Graham Linehan Episode XVIII: Help Me Elon Muskenobi, You're My Only Hope

[PlanktonSideburns]

Did these ninjas say they were part of some organisation? Or were they pure batmans

[MigraineBoy]

That speaker yesterday - masked, steampunk glasses, an accent wildly swerving between Irish and American.  Telling "its worse than you think" horror stories about schools.
What the fuck was that about?

[Kankurette]

Agreed that dressing up as ninjas just plays right into the 'look at the bad nasty TRAs threatening us poor ickle women' narrative. OK, people don't want to be identified, so not just wear a face mask? Why do you have to act like an extra from Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles?

[wrec]

Tweet has been deleted

Not surprised after seeing some of the replies calling her a handmaiden, a rape enabler etc.

[retsuza]

One minute she says it was "intimidating", the next it's "unintentionally hilarious", which is it?

Umberto Ecco's defining point of facsism #8:

The enemy is both strong and weak. "By a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak."

[JaDanketies]

In Manchester I can appreciate how we might want to show we are willing to defend LGBT rights with intimidation and aggression. Spirit of the city innit. We're nice if you're nice. Perhaps the optics are awful. But I really can't imagine mancs protesting terfs or the edl or whoever in any nice way. We're very protective of our LGBT community and the point would've been to show the terfs that we are willing to lamp them. Which is a positive message. You're not in Wiltshire any more, you've come from your posh home to come up here to intimidate our trans friends. They should get a worse response everywhere

[madhair60]

Nicely-sized little anti-conversion therapy protest in York yesterday. I've got a pic if anyone's interested. I didn't join in, on the clock, but I did walk around and compliment some of the signs etc, haha.

[Mr_Rich]

In Manchester I can appreciate how we might want to show we are willing to defend LGBT rights with intimidation and aggression. Spirit of the city innit. We're nice if you're nice. Perhaps the optics are awful. But I really can't imagine mancs protesting terfs or the edl or whoever in any nice way. We're very protective of our LGBT community and the point would've been to show the terfs that we are willing to lamp them. Which is a positive message. You're not in Wiltshire any more, you've come from your posh home to come up here to intimidate our trans friends. They should get a worse response everywhere

Yeah, I don't disagree with the sentiment at all but framing things in a context of violence is not the right way forward, especially on an issue that's being presented as 'oppressing women'. The fact that's untrue is irrelevant, it looks incredibly poor if you can frame it as silencing women with threats of violence, it doesn't help the case with anyone not already invested in it.

[pigamus]

Agreed that dressing up as ninjas just plays right into the 'look at the bad nasty TRAs threatening us poor ickle women' narrative. OK, people don't want to be identified, so not just wear a face mask? Why do you have to act like an extra from Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles?

I'm not sure I'd be confident a face mask would be enough. Especially not when the footage gets on YouTube with all these illiberal laws coming in. It's not a fair fight, is it? I think a bit of paranoia on that front is understandable.

[Mr_Rich]

I'm not sure I'd be confident a face mask would be enough. Especially not when the footage gets on YouTube with all these illiberal laws coming in. It's not a fair fight, is it? I think a bit of paranoia on that front is understandable.

You but terrorist chic isn't the answer to that. I guess it's a minor point in the grand scheme of things, it just feels a bit of an own goal to me, but that's just my opinion.

[pigamus]

Yeah but if you're disguising your identity to that extent you're probably going to look intimidating whatever you wear, especially if there's a big group of you. Unless it's bright pink I suppose.

Care Bear costumes, that's the answer long term.

[Ex_GC]

You know how intimidating those particular outfits and masks must look to neutral people who know absolutely nothing about this. It does nothing to dispel the GC narrative

[dead-ced-dead]

I suppose superhero costumes may have been a good idea. Not all of them have total face coverings, but enough do. And it goes down well with "the kidz" (you see, I'm with it).

