Doctor Who Series 7 and beyond (may contain spoilers)

[Serge]

Where were the last two, then?

Karen Gillan appeared briefly in 'Fires Of Pompeii'.

[ziggy starbucks]

This is Catherine Tate's earlier appearance

[biggytitbo]

Does the (completely speculative) idea of introducing the Twelfth Doctor in the special, but having him come from the future, and then not having Smith regenerate into the new actor for another couple of years, sound like a terrible idea? I quite like it, and it sounds like something Moffat could have fun with[nb]Though possibly a bit similar to 'The Next Doctor'.[/nb] but I can imagine it casting a bit of a pall over the rest of Smith's tenure.

Also, it would probably be a logistical and legal nightmare, what with the contracts and all that, though I recall reading somewhere that Tennant was signed up to play the next Doctor whenever Eccleston dropped out, and could've been on the bench for a couple of years. That would probably require finding another good actor who's a complete Who nut, though.

Its a clever idea and very Moffatian. A multi Doctor story but with the other Doctor being a future incarnation would at least be a new twist on the idea and probably save it from been too panto an cheesy. To work though, I think the 11th would have to regenerate at the end of the adventure rather than waiting a year or two.

[BritishHobo]

Hardly a new thing!


Colin Baker, Freema Agyeman, Catherine Tate and Karen Gillan all appeared in the show as someone else before they became cast as the big one.

But isn't this idea one of actually having the Doctor appear, but while pretending to be someone else? Having him star as a character with the knowledge that he will be the next Doctor, and that in-story his current character will turn out to be the next Doctor in disguise, as opposed to hiring him to play one part and then later deciding he'd be a good Doctor.

[biggytitbo]

But isn't this idea one of actually having the Doctor appear, but while pretending to be someone else? Having him star as a character with the knowledge that he will be the next Doctor, and that in-story his current character will turn out to be the next Doctor in disguise, as opposed to hiring him to play one part and then later deciding he'd be a good Doctor.

If they could do that without the audience knowing too, it might be quite cool.

[Serge]

It would be even better if they could contrive somehow to tell the story twice, from the view of each Doctor, in two different series, though I realise that would probably be more trouble than it's worth...

[kidsick5000]

If they could do that without the audience knowing too, it might be quite cool. would be a fucking miracle

fixed

[kidsick5000]

I which was pretty much been done before with the Watcher in Logopolis)

I still don't know what the Watcher was about

[biggytitbo]

fixed

They might be able to get any with it if it was one episode, and the new doctor was announced as a guest star. Anything more prolonged than that and no way.

[Huxleys Babkins]

I always liked the idea of having the next Doctor as a human companion who'd regenerated whilst using the Chameleon Arc.

The Doctor would sense there was something wrong and thus have a need to keep him with him, but not be able to put the final piece of the puzzle together.

In my rough idea in my head, the Doctor and his companion discover a man left for dead in the street. "Harry Saxon" has little memory of anything besides his name and his only possession is a pocket watch. The Doctor tries to put two and two together, decides that this guy must be the Master and realises the safest thing for everyone is to keep him travelling with him and keep him human. They'll have numerous adventures with "Harry" proving himself to be quite, quite brilliant and all but confirming the Doctor's suspicions albeit wrongly.

Of course as time goes on, "Harry" becomes more and more suspicious about the truth, realises the Doctor is holding something from him, eventually runs off (with the 11th Doctor's companion - possible love interest made awkward when the 12th Doctor wakes up?). "Harry" stumbles upon the Master's latest diabolical scheme and is compelled to open the watch...

Left alone and with the TARDIS door left open by his fleeing companions, the 11th Doctor is ambushed by an earlier version of the Master who wants the TARDIS for himself. In the struggle the Doctor is mortally wounded and forced into the Chameleon Arc by the Master to buy him enough time to get away. He throws the human 12th Doctor into the street and dematerialises to begin work on the scheme (as discovered by "Harry" above).

It needs work and is a little bit fan wank, but I like the general idea. The idea of having this ever-present potential danger in the TARDIS is a good one too and something we haven't seen since Turlogh and Kameleon.

[Replies From View]

The single problem that I have with introducing the next Doctor as a distinct "other" in advance is that, despite the regeneration scene showing that the Doctor has become that person, there's a risk that audiences won't "feel" the continuity even if they "get" it.  A bit like when series 8 of Red Dwarf had the same actor playing Rimmer but it was a different Rimmer; it's hard to put a finger on the feeling but it's that sense of being alienated and not knowing whether the writers knew.  It's one thing to look back at Doctors we've had in the past as part of a celebration, but another to establish someone as "not" the Doctor before saying that actually he is the Doctor. 

Hmm does that make sense?  The Watcher worked because it gave the impression of being simultaneously there and not there; it wasn't a personality as such, it was mysterious and didn't speak, but the fourth Doctor himself sensed what was happening.  If they could do something along those lines without directly copying the Watcher I would be more into this "next Doctor" idea I think. 

Even then, though, as a kid I wasn't entirely certain what the process of the Watcher was, because we'd only recently seen the Master taking over another person's body; has the Doctor been taken over, was my first fear back then, and weirdly nobody then seemed to make that clearer at any point.  You want to trust your main character, so I think it's important for writers and directors to notice when potential ambiguities or points of alienation or distance are useful devices, and when it's more important to reassure audiences.  Regenerations are one of the occasions when audiences are especially sensitive and particular care is needed, I think.

