watching the office for the first time

[paruses]

Watching it for the first time now you can say "it's Jeff out of Peep Show!" in the hiring and firing of the fork lift driver. Have just looked those clips up on YouTube and love Neil Fitz Maurice's performance in the firing.

I thought I would laugh guiltily at Gervais doing his short arms big head bit but think I am just too bored of his obsession with "difference" these days. Definitely laughed at the time though but rest assured I would have laughed ironically , yeah?

That scene seems one where you can separate the Gervais contributions and the Merchant contributions. It's probably just projecting modern day Gervais onto it, though for the main part.

[Jockice]

Yeah, that's a weak bit. I always thought it would've been far funnier if it had only been one of the quieter background characters, or perhaps Lee down in the warehouse.

Here's a tenuous claim to fame. The character whose email Brent calls up is in real life the sister of a bloke who actually was my boss for a while. He's not really a Brent type though, more's the pity.

[Jockice]

He's brilliant. The whole "I've not seen Chuck Norris in Enter the Dragon. I've seen him in Way of the Dragon" is just my dad to a T. He's exactly that pedantic.

It may have been mentioned elsewhere, but Bob Wall is deid.
https://www.radiotimes.com/movies/robert-wall-dead-enter-dragon-newsupdate/

[dead-ced-dead]

It may have been mentioned elsewhere, but Bob Wall is deid.
https://www.radiotimes.com/movies/robert-wall-dead-enter-dragon-newsupdate/

Well, that's a kick to the nadgers. He's a great villain in ENTER the Dragon (Why'd you say Way of the Dragon then?)

[Noodle Lizard]

I'm rewatching the first episode of the second series now (the one with Brent's welcome speech/routine) and I have to commend Gervais's "face acting" during Neil's more popular introduction. Especially the bit where Neil makes a bawdy, homophobic-but-office-acceptable joke about Brent "looking forward to having a whole new group of men underneath him". He gives this quite subtle look which flits from offense to panic and then back to offense again, before glancing at the crowd's positive reaction and trying to play it off. I suppose in hindsight that jab caused him to go off-script at the beginning of his "set", the results of which set the tone for the rest of his performance. It's really well done, that bit.

[Icehaven]

i'm on episode two. it's alright so far, which has surprised me, but all two of the episodes i've watched so far have opened with (roughly) ten minutes of Really Annoying™ celebrity "talking heads" retrospective guff about how "genius" The Office (apparently) is. i've been fast-forwarding through this dross. but i've just had a thought. is this tedious shite some sort of ironic thing that i should actually be watching? is this part of the mockumentary? it's Not Funny™, but i need to know. my time is precious!

That's really odd and annoying, as if everyone watching has seen it before and will appreciate a love-in or if they haven't they need to be told how great it is before they've even seen it. I only got round to watching Seinfeld two years ago having had decades of being told how it's the best sitcom ever, and I think having talking heads reiterate that yet again literally as I was trying to watch it for myself would have been incredibly off-putting.

[Ballad of Ballard Berkley]

It is still possible to watch these programmes as they were originally transmitted.

[dead-ced-dead]

It is still possible to watch these programmes as they were originally transmitted.

I would guess torrents of the DVD rip would be the original versions without talking heads.

[Ballad of Ballard Berkley]

You'd think so, yes.

[Utter Shit]

I think Training Day is up there as one of the best episodes of any comedy. Off the top of my head the only thing I can think of that would rival it is the Spinners and Losers episode of The Thick of It, and maybe Communication Problems from Fawlty Towers. From start to finish it is just perfect with so many incredible moments.

[dead-ced-dead]

I think Training Day is up there as one of the best episodes of any comedy. Off the top of my head the only thing I can think of that would rival it is the Spinners and Losers episode of The Thick of It, and maybe Communication Problems from Fawlty Towers. From start to finish it is just perfect with so many incredible moments.

Brent: (Singing) Ain't going home cause my baby's gone
She's gone.

Gareth: (Singing) SHE'S DEAD!

Brent: She's not dead!

