When comedians attack...other comedians! (Not really a list thread)

[Neil]

There are a few things which have been really fucking me off about British comedy at the minute, and one particular reason why all of them irritate me so much.  From the top of my head they are:

Jimmy Carr telling lies about Jim Davidson nicking his joke (noticed that he's using that joke to flog his fucking DVD's now?)  The most annoying thing about that is the fact that other comedians have apparently backed Carr (presumably) to get their own hairy faces and gruff pompous voices in the papers or on the radios.  They

must have known it wasn't his joke either.

Lucas and Walliams bending over backwards to make an old-lady-friendly version of Little Britain, and in particular Walliams going out of his way to promote BBC3 as some incredibly hip and dangerous channel, as if noone has ever seen someone being sick on the Beeb before BBC3 came into existence.  

Peter Kay kissing up to Alison Graham by naming a character after her "as a tribute for all the support" she has given him over the years.

Chris Morris working with copyists and untalented fuckers.  (Possibly on dodgy ground here when you read my reasoning below, I admit I don't think there'd be much mileage in this, but in general there should be more lampooning of him.  It would help.)[/list]
These things are all bloody annoying in and of themselves, but I am hoping they mean that British comedy has bottomed out.  That it can't possibly get any worse, and so things will start improving.  The main thing that I think bothers me about all the examples given is that no comedians seem to be saying anything about it.  Do they not care, or find such things worthy of ridicule, or are they just going to keep their faces shut in case it buggers up their future career chances?  Those things seem ripe for parody to me, or at least worthy of attacking.  Aren't comedians meant to say the unsayable?  Does it make anyone else's skin crawl to see them defending Ken Bigley jokes but not attacking the most nauseating sort of careerism?

So I'd be interested to hear what others think about all this, and I'd also like to hear of any instances of comedians attacking other people in comedy that have happened recently.  It could be that I've missed loads, however I'm not sure I want to turn this into another list thread, I'd at least like to hear what other people think of this kind of thing before any listing of events older than, say, five years ago.

[Purple Tentacle]

Stewart Lee spent 20 minutes in his live gig attacking Ben Elton's hypocracy and how success can corrupt people.


Oooh Stewart Lee, Stewart Lee, why don't I just marry him?

[Cambrian Times]

Richard Herring despises Leigh Francis for some reason, having mentioned it about a million times on NOTBBC and even gone so far to have it mentioned in an interview in The Guardian.

I can't see why. I really cannot see why.

Although I heard it has something about Francis lifting the character of Barry Gibson from Simon Quinlank.

I can't see it really, but then again the only time I've ever seen the Gibson character is The Bear.

[Purple Tentacle]

Ooh Leigh Francis, Leigh Francis, why don't you just marry him?


I'm going to break my personal rule and write ;)  

[Neil]

Abuse on a forum full of childish misanthropic fuckwits or at a live gig doesn't really count, but the latter is interesting none-the-less.  More details on the Ben Elton-bashing would be appreciated.  EDIT:  I'd been toying with the idea of a "no Davidson bashing" clause in the first post, should have foreseen Ben Elton as he's arguably just as easy a target.)

[Purple Tentacle]

Abuse on a forum full of childish misanthropic fuckwits or at a live gig doesn't really count, but the latter is interesting none-the-less.  More details on the Ben Elton-bashing would be appreciated.

Sorry, I know I was a bit brusque but I don't want to quote his routine too much as a) I'd fuck it up, and b) it doesn't seem to be very on to spoil a routine that people are paying money to see.

The gist of it is that he heard Ben Elton say that people don't like him because "the British hate success", a phrase often used by fuckwits.

Lee talks at length about the excitement of watching The Young Ones and the birth of alternative comedy, which is what makes Ben Elton helping Lloyd-Webber write the music for the inauguration of George Bush even more vile.  Lee said that he admires Osama bin Laden more than Ben Elton because at least Osama bin Laden's morals have been consistant. (Tongue very firmly in cheek of course).

There are also a bit of comedic sour grapes on Lee's part as well because Jerry Springer The Musica; is up against We Will Rock You, and I think he likes to whip up a bit of "rivallry" for shits and giggles.

Hehehe, he also had a knowingly childish dig at Angus Deyton, but of course L&H have been doing that for years (oh look it's John Cleese!)

[alan strang]

For industry people Bo Selecta has now become 'the comedy show it's okay to slag off without harming your career'. Which is a bit odd considering how hotly tipped for the top the show was last year (and how far up Leigh Frances' bum Jonathan Ross managed to wedge himself). I wonder if there'll be cackly 'Orrible'-style jokes about it in this year's Comedy Awards.

Haven't seen Stewart Lee's Ben Elton routine but he did a fantastic, damning, improvised thing about Graham Norton's show at a gig a while back. Pretty sure the bootleg has circulated so a few people on here may have heard it.

Lee & Herring used to have a go at loads of comedians in their shows. It was quite a refreshing outlook at the time, even though some of their attacks were a tad misdirected (e.g. having a go at 'Morons From Out Of Space' - although their impressions of Smith and Jones were hilarious).

When I was asked to do the titles illustration for 'Lazy Comedian Scum' I slipped a pic of Adam Bloom into the line-up. He was a source of personal annoyance at the time, being one of those comedians who were seemingly being groomed for star-status by insiders (despite being little more than a younger version of Lee Hurst - whom Stewart had personally requested I include). As expected they asked me to change Bloom to someone else.

Amusingly the Bloom pic seemed to cause ripples of vague concern within that small production, leading to four seperate people coming up to me throughout the day and having 'a quiet word' about how Adam Bloom was "actually really good and not rubbish actually I think you'll find."

Adam Bloom, eh - where is he now?