[olliebean]

This video turned up in the US Only Fools & Horses thread and it freaked me the fuck out. It's Lucas & Walliams, on Paramount, in 1997. Around 2 minutes in, Mark Gatiss enters, as Trigger. But he's not dressed as Trigger. You'll recognise instantly who he's dressed as.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLA7Kx4srUs

In 1997. What the frickin' fuck?

[biggytitbo]

Haha that is quite funny. Even the hair looks a bit similar.


So they really do have a Tardis out there in Wales then?

[biggytitbo]

I'm scared -

[Bingo Fury]

This video turned up in the US Only Fools & Horses thread and it freaked me the fuck out. It's Lucas & Walliams, on Paramount, in 1997. Around 2 minutes in, Mark Gatiss enters, as Trigger. But he's not dressed as Trigger. You'll recognise instantly who he's dressed as.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLA7Kx4srUs

In 1997. What the frickin' fuck?

I know! Never mind Cartmel, let's talk about the Gatiss Masterplan. I linked to that clip in my Facebook last year. No one commented, liked it or appeared to give a fuck at all, but I still think it's spooky.

[Dark Sky]

Similarly, I posted it onto the Planet of the Ming Mongs Facebook account a while back, but no-one seemed to care.  Boo them.

[Talulah, really!]

It's no big deal is it?

David Tennant's being wearing that costume for years now....

I linked to that clip in my Facebook last year. No one commented, liked it or appeared to give a fuck at all, but I still think it's spooky.

I noticed it turned up at (boo,hiss,boo) The Leisure Hive yesterday so someone is watching....

[Dark Sky]

It's no big deal is it?

It's the fact that it's Steven Moffat's best bud Mark Gatiss wearing it...and the wig!...which makes it so strange.

[olliebean]

Also the broom, which isn't a mop but is in the same ball-park, and which there doesn't appear to be any reason for him to be carrying.

[biggytitbo]

He's meant to be playing Trigger, hence the broom, although apart from that he bares nor resemblance to the character or how he dresses.


Its a coincidence but a pretty big one considering the rest of the outfit and the hair is almost identical to S5 Matt Smith.


Or perhaps Matt read the Victory script before he'd started filming, went online to do a bit of research on Gatiss, saw that clip and it stuck subliminally...

[Replies From View]

Or perhaps Matt read the Victory script before he'd started filming, went online to do a bit of research on Gatiss, saw that clip and it stuck subliminally...

How long did he have that hair, though?  I bet it's exactly since the sketch first aired.

[Replies From View]

I noticed it turned up at (boo,hiss,boo) The Leisure Hive yesterday so someone is watching....

It does credit with a link to here though, which is fair enough.  Plus it's a fairly amusing entry in its own right.

[biggytitbo]

I tweeted the link to Gatiss, but he didn't respond.


Surely a sign that he's hiding something. He's probably on the internet now destroying the evidence.

[Replies From View]

And getting the Americans to make their own Fools and Horses so that anyone who mentions the sketch from now on will be met by people assuming they mean the American remake.

[The Giggling Bean]

Personally I want to see as many of the old Doctors as possible back for the 50th anniversary. As each of them has helped the show make it to the 50 your mark they should all be afforded, those who want to, a special guest spot. Perhaps have one big 5 episode adventure, perhaps along the lines of what Torchwood did. An overall story with each episode featuring the incumbent and a past incarnation of the Doctor culminating in a big finale with each of the Doctors contributions adding towards the conclusion.

Moffatt did say that it would be like all or christmases come at once, I can only presume (and hope) to see some of the older Doctors back. If nothing else then they should at least get McGann back in for a few episodes to show us what his Doctor could have been like (outside of the Big Finish universe). I don't care how old or portly they may be, I'd love to see them all back. I know Moffatt hasn spoken ill, in the past, of the McCoy era so I wonder whether he'd consider getting him and Colin back. I still bristle from memories of the lodger when they missed 5,6 & 7 out of the headbutt flashback. I also noticed in one of the extra scenes on the DVD featuring a companion montage that both Mel and Ace were missing from the shots of companions. It seems Moffatt isn't averse to ignoring the bits of Who he doesn't like which bothers me that he's in charge of the big anniversary. At least Russell bigged up Who as a whole from beginning to end so I guess I feel he'd be more amenable to bringing back some of the less publicly well remembered Doctors. I just hope that it won't end up being a celebration of "Nu Who".

I'm still not sure what's going on this year though are we getting 7 episodes of 14? I thought we were getting a curtailed season so that the money could be diverted to next year to make the 50th even bigger.

[BritishHobo]

I think the one sure thing we do know about the next two years is that we're getting fourteen episodes, but split between autumn this year and (I assume) spring next year.

[biggytitbo]

I've given up trying to work it out. Going by the endless confusion their statements provoke, they don't have a clue themselves.

[Replies From View]

After all the palaver of mucking about with the schedule to get the show into "dark nights" it'd be so disappointing if they just moved it back into Spring by 2014.  It would mean Smith's momentum as the Doctor had been broken by splitting his second series for no reason.

But I'm with Biggy; just going to wait this one out now until the production team start giving us something more definite.

[olliebean]

He's meant to be playing Trigger, hence the broom, although apart from that he bares nor resemblance to the character or how he dresses.

Did Trigger used to carry a broom around, then? I have absolutely no recollection of him doing so.

[Replies From View]

Did Trigger used to carry a broom around, then? I have absolutely no recollection of him doing so.

Isn't Trigger's Broom a version of Theseus' Ship?

"How can it be the same bloody broom then?" - whereupon Trigger shows a photo of himself holding the broom.  Perhaps Trigger always carried around a photo of himself holding a broom.