[Ballad of Ballard Berkley]

I think Training Day is up there as one of the best episodes of any comedy. Off the top of my head the only thing I can think of that would rival it is the Spinners and Losers episode of The Thick of It, and maybe Communication Problems from Fawlty Towers. From start to finish it is just perfect with so many incredible moments.

It is, I agree. Brent launching back into Freelove Freeway after the "It's not gay" exchange with Tim is a perfect piece of comic timing. The whole episode is full of moments like that.

[dead-ced-dead]

It is, I agree. Brent launching back into Freelove Freeway after the "It's not gay" exchange with Tim is a perfect piece of comic timing. The whole episode is full of moments like that.

It's also has the best implementation of second hand embarrassment when Tim finally loses it, quits on the spot and leaves only to return, ask Dawn out and get shot down. His backpeddling is so hard to take.

"Oh I know, I meant as a friend."

[Utter Shit]

All of the songs are great, the arguments over the riddles, the hotel role play, the discussion over using stamps as currency, Gareth's ultimate fantasy...so, so good.

[paruses]

Brent: (Singing) Ain't going home cause my baby's gone
She's gone.

Gareth: (Singing) SHE'S DEAD!

Brent: She's not dead!

Yes another vote for best episode. And for that bit I particularly love the annoyance in Brent's voice when he corrects Gareth.

I don't go around quoting The Office but that episode has the most bits I tag on to conversations for my own amusement:

- she's not dead.
- Shouldn't be allowed around animals then.
-... I'm just watching
- get the guitar
- not all complaints will be genuine

And for the last one, at the time, the outrageous complaint was shockingly funny coming at a time when "rape" wasn't commonplace as an hilarious punchline.

[notjosh]

Probably my favourite too. I even love stuff like Brent laughing and applauding the "thank you Mr Noakes" line at the end of that brilliant spoof training video, like he imagines himself the comedy professional tipping his hat to another master practitioner.

And the one-two between Brent and Gareth as they attempt to justify his singing the Diana song to console Dawn:
DAWN: "...in Paris?"
*Brent glances expectantly towards Gareth*
GARETH: "City of love"
*Brent nods sagely; it was never in doubt*

Sorry, just quoting it now, but there really are so many beautiful small moments.

[Noodle Lizard]

I just watched that one again. It's great, easily one of the best (if not the best). Aside from the obvious highlights, I think the content of the actual training seminar is extraordinarily well-observed, as is the bloke playing the mentor Rowan (Vincent Franklin, his name is). The 80s training video with Peter Purves, the shit overhead projector slides (MOTIVATION!), the example Rowan gives of his ultimate fantasy being "owning his own island" (which forces you to imagine what a man as dull as that would even do on his own private island) ... I think it's underappreciated how difficult it is to nail something that utterly boring in a comedy show, it's not something you see often. And it's interesting to contrast that low-level prevalent cringiness of the training seminar with the much more exaggerated antics of Brent, with the employees all seemingly preferring the latter in this instance (except for one brief barely noticeable moment in the background where another employee seems to be asking him how he got into the profession, saying that it looks "quite good fun").

It's very good.

[dead-ced-dead]

It's also a great episode in terms of plot progression, all of which is woven so well.

- Dawn's argument with Lee.
- Tim "quits" to go back to uni (something else very well observed, I work in an office and people Tim's age are always talking about how they'll get another job/go back to uni, they'll 'just give it another year')

[the science eel]

I just watched that one again. It's great, easily one of the best (if not the best). Aside from the obvious highlights, I think the content of the actual training seminar is extraordinarily well-observed, as is the bloke playing the mentor Rowan (Vincent Franklin, his name is). The 80s training video with Peter Purves, the shit overhead projector slides (MOTIVATION!), the example Rowan gives of his ultimate fantasy being "owning his own island" (which forces you to imagine what a man as dull as that would even do on his own private island) ... I think it's underappreciated how difficult it is to nail something that utterly boring in a comedy show, it's not something you see often. And it's interesting to contrast that low-level prevalent cringiness of the training seminar with the much more exaggerated antics of Brent, with the employees all seemingly preferring the latter in this instance (except for one brief barely noticeable moment in the background where another employee seems to be asking him how he got into the profession, saying that it looks "quite good fun").