[Barry Admin]

The inevitable Daily Mail coverage: https://archive.ph/Vs04f

[Pink Gregory]

You know how intimidating those particular outfits and masks must look to neutral people who know absolutely nothing about this. It does nothing to dispel the GC narrative

This is the problem with GC being a largely 'respectable', somewhat middle class movement.  The proponents often already hold somewhat tenured, traditionally respectable positions (columnists, academics, writers) so to the average uninformed person their open bigotry and hatred is incongruous with their actions, which it's why it's advantageous to them to advance their agendas through academia, government, charity etc; and potentially why their demonstrations never seem to amount to much.

It's the equivalent of the be-suited Monday Club or American ultraconservative type.  People defer to the societal conditioning of 'respectability', which is after all why the National Front changed their tactics.

[Zetetic]

And bits of the American Civil Rights Movement, if you want a more salubrious example. If you can appear extremely respectable and non-threatening whilst still provoking your opponents to visible violence, that's very useful for simplifying the morality to external observers. (Of course, the opponents of the CRM were extremely strongly predisposed to violence, so...)

The other side of looking threatening - if you're going to take that tack then you need to be prepared to follow through.

[Ex_GC]

I know I'm bringing the tone down but that video of GL hitting on Holly Lawford-Smith is hilarious

[Zetetic]

Manchester Trans Rise Up's advice about staying safe at (a different) protest for ref:
https://mobile.twitter.com/manc_up/status/1513970489206706179

[MigraineBoy]

Good Lad Lycett will probably feel the wraith of Graham imminently:

https://twitter.com/anniemacmanus/status/1526128482283134977?s=20&t=eSIxLzO93FWQV87LS7DxBg

[Hope of Avalon]

People are tired of respectability politics because they know it doesn't work.

Stonewall was a riot.

[Ex_GC]

People are tired of respectability politics because they know it doesn't work.

Stonewall was a riot.

Stonewall was a riot in response to a police raid, I don't think that's comparable

[Zetetic]

People are tired of respectability politics because they know it doesn't work.

Not the people peacefully protesting about the failure to ban conversion therapy, I guess.

(Although I'm more than prepared to believe that this does more harm than good at the timescales of the next decade or so.)

[retsuza]

William "Nonce" Ferguson is doing his question on twitter and everyone is making fun of him and calling him a cunt

https://twitter.com/SubAetha2/status/1524391672934584321?t=VGixVTg0mOhYIrgumwN3iw&s=19

[Ex_GC]

That's quite the take from him

[DreadedScotsman]

I'm not sure how I feel about the ninja dress code, whilst yes it does play into the transphobes narrative but then it'll be spun that way regardless and this way they avoid being doxxed and harassed. The infamous JK Rowling Ickabog tweet where she went and said the quiet stuff out loud was in reference to an incident where a trans woman was attacked at a protest I think or maybe speakers corner and they defended themselves this was spun as the evil transes attacking a poor defenseless woman, it's a lose lose situation

[Ex_GC]

I'm not sure how I feel about the ninja dress code, whilst yes it does play into the transphobes narrative but then it'll be spun that way regardless and this way they avoid being doxxed and harassed. The infamous JK Rowling Ickabog tweet where she went and said the quiet stuff out loud was in reference to an incident where a trans woman was attacked at a protest I think or maybe speakers corner and they defended themselves this was spun as the evil transes attacking a poor defenseless woman, it's a lose lose situation

What was the infamous Ickabog tweet?

[Kankurette]

The thing with the EDL is as well, they're violent hooligans. They were born out of football firms, remember. I'm not saying TERFs aren't capable of being violent, they are - or they get male allies to do it for them - but in general they're less likely to be coked off their tits, casually attacking people and smashing up shops. There's the respectability angle as well. The EDL are predominantly working-class men, not middle-class (and often middle-aged) women.

[pigamus]

I doubt they'll make that mistake again anyway. You live and learn.

[JamesTC]

What was the infamous Ickabog tweet?

I think it is this one:

[Ex_GC]

Wow!