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Involuntarily Celibate rebranding

Started by bgmnts, June 30, 2022, 11:09:25 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: Johnny Yesno on June 30, 2022, 07:42:53 PMI didn't choose to read it any particular way. Never mind. You always nail the tone you're aiming for and everyone else simply isn't reading what you write properly. Got it.

No the same people making the same accusations and dressing it up as if it is "everyone" again and again.  It is completely bonkers what you are implying just think about it for a minute.

QuoteGenuine lol at this, though.

Yes it's funny isn't it.  See you can choose to look on the lighter side of things : )

flotemysost

Quote from: Zero Gravitas on June 30, 2022, 11:51:04 AMAcnecel, Arabcel, Autistcel, Baldcel, Beancel, Blackcel, Chincel, Christocel, Countrysidecel, Currycel, Cutecel, Cybercel, Denialcel, Dickcel, Disabledcel, Earcel, Emcel, Escortcel, Ethnicel, Eyecel, Fakecel, Fatcel, Femcel, Femcel-lite, Framecel, Francel, Gymcel, Haircel, Hapacel, Heightcel, Incompetencel, Intercel, Italiancel, Kinkcel, Lesbocel, Locationcel, Mancel, Manchildcel, Marcel, Medcel, Mentalcel, Mismatchcel, Muslimcel, Nearcel, NEETcel, Noncel, Nosecel, Nymphocel, Oldcel, Persocel, Poorcel, Protocel, PSSDcel, Queercel, Rainbowcel, Ramuscel, Redcel, Ricecel, Semicel, Shycel, Sistercel, Spergcel, Standardcel, STEMcel, Stoicel, Stuttercel, Thincel, Transcel, Truecel, Truefemcel, Turkcel, Uglycel, Voicecel, Volcel, Weebcel, Whitecel, Workcel, Wristcel, Youngcel

IS NO ONE FUCKING!?

I like them blackcels, I like them whitecels
I like them incels, I like them thincels
I like them oldcels, I like them noncels
I like them carrying a little bitty fatcels

I get all the cels, I get all the cels

Johnny Yesno

I've just noticed STEMcel in there. Very witty.

No Paddedcel for those of us carrying extra pounds, though. I am disappoint.

Jockice

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on June 30, 2022, 02:19:02 PMPeople with serious disabilities as such that it would prevent them from having a relationship are generally not looked down on for not being in a relationship, they generally ignored and assumed to not be sexual beings (this is to do with social norms around sex and relationships that are discriminatory to disabled populations).


Well either that or it's assumed they are massive perverts and possible stalkers. Best avoided. There is very little middle ground in 'normal' people's views when it comes to this.

Johnny Yesno

No Softcel either. I guess that would fall under Dickcel.

Bernice

We should go back to calling them "cellists".

touchingcloth

Quote from: Johnny Yesno on June 30, 2022, 10:16:58 PMI've just noticed STEMcel in there. Very witty.

No Paddedcel for those of us carrying extra pounds, though. I am disappoint.

It's a wiki...

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: Jockice on June 30, 2022, 10:17:14 PMWell either that or it's assumed they are massive perverts and possible stalkers. Best avoided. There is very little middle ground in 'normal' people's views when it comes to this.

Yes the other end of the scale is the evil bullshit.  I really loath the way disabled communities never get any mention anymore, sex and race really has been the trend of the last decade people seem to forget the incredibly shit way disabled people still get treated in this country.

Jockice

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on June 30, 2022, 10:34:52 PMYes the other end of the scale is the evil bullshit.  I really loath the way disabled communities never get any mention anymore, sex and race really has been the trend of the last decade people seem to forget the incredibly shit way disabled people still get treated in this country.

Indeed. And I say that as a disabled person in a long-term relationship. But for the reasons discussed above it took me a long time to get there.

But we're not allowed to be angry about this of course. Fuck our feelings, forget our mental health, it's just the way of the world so we can't justifiably complain.

flotemysost

Quote from: Johnny Yesno on June 30, 2022, 10:22:55 PMNo Softcel either. I guess that would fall under Dickcel.

Ramuscel got into the Eurovision semifinals this year, so they're not doing too badly.

