do I feel on the ponce-o-meter, what are we trying to achieve here

[bgmnts]

I still haven't seen a Marvel film that is better than the older blockbuster classics yet, e.g Jaws, Empire Strikes Back, Matrix etc.

[Goldentony]

on one hand is Spider Man - Summer Vacation better than Mother Joan Of The Angels, how are we supposed to start this

[Goldentony]

THOR or ORDET

[sevendaughters]

It would make my life that much easier and pleasurable if the mainstream fare was good. I have a job with odd hours and love to spend a couple of hours with a film. Plus, I like comics, and think you can distill some of that metaphysical probing and thought into Hollywood product (that arguably is its genius). Look at Robocop. End of examples.

I just don't feel that these films work beyond the level of spectacle, and feel very strongly that they're too alike to warrant so much brainspace. It is, if I am being generous, an interesting narrative feat that leads to Endgame. But I don't think it does anything particularly interesting when those 20-odd narrative threads come together. Order, situation, order restored.

Part of my distaste is toward fan culture. I came of age in the 90s where you didn't get on a soapbox about literally the most popular shit on earth. You had humility that your tastes were amply catered to while we obscurantists had to trawl the towns for certain records or second gen VHS tapes. The system worked and now it is broken.

Thing is though, I teach film. My students love this shit, and I quite like them as it goes. So I try and be all objective and see it maybe as a path to liking other stuff (as well, not instead of). It's a tough road, though. The rare pleasures of an Ealing or an Ozu are much more remote after 60+ hrs of franchise cinema as soft power arms race.

Still, I'll go on.

[Bently Sheds]

I love a good blockbuster film, I've seen nearly all the Marvels and kind of enjoyed them then immediately forgot them. Like most things, the worst thing about Marvel is the fandom. The second worst thing is, because of their success, now everything has to have a Cinematic Universe

[Bently Sheds]

Double post. Marvel sequal. Ignore.

[Kermit the Frog]

Really the very worst thing about the whole Marvel thing is the fans, the films themselves are essentially harmless, the corporation that makes them is avaricious and evil but everybody knows that, but the fans are insane, across the whole internet not just on here. One of the side effects of a previously somewhat fringe property going mainstream is that the fans still hold the emotional constitution of an insecure subculture rather than the most mainstream of the mainstream, which is what this stuff is now and has been for almost a decade. So there's always an Olympian level resentment at play, to the degree that it's hard to make even the most vague of equivocal comments about the Marvel films without 3-4 people getting right up your arse. So why not just be openly contemptuous of the franchise, the reaction will be largely the same however you play it, even if you couch your reservations tactfully you'll still get multiple weird, shirty reactions. I've certainly been guilty of poking the hornet's nest a bit on this topic by saying more flagrantly provocative things but I can honestly say that this is because I find the sensitivity around this subject really very bewildering and bizarre. I mean this kind of mass dispositional delicacy about something completely validated by overwhelming mainstream success is surely quite a new phenomenon.

[phantom_power]

I don't think the sensitivity is necessarily only about flaws in Marvel fans, though there are some that are awful, but also because there is an air of snobbery about a lot of the criticism (not necessarily on here and not all of it) that can put people's backs up. No-one likes being repeatedly told that the thing they enjoy is shit for cunts. And the ubiquity of those films at the moment causes a bigger backlash than other films, which requires a bigger defence.

I am past caring whether people hate the films or not, and there is something to be said for how films are homogenised and blanded out by the success of the Marvel films, but I think that is more down to the other studios being lazy and unadventurous rather than Marvel themselves. It is also a bit dull when people come into threads about the latest film saying how shit Marvel films are as if that hasn't been said a million times before.

[Old Nehamkin]

Are threads about specific Marvel films only allowed to contain positive comments, then? That doesn't seem to apply to any other film that gets discussed on here but if that's the new rule then OK.

Something something Martin Scorsese.

[Kermit the Frog]

And the ubiquity of those films at the moment causes a bigger backlash than other films, which requires a bigger defence.

I take the rest of what you've said as fair comment, but this is where you're wrong. These films do not require, nor benefit from being defended on the internet. They already have the wide cultural acceptance and global success that completely displaces any need to mount a larger campaign to defend them at the grassroots level. Any defence must be taken up with the knowledge and acceptance that you've already won, ten times over, and that there's nothing more to gain.

[madhair60]

happy to be considered a snob when I'm getting called pretentious for expressing disinterest in Captain America

[Jerzy Bondov]

I don't want to know what anybody thinks about anything

[madhair60]

I don't want to know what anybody thinks about anything

I think that's a great approach

[madhair60]

i like this thread because it offers a place to call Marvel films shit even when there isn't one in cinemas

[Shit Good Nose]

Quite happily watched them in the "early days" and really enjoyed Iron Man, Iron Man 3 (I'm one of the few that REALLY liked the Mandarin reveal) and Ant Man, and didn't mind most of the others (although I thought the Thor films were a bit gash), but then I saw Guardians 2 (which I absolutely hated, and I went in with high expectations as I thought the first one was great) and The Last Jedi (I now lump the Marvel and new Skywalker SW films together) in quick succession and it was a toss-up as to which was worse.  I also saw Civil War on blu-ray at the same time and that fight in the airport where you couldn't tell who was fighting who or for what reason, and then the whole film being rendered pointless by a fucking hand-written letter - those broke me.  And now the whole superhero, sci-fi fantasy genre within the Disney realm, and all the DC stuff (which, let's face it, has just copied what Marvel is doing)...nah, it's all completely alienated me.  The last one I saw was Black Panther and, whilst I completely understand how important the film is, I thought that was pretty shit as well - mostly ropey acting, VERY poor CGI and dull as fuck.  I completely avoid them now.

