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A serial lawbreaking liar - Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson scandal thread 2

Started by Fambo Number Mive, April 19, 2022, 01:46:53 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Rich Uncle Skeleton

Quote from: jobotic on April 20, 2022, 12:48:23 PMHe didn't even answer questions that his fellow Tories asked.

Wasn't meaning to pull you up on anything or contribute to your shit week, sorry. Just questioning who Twitter represents.

nah i'm sorry just having a whine

Blinder Data

Until a credible alternative emerges (Sunak is now tainted) and he loses his touch at the ballot box (consistently bad polling and by-election results), he's not going anywhere.

There's also the war in Ukraine, upcoming Platinum Jubilee and the Queen's deteriorating health in his favour. Johnson is a rat - when backed into a corner, he will chew through anything to survive.

He's off to India so will miss tomorrow's vote on referring his conduct for an investigation; the notion of "cats away, mice will play" might make things slightly interesting. But sadly we're not quite at a November 1990 stage, when Thatcher hubristically went to Paris while fighting a leadership challenge.

Fambo Number Mive

Why hasn't the Chancellor been asked to apologise before the House for his fixed penalty notice?

Fambo Number Mive

QuoteA backbench Tory MP said he walked out of Boris Johnson's meeting with parliamentary colleagues following his Commons apology over partygate because of the PM's "bluster and pantomime"...

Sir Roger, a long term critic of the PM, said: "I stayed for three minutes and left. I didn't storm out in a huff.
"I found the tone of the meeting from the very beginning very different from the tone in the House of Commons.

"I'd gone expecting a serious meeting about serious issues.

"I didn't expect a lot of bluster and pantomime performance and I'm afraid that's what I heard and it seemed to me that my time was better spent doing other things.

"I did not like the tone of the meeting.

"I'm told that the meeting got more serious later and certainly some colleagues asked fairly searching questions.

"But what I heard, I didn't care for too much."

Asked whether he thought the PM did not take the issue seriously enough, Sir Roger said: "I think you could say that, yes."...

https://news.sky.com/story/partygate-boris-johnson-acted-in-heat-of-the-moment-says-minister-as-pm-prepares-for-further-grilling-12594188

Fambo Number Mive

Government in "cowards" shock:

QuoteBut the government has now tabled its own amendment to Labour's proposal, to say a vote on whether they should investigate should wait until the police have concluded their investigations and Ms Gray has published her report.

Conservative MPs will be ordered to vote for it - meaning it is highly likely to pass given the government's Commons majority.

The government said a delay will allow MPs "to have all the facts at their disposal" when they make a decision.

A Labour source said Tory whips "obviously knew that they couldn't vote this down" - adding that any MPs backing the government amendment would be "voting for a cover-up"...

And when will the full Sue Gray report be published? Probably long after Johnson has finally gone. Maybe 2025.


QuoteSpeaking on the flight to Gujarat, Mr Johnson told reporters he will fight the next general election and would not say if there were any circumstances under which he would resign.

"I think the best thing that we can all do is focus on the things that really change and improve the lives of voters and stop talking about politicians," the PM said.

The thing that would really improve the lives of voters would be getting the Tories out and a socialist government in.

Fambo Number Mive


Alberon


TrenterPercenter

Looks like a good bit of work today by Labour.  Chris Bryant was particularly impressive (Starmer not bad either). 

Also thought without spaffer and some o this front bench ghouls parliament was significantly better and dare I say working how it is supposed to work, lots of respectful discussion and you could see some cooperation occurring.  People often forget (including MPs) that parliament is not the government, it is is the sitting body of all MPs regardless of political affiliation set up to scrutinise the government and provide ascent to the governments bills.

jobotic

QuoteBREAKING
No further Partygate updates from Met until after May elections
The Metropolitan Police will not be issuing any further updates about the investigation into parties at Downing Street until after the May elections.

The force says the investigation will still continue during this time - so fines could in theory be issued.

But due to restrictions over communications in the run-up to an election, it will not issue updates.

Nice of them.

Purdah applies to police investigations, does it?

Fambo Number Mive

Gives them some more time to remove bushes and benches from parks like their mates in Kent.