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on June 30, 2022, 10:34:52 PMYes the other end of the scale is the evil bullshit.  I really loath the way disabled communities never get any mention anymore, sex and race really has been the trend of the last decade people seem to forget the incredibly shit way disabled people still get treated in this country.

A friend of mine uses a stick and she's had some horrendously intrusive and rude comments from would-be dates because of it. When talking about this recently, someone else we know said something along the lines of "oh well, at least it identifies the dickheads straight away", but fuck that, no one should have to bear that indignity in the first place.

Zero Gravitas

Quote from: flotemysost on June 30, 2022, 10:56:55 PM
Quote...the incredibly shit way disabled people still get treated in this country.

A friend of mine uses a stick...

Thought this was going another way.

madhair60

Quote from: shoulders on June 30, 2022, 01:27:24 PMI could personally go without sex for years (and have done)

hahahaha

Goldentony

cant help with this mate, been a motherfucking baller since day one

Mr Vegetables

I definitely thought I was adjacent to inceldom at uni because my family kept phoning me up and saying "why aren't you having sex with all the girls?" and that made me feel embarrassed that I was inside playing "Su-doc-who," the version of sudoku with the Doctor Whos.

But looking back on it none of it was involuntary at all; I was just running away from these messed up ideas of sexuality I'd ended up internalising. I imagine a fair few incels are in the same place, like playing out this narrative of learned shame they keep being given and reinforced, and which consumes them. If that's true it would be nice if they could have something which makes them feel wanted as people, perhaps where they think about something else instead?

Definitely from my own experience I'm not sure sex is even always at the root of it: it's being forced into a story where you are a useless and worthless person, which becomes your identity. And then you end up like me literally running away from women who want to have it, because you won't have an identity if you do. You can't be the person who never has sex if you go out and have lots of sex! You'd be letting your family down in some unspoken way.

Kankurette

Apologies for oversharing. Feel free to skip.

I can't call myself an incel because I don't identify with the movement. I don't think the term really fits me. And I actually like men - well, some men, I'll be honest, a lot of you scare me (like my ex-stepdad, or a guy I found on Quora who explained that he liked to call men who treated women like human beings instead of property 'cucks'*, or the man who kicked off at me and a bus driver last year and called me a little slag) - and don't think I'm entitled to one, or a girlfriend, or an enbyfriend. I have no desire to kill people who I consider to be more attractive than me. Incels are desperate for girlfriends and yet their hatred of women seethes from every pore. You wonder why they want a girlfriend if they hate women so much. I admit I have a complex about not having had sex in ages and I see myself as unfuckable - I've come close to it but ultimately couldn't go through with it because I'm too paranoid about meeting random people off the internet for sex, like one of my friends used to. And I can't join Killing Kittens because you have to be thin and pretty to join. They won't take fat or overweight people.

A lot of it comes from people making fun of me in high school for being 'frigid' and not having a boyfriend even when I was 11 years old. My high school best friend lost his virginity when he was 13, my brother started having sex with his girlfriend when he was 15 (I kind of figured they were shagging and Mum confirmed it when she'd taken me to the STD clinic), I had other friends in sexual relationships by the time I was in Sixth Form. It made me feel like I had to have sex to fit in, and it ended up with
Spoiler alert
me getting sexually assaulted in a club (it wasn't rape under UK law because the man used his fingers)
[close]
, all because I was desperate to get fucked and throw off the image of me as a sexless creature. I also lost my virginity in the most embarrassing way - in a toilet in the Krazyhouse, to a man I barely knew. I joke about it but it does give me pause. I still have a complex about not being seen as a sexual being and I feel like screaming "I fuck! I am not a virgin! I have had penises inside my vagina! I've had pregnancy scares, for fuck's sake!" I even ended up doing homemade fetish porn because of it. And that's before we get into the fact I've never had sex with a woman.

*In answer to the question 'What does the insult "cuck" mean?', this lovely man answered:
QuoteA cuck, in general terms is someone who lets his wife have sex with other men.

However, in the alt right dictionary (and the way I use it), a cuck is someone who is basically a sell out...someone who hates himself, his gender and his race.