But I know loads of others (including Mrs Nose) still enjoy them, so fine, whatever.  There's still other films being made.  The only real problem I have with them now is that when a bunch of them are released around the same time, they do to tend to completely overrun the cinemas - when I saw Dune a couple of weeks ago, I noted that Shang-Chi was taking up 5 or 6 of the 14 screens - nearly half the cinema - and ALL of the big ones (so we saw Dune in a small screen).  I can't remember if it's next year or 2023, but I seem to remember there are two or three Marvel films coming out in very quick succession, along with another DC film and another Star Wars film, all coming out around the same time and all that will mean that a lot of other films are going to have a much shorter time in the multiplex, if they ever get there at all.

i like this thread because it offers a place to call Marvel films shit even when there isn't one in cinemas

Shang-Chi

Eternals

[Josef K]

I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting them to be better.

Logan, though not MCU, is a genuinely brilliant movie and Thor: Ragnarok has shown the benefits of straying from the cut and paste formula and spending a bit of time on the visual identity of the film. I don't think it's snobbery at all.

Considering the movies are fucking everywhere, to the detriment of non-cgi-smashy films that get hardly any time at the cinema, there are a lot of valid complaints.

[bgmnts]

I don't want to know what anybody thinks about anything

I dont think I'm arsed either. Critics are self important shiters.

[colacentral]

I don't think the sensitivity is necessarily only about flaws in Marvel fans, though there are some that are awful, but also because there is an air of snobbery about a lot of the criticism (not necessarily on here and not all of it) that can put people's backs up. No-one likes being repeatedly told that the thing they enjoy is shit for cunts. And the ubiquity of those films at the moment causes a bigger backlash than other films, which requires a bigger defence.

I am past caring whether people hate the films or not, and there is something to be said for how films are homogenised and blanded out by the success of the Marvel films, but I think that is more down to the other studios being lazy and unadventurous rather than Marvel themselves. It is also a bit dull when people come into threads about the latest film saying how shit Marvel films are as if that hasn't been said a million times before.

It's also the way that the comments are always about the same tired talking points outside of the content of the film itself.

I don't even particularly like them myself. I think they're fine and fun to speculate on from a comic fan perspective, but after watching them once at the cinema, I usually think "that was okay" and don't need to see them again. Criticism of the content is fine by me - I thought Black Widow was diabolically bad.

It's the particular kind of tone from some people that reminds me of how teenagers react to people liking things that are below them, with a nose laugh and a "You like that?"

If you had people going into the wrestling threads or the doctor who threads saying "they still making this shit yeah? You know this isn't art, right?" they'd rightfully be considered a cunt.

[Dex Sawash]

Any point in seeing Logan if I haven't seen any other X-people things/dgaf about superfilms?

[bgmnts]

Any point in seeing Logan if I haven't seen any other X-people things/dgaf about superfilms?

Probably not really.

I like the black and white visuals though.

[Old Nehamkin]

For the hell of it, here are my reviews of all the marvel films I have seen (all of them at the cinema on release):

Iron Man 2: Quite baffling. Robert Downey Jr. has a couple of charming quips but I couldn't get a handle on what the central conflict was at all. The climax was just iron man and another guy flying around for a while and then it just arbitrarily ended. Nice to see Gary Shandling though! 2/5

Avengers Assemble: Fairly likeable, dynamic and well-paced with skilful character stuff and solid, coherent dramatic stakes. The light, irreverent tone and snappy comic dialogue still felt relatively refreshing back in 2012. The film does suffer from Joss Whedon's rather workmanlike, TV-style direction though, and I would have liked some more colour and visual grandeur.  3.5/5

Guardians of the Galaxy: Pretty fun! 3.5/5

Doctor Strange: By-the-numbers origin movie which felt very complacent and inconsequential to me. The whole experience just feels like a kind of housekeeping admin exercise to shore up the roster a bit for future crossover entries, lacking any particular sense of verve or joy or self-assertion on its own terms. If the MCU didn't exist and you released this as a standalone movie, I think it would probably just be shrugged at and forgotten about, and I think that's a decent test to apply to these movies. 2/5

Guardians of the Galaxy 2: Very meagre and constrained compared to the freewheeling space caper fun of the first entry. Basically feels like an extended sitcom episode. The golden priestess lady was cute. 2/5

Spiderman Homecoming: I liked Spiderman when he was a scrappy underdog with the world against him, not a sort of provincial deep state agent who's chatting to iron man every 5 minutes and has an inspector gadget suit. 2.5/5

Avengers Infinity War: Impressive enough for what it is. Hats off to them, they had a pretty ambitious plan for this story arc and they seem to have more or less pulled it off. An organisational triumph for the ages. The cinematography is still quite drab and muddy for my tastes and Thanos's plan is so abjectly stupid and adolescent in its mentality that it does undercut the gravitas they're trying to go for with that character a bit.  3/5