It's very good.

Right. So is this on iPlayer?

[Noodle Lizard]

No idea. The version on Amazon Prime (in the US anyway) is the same as the DVD versions. The Hulu one is censored.

[Lisa Jesusandmarychain]

Available on YouTube, I would have thought. Or Dailymotion.

[the science eel]

Ta. Got it on iPlayer.

[Menu]

Isn't the climax of the first season Tim getting promoted? And Dawn then watching in horror/sadness as he starts taking and acting a bit like Brent. It was quite shocking at the time I thought, plus it meant they didn't think they'd get another season as it was a perfect ending in terms of structure. Glad they did come back though and simply don't mention what happened.

[Noodle Lizard]

Isn't the climax of the first season Tim getting promoted? And Dawn then watching in horror/sadness as he starts taking and acting a bit like Brent. It was quite shocking at the time I thought, plus it meant they didn't think they'd get another season as it was a perfect ending in terms of structure. Glad they did come back though and simply don't mention what happened.

The first episode of the second series deals with (and largely resolves) that change in Tim, where he rebuffs her invitations to banter or mess around with Gareth etc., but it's not clear whether this is because he's more invested in his work or whether he feels jilted by her rejection. By the end of it, he's given up the cold shoulder and begins his flirting again, which is instantly punctured by Lee violently shoving him up against a wall.

Tim's an interesting character. He's far less of a typical "straight man" than his US equivalent Jim, and is often seen to be kind of pathetic or pitiful, despite his sheen of popularity and "normalcy". He's quite a sad person, really, but he looks well put-together when juxtaposed with Brent and Gareth.

[MrsWarboysLover]

That's the classic difference between US and UK comedy - the UK protagonists are always kind of losers, but in the US they want their comedy main character to be a cool guy.

[Lisa Jesusandmarychain]

That's the classic difference between US and UK comedy - the UK protagonists are always kind of losers, but in the US they want their comedy main character to be a cool guy.

Yep, even Michael Scott's character in the Yank Office becomes actually quite a respected boss by the end; and the show was always at pains to emphasise that he's actually a shit hot salesman, despite appearing to be pretty close to mentally subnormal.

[BeardFaceMan]

Yep, even Michael Scott's character in the Yank Office becomes actually quite a respected boss by the end; and the show was always at pains to emphasise that he's actually a shit hot salesman, despite appearing to be pretty close to mentally subnormal.

Wasn't that a trait for Brent too, though? It's been a while since I've seen the UK Office but wasn't it made clear that Brent is actually good at his job?

[sevendaughters]

there are a couple of strange cutaways where it seems like Brent switches on for the camera after doing some normal managerial stuff, and my read is that it is the presence of the camera crew that are his downfall (or at least his peacocking for them) - you could even argue he's a scapegoat in a shrinking industry.

[paruses]

Wasn't that a trait for Brent too, though? It's been a while since I've seen the UK Office but wasn't it made clear that Brent is actually good at his job?

They hint at past successes from what I remember - like being featured in an industry mag. From what I remember about the American one Michael Scott is a sales savant and saves the day when needed. It sort of refreshes his image whereas Brent's success just makes him look more pathetic. His clout with the guy who hires for the warehouse is treated the same.

Having said that they chose him over Neil at the end of S1 for the management job - which really does make zero sense once Neil is introduced.

[Lisa Jesusandmarychain]

Wasn't that a trait for Brent too, though? It's been a while since I've seen the UK Office but wasn't it made clear that Brent is actually good at his job?

Formerly good at his job for sure, otherwise he wouldnae have risen to his managerial position. There are also a lot of incidences shown of him being complacent in his position to the point of laziness, and more interested in being popular with his staff and being regarded as a hilariously funny guy by his employees, rather than doing his job. It is also abundantly clear that no- one apart from Gareth in that place has any respect for him, whereas a fair degree of respect is incrementally given to Michael Scott as that show progresses. They even give him a big sing - song send off with a little ditty they've all written saying what a great bunch of lads he is, before he fucks off with his future missus who he's been behaving unprofesionally with in the workplace.