Its someone who hates himself, his race or his gender, and cloaks it in Social Justice Warrior terms. For example, I call a male feminist a cuck simply because he usually chooses to ignore (or actively support) the virulent misandry inherent in the modern feminist movement, and ignores the disadvantages men face in terms of access to services for domestic violence, child custody and discrimination faced in employment due to so called "positive discrimination" in favor of women.

touchingcloth

Quote from: Mr Vegetables on July 01, 2022, 12:00:58 AMI definitely thought I was adjacent to inceldom at uni because my family kept phoning me up and saying "why aren't you having sex with all the girls?"

To make it worse, the person phoning you to ask that was your nephew, 5.

Kankurette

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on June 30, 2022, 10:34:52 PMYes the other end of the scale is the evil bullshit.  I really loath the way disabled communities never get any mention anymore, sex and race really has been the trend of the last decade people seem to forget the incredibly shit way disabled people still get treated in this country.
Afuckingmen. I remember a bit about disability in Our Bodies Ourselves and a lesbian in a wheelchair talking about how people assumed her girlfriend was either a nurse or a pervert with a fetish for disabled women. And part of the reason why I have a complex about being a sexless creature is because I'm autistic.

There's more to ableism than language. And assuming disabled people are all incapable of having sex and/or nobody would WANT to have sex with us is incredibly ableist.

Jockice

Quote from: Kankurette on July 01, 2022, 11:35:14 PMAfuckingmen. I remember a bit about disability in Our Bodies Ourselves and a lesbian in a wheelchair talking about how people assumed her girlfriend was either a nurse or a pervert with a fetish for disabled women. And part of the reason why I have a complex about being a sexless creature is because I'm autistic.

There's more to ableism than language. And assuming disabled people are all incapable of having sex and/or nobody would WANT to have sex with us is incredibly ableist.

I did a thread about this type of thing not long ago. Disability and dating I think it was called. Or maybe the other way round. I've had these experiences too. I can (sort of) laugh about it now. But there's a hell of a lot of hurt still in my system because of it all. But a lot of it comes back to an 'it must be the disabled person's fault' in the minds of many of the 'normal' population. Don't try to chat anyone up, it's because you're not interested in sex or even aware of what it is, try and chat someone up (or even just be friendly to them) and its: "Yuk! Why is that freak making a move on me? I'd better keep away from him or he'll be following me everywhere and molesting me.''

Take it from me, this is no exaggeration at all. I know.




Jockice

#138
And in case of doubt here, I'll just add that every non-disabled person (of whatever gender, sexuality or indeed race) isn't like this. But an awful lot are. It 's taken me by surprise quite a few times just how bigoted some people can be  - and the excuses they use to try and cover it up.

 If you don't want to meet me again - despite saying you'd really enjoyed going for a drink (not even a date) with me previously, 'like meeting an old friend' apparently  -  just say so, don't come out with some obviously untrue bollocks about your mother falling down the stairs a few hours before we were due to meet up for another drink (again not even a date) please. Because that is patronising, condescending, dishonest and an insult to my intelligence. And incidentally, working with disabled people and using all the correct terminology doesn't make you any less prejudiced. I've met plenty of people like you in my life. Think you're doing good work 'helping' us but don't think of us as equals.

That's only one example. I have plenty more.

Mr Vegetables

Quote from: touchingcloth on July 01, 2022, 11:30:27 PMTo make it worse, the person phoning you to ask that was your nephew, 5.

Well, you joke, but when I was a teenager my family sent me to trampolining class with some eight-year-olds, and they were all convinced I was gay and definitely not interested in women. That was my family's real fear, I think, and why they would want me to do normal teenage things like go to a trampolining class for small children

Pink Gregory



Quote from: Kankurette on July 01, 2022, 10:59:17 PM*In answer to the question 'What does the insult "cuck" mean?', this lovely man answered:

fucking HELL

paper thin justification for outright hate.  'Modern feminism'.  As opposed to...traditional feminism?

touchingcloth

People like that just make me want to proudly proclaim my cuckdom from the highest rooftop. It's like when people use socialist as if it's a dirty word.