Fambo Number Mive

If you are wondering what Johnson is up to, he's been touring a new JCB facility in Vadodara, Gujarat, owned by Conservative peer Lord Bamford who gave around  £14 million in cash and gifts to the Conservative Party since 2001, as part of his two day visit to India.

QuoteAsked if the PM was embarrassed to visit the factory at a time when the firm was accused of destroying Muslim homes in Delhi at the Supreme Court, the spokesman replied: "I think this is predominantly a matter for the Indian authorities. The PM was asked about this in his clip earlier this morning.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/boris-johnson-flies-4000-miles-26761530

SpiderChrist

Quote from: jobotic on April 21, 2022, 02:27:28 PMPurdah applies to police investigations, does it?

"The pre-election period is designed to avoid the actions of public bodies distracting from or having influence on election campaigns."

Looks like it.

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: SpiderChrist on April 21, 2022, 02:42:37 PM"The pre-election period is designed to avoid the actions of public bodies distracting from or having influence on election campaigns."

Looks like it.

Was going to put this yes it does there is nothing unusual about this (well apart from the fact they are investigating the PM in the first place).

jobotic

They can't be doing photo-ops with candidates, I get that. or endorsing them on private accounts, but they stop making announcements regarding criminal investigations as part of purdah?

Buelligan

It's breaking fresh ground, never had an out criminal government before.

Ferris

It boggles the mind that people will vote for them. I mean, it always did, but now? I just don't understand people.

I suppose when your other options are lib dem or starmer it becomes a very unenviable choice.

Fambo Number Mive

Quote from: Ferris on April 21, 2022, 03:36:41 PMIt boggles the mind that people will vote for them. I mean, it always did, but now? I just don't understand people.

I suppose when your other options are lib dem or starmer it becomes a very unenviable choice.

They appeal to the dog in the manger section of the English public who are happy for things to get worse for themselves as long as other people become even worse off. Sadly I think the dog in the manger section has got larger since the 1980s. A load of little Thatcher lovers.

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: jobotic on April 21, 2022, 03:24:43 PMThey can't be doing photo-ops with candidates, I get that. or endorsing them on private accounts, but they stop making announcements regarding criminal investigations as part of purdah?

It's not criminal investigations - it's anything from a public body that might prejudice a vote, it's that the criminal investigation involves the government that is the issue other criminal investigations will continue to be reported.  The press on the day of the vote will also not be able to refer to anything that might prejudice the vote - that is always what happens.  The whole point of purdah is really so that powerful institutions cannot prejudice the vote it is just on this occasion it helps the government(ish), it is a good thing (purdah in general not the consequences of it this time out).

Flouncer


jobotic

Yes i understand that it's criminal investigations involving the government, not in general. Also agree regarding the point of purdah (welcome to jam rock).

These aren't CIs into prospective councillors though, but into No 10.

Blinder Data

The silver lining of the Met's decision is that a load of fines could arrive in the wake of some disappointing election results, which would raise the temperature.

Feels like a very bad day for the man, actually. Brexiteers denouncing him in the Commons, tetchy interviews with the media in India, incompetent and failed attempt to bounce Tory MPs into defending him. Let's see him wriggle out of this one!

You just know he'll try every delaying tactic in the book. "You can't sack me now because there's a: war in Ukraine; Platinum Jubilee; cost of living crisis; Queen about to die; World Cup on, etc."

The tone of today suggests we might soon reach a point when Tory MPs get rid of him without knowing who comes next - which would be fun.

Ferris

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on April 21, 2022, 04:08:30 PMIt's not criminal investigations - it's anything from a public body that might prejudice a vote, it's that the criminal investigation involves the government that is the issue other criminal investigations will continue to be reported.

It's good in theory, but a criminal investigation into a standing political party can't have any convictions disclosed until after the election?

At that point you could argue that unemployment rates, covid deaths, anything could influence a vote against the tories and therefore the only news for the month running up to the elections should be:


Ferris

Quote from: Blinder Data on April 21, 2022, 04:14:24 PMThe silver lining of the Met's decision is that a load of fines could arrive in the wake of some  disappointing election results, which would raise the temperature.