Kankurette

It's projection. They call left-wing men 'cucks' because one of their biggest fears is 'lesser' men stealing their wives. Because their wives are property, nothing more. They're voiceless things who just want a big strong macho conservative man to keep them in their place. Frankly, if that piece of shit was my husband, damn right I'd cheat on him.

And as an aside, I hate the 'cuck' thing because a man I'm very close to was cheated on by his wife, and I can guarantee it had nothing to do with his politics, but it messed him up. The idea that he was somehow less of a man, that he was unable to keep his wife because he just wasn't man enough, makes me feel sick. As if big alpha right-wing men don't have their wives cheating on them either.

touchingcloth

It's fear of losing the power of the patriarchy to even the smallest extent, too. The balance of power has always been held by men and still is, but the lot of women has improved by small degrees and they spin this as if it's some encroachment on the rights of men.

You see a similar thing with the Christian Right and the rights of gay people to marry and, y'know, not be murdered with impunity. The same view is to see this as an improvement in things for a still marginalised group, but they're afraid of losing their power and influence so instead it becomes an infringement on the rights of straight Christian people. And of course policing people who deviate from hetero norms is an effect of patriarchy, too.

Same thing with the civil rights movement. To the nuttier fringe of the right, this is aimed at trampling down whites rather than lifting up blacks.

White Christian straight men are the most downtrodden group of all.

Paul Calf

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on June 30, 2022, 11:56:35 AMImagine saying I'm involuntary hungry because Greggs won't give you a free pasty.

This is a weird argument for a socialist to make.

Kankurette

And sorry, Trenter, but I can't be empathetic to the incel movement because so many of them hate women, and I AM a woman. They don't even see us as human beings, they just see us as prizes or possessions, something to brag about. I bet anything that if I offered myself up to one of those guys - and note, I'm not talking about your average man who isn't getting any and just happens to be unlucky in love, I'm talking about a very specific mindset - they would turn me down because I'm not pretty or thin or conservative or submissive enough for them.

Touchingcloth, what really gets me is that there are countries in which Christians are persecuted. The US is not one of those countries. But anyone who represents the slightest threat to the establishment = "waaaahh, Christians are being persecuted." And the existence of gay people does not mean you have to change your religion or become gay yourself. (And tbf it's not just Christians who do this, look at the whole Idrissa Gueye/rainbow shirt incident.)

TrenterPercenter


TrenterPercenter

Quote from: Kankurette on July 02, 2022, 11:17:19 AMAnd sorry, Trenter, but I can't be empathetic to the incel movement because so many of them hate women, and I AM a woman.

Don't worry, I'm anti-incel now apparently anyway, was anti-women before for empathising with them and now soon to be anti-socialist for making a comment about Greggs.

Kankurette

I'm not saying you are anti-women. I'm just saying that I find it difficult to empathise with incels because I'm not good at empathising with people who hate me for what I am.

touchingcloth

Yeah, it's a bit like if there was an Islamic movement in Egypt which claimed that any steps to make it less easy to persecute Christians are evidence that it's the Egyptian Muslims who are the most oppressed group, when you think about it.

Quote from: Kankurette on July 02, 2022, 11:17:19 AMAnd sorry, Trenter, but I can't be empathetic to the incel movement because so many of them hate women, and I AM a woman. They don't even see us as human beings, they just see us as prizes or possessions, something to brag about. I bet anything that if I offered myself up to one of those guys - and note, I'm not talking about your average man who isn't getting any and just happens to be unlucky in love, I'm talking about a very specific mindset - they would turn me down because I'm not pretty or thin or conservative or submissive enough for them.

Up until my mid-twenties I was your average unlucky in love man. I'm thankful as fuck that I'm not five or so years younger than I am and have never been particularly "online", because I could totally see how easy it would have been for me to fall down a Reddit incel hole.

I'm not empathetic with incels and their mindset, but I do think it's an extremist view that probably has understandable and addressable causes rather than it just being a group of young men who are beyond help by definition. To be horribly simplistic, it feels like the most obviously misogynistic manifestation of the fact that capitalism has fucked most of us, and these guys choose to view women as the primary cause of their various social, economic, and interpersonal problems.