Feels like a very bad day for the man, actually. Brexiteers denouncing him in the Commons, tetchy interviews with the media in India, incompetent and failed attempt to bounce Tory MPs into defending him. Let's see him wriggle out of this one!

You just know he'll try every delaying tactic in the book. "You can't sack me now because there's a: war in Ukraine; Platinum Jubilee; cost of living crisis; Queen about to die; World Cup on, etc."

The tone of today suggests we might soon reach a point when Tory MPs get rid of him without knowing who comes next - which would be fun.

Not to tie everything back to trump, but he really demonstrated the power of having zero shame. People have short memories. Outrage can't last forever. You can basically do what you like as long as you refuse to listen to criticism and just carry on.

It makes a mockery of democracy and creates major cracks in our system of government that are probably impossible to fix, but who gives a shit about that? You're in charge!

If he wants to, he'll outlast this.

jobotic


jobotic

Quote from: Blinder Data on April 21, 2022, 04:14:24 PMThe silver lining of the Met's decision is that a load of fines could arrive in the wake of some disappointing election results, which would raise the temperature.

Feels like a very bad day for the man, actually. Brexiteers denouncing him in the Commons, tetchy interviews with the media in India, incompetent and failed attempt to bounce Tory MPs into defending him. Let's see him wriggle out of this one!

You just know he'll try every delaying tactic in the book. "You can't sack me now because there's a: war in Ukraine; Platinum Jubilee; cost of living crisis; Queen about to die; World Cup on, etc."

The tone of today suggests we might soon reach a point when Tory MPs get rid of him without knowing who comes next - which would be fun.

I was surprised with some of the strength of the attacks on him from his own side.

But the police investigation will take forever then the privileges committee will say that he did mislead parliament but they can't conclusively say it was deliberate so no harm done.

Ferris

Quote from: jobotic on April 21, 2022, 04:23:11 PMRees-Mogg knows that, and Gove. And every blue labour liar.

From an organization standpoint, you are still in charge regardless of whatever scandal you've embroiled yourself in. When you turn up to meetings, you are the one being briefed and making decisions.

Parliamentarians are supposed to hold you to account but you're on the same team, so they won't. The public is supposed to hold them to account, but they're all so disengaged and jaded, they won't.

So after all the sound and fury of newspaper headlines (well, not the ones on your side of course), what can happen? Those headlines don't sell papers or drive clicks after a day or two so they have to move on. The public hate all politicians anyway so they chalk it up to experience and forget about it, your allies chuckle to themselves in the commons bar, and after all the scandal, you are still the one showing up to meetings, getting briefed, and making decisions.

It is all very depressing. The main problem johnson has now is the risk of being backstabbed by some other power-hungry tory, not any of the other checks and balances the system is supposed to have. He doesn't give a shit what you or I think, he's more worried about keeping fabricant onside in case priti patel starts getting angsty. Mad really.

Cerys

Well, at least they've voted to open the investigation into the lying cunt.

Psybro

Johnson's problem is very few of his MPs know what they're in power for, and unlike Cameron he came in with a specific mandate that his Conservative Government would be one which actually did things.  Brexit is done but they've manifestly failed to do any of the bits they never intended to do.  Due to ineptitude they've forgotten to even pretend to be doing anything and gotten shit at distracting the public by showing their arse constantly.

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: Ferris on April 21, 2022, 04:15:45 PMIt's good in theory, but a criminal investigation into a standing political party can't have any convictions disclosed until after the election?

At that point you could argue that unemployment rates, covid deaths, anything could influence a vote against the tories and therefore the only news for the month running up to the elections should be:


That's not how it works.

Public bodies have a months purdah when they are not meant to publicly release information that might prejudice voting.  The press only has to do this on the day of the vote.  Obviously the press can use it's privilege to protect the identity of anyone breaking purdah in the month before, it's just the institution as a whole has to be mindful of releasing any information that might be seen as politically motivated - that doesn't mean a blanket ban on reporting, also things like the ONS and lots of other public bodies are expected to be neutral in their reporting regardless of purdah or not.

Stop getting purdah wrong all of you (I've been purdah'd loads of times I'm so cool - basically you get an email saying purdah mate, remember, purdah).