[slim]

I thought I'd have a go at taking the mickey, inspired by this thread and others on here. Also, my own opinions, obviously. These aren't received. Oh no.

http://www.kearanjazz.com/images/modern_comedy.jpg

It's too big to post in a thread as a picture. Apologies if it's poo - it's late and I'm "tired and emotional". It does says wot I think though.

[Purple Tentacle]

http://www.kearanjazz.com/images/modern_comedy.jpg

That's marvellous!!

[Neil]

Outer Space, innit?  Or have I missed a nice play on words for all these years?  Congrats for actually making me want to sit through TMWRNJ alan!  Has that really happened to "Bo! Selecta" now?  No star-studded Xmas record this year then, what a damn shame.

Hehehe, he also had a knowingly childish dig at Angus Deyton, but of course L&H have been doing that for years (oh look it's John Cleese!)

I'm so glad you said that.  When I was going through some old videos a looong time ago I grabbed this clip, and never posted it as the saturation is fucked.  I meant to regrab it when the subject came up in a fairly recent Spitting Image thread, but as per usual I never got round to it.  I've ripped out the audio though as I think it fits rather nicely with this thread.

Spitting Image - Good Evening Mr. Deayton

Has Dead Ringers done anything like that?  I have only watched one or two episodes...I vaguely remember some recent thing they did about BS though (ha!) although I'm sure it was reported as taking the piss out of fans who said the show was racist rather than the show itself.

EDIT:  Rightclick, Set As Background.  Cheers for that.  And cheers for not hot-linking it!

[slim]

http://www.kearanjazz.com/images/modern_comedy.jpg

That's marvellous!!

There's a £1 book token and two kiwi fruits (for the hangover) in the post to you right blumming now.

[Cambrian Times]

Ooh Leigh Francis, Leigh Francis, why don't you just marry him?

Because he's married already, you tit.

I knew this would fucking happen.

[Darrell]

http://www.kearanjazz.com/images/modern_comedy.jpg

Excellent. That's fallen out of a great unpublished modern comedy book, clearly.

[alan strang]

Outer Space, innit?  Or have I missed a nice play on words for all these years?

No - just myself being inept!

Has that really happened to "Bo! Selecta" now?  No star-studded Xmas record this year then, what a damn shame.

Well he has done one (if by star-studded you mean Patsy Kensit and Davina Macall). But it's been rather superceded by Band Aid 20.

http://www.kearanjazz.com/images/modern_comedy.jpg

Very good!

[Purple Tentacle]

Ooh Leigh Francis, Leigh Francis, why don't you just marry him?

Because he's married already, you tit.
I knew this would fucking happen.

Mmm, nice, that's why I put a winking thing at the end of my post because I KNEW you would flare up again, even though when I met you in person I jokingly asked you if you wanted to marry him.  It was a self-referential joke in that in my post above yours I practically sounded like I wanted to marry Stewart Lee.

Jesus, try growing a thicker skin and stop hurling abuse at people like they've just cussed your mum.

[Neil]

Haven't seen Stewart Lee's Ben Elton routine but he did a fantastic, damning, improvised thing about Graham Norton's show at a gig a while back. Pretty sure the bootleg has circulated so a few people on here may have heard it.

Maybe someone can do a clip then?  This has reminded me that they have a go at Norton on "Baddiel and Skinner Unplanned" on a fairly regular basis.  It's all a bit shite and predictable though, dull jokes about him being gay, although Skinner's impression of him was great!  (I think he just shouted and waved his arms around a bit.)  

Is there even any real anger in comedy these days?  The BES is the last thing I can think of that was the product of real actual anger.

[Darrell]

Maybe someone can do a clip then?  This has reminded me that they have a go at Norton on "Baddiel and Skinner Unplanned" on a fairly regular basis.  It's all a bit shite and predictable though, dull jokes about him being gay, although Skinner's impression of him was great!  (I think he just shouted and waved his arms around a bit.)

"Nrooooaoooohhh! PEEEE-NIS!!"

[Munday's Chylde]

In that dreadful gervais live dvd i was crying about the other day Ricky brings up the subject of ben eltons perceived selling out too - i think he's on eltons side if i remember and has a pop at people who spout the oppinion.

[Cambrian Times]

Jesus, try growing a thicker skin and stop hurling abuse at people like they've just cussed your mum.

Purple, I thought that the smiley was due to you breaking your own rule and posting. To be honest i'm very tired and I couldn't see it all that well.

Also try working in a pub. I get so much abuse hurled at me by certain customers, that it really is no use getting a thick skin because it just gets worn aware no matter how hard I try.

I have often left work in tears, because of the hurtful things that people have said to me. One guy, who I rebuked because he was messing around with the pool table fixtures told me to and I quote

Fuck off you stupid fat cunt.

Just because you work behind a bar does not give people a legitamate excuse to treat you like dirt.

I'm impotent in fighting back because if i retaliated I would loose my job.  So you can understand that if I get teased, I tend to violently respond. I have no other outlet.

[imitationleather]

Well, that's got a lot to do with comedians attacking other comedians!

Has attacking Leigh Francis become acceptable in the comedy world? I've not noticed it. When did the tide turn?

[Cambrian Times]

Well, that's got a lot to do with comedians attacking other comedians!

I was trying to justify myself and my post to PT. Is that such a crime?

[Suttonpubcrawl]

Well, that's got a lot to do with comedians attacking other comedians!

I was trying to justify myself and my post to PT. Is that such a crime?

Yep. 5 years in the nick.

[imitationleather]

Well, no. But it didn't need explaining in the first place. It was just a throwaway comment that's now completely derailed the thread.

So...
Comedians attacking other comedians, eh?

[Cambrian Times]

Yep. 5 years in the nick.

I plead insanity, M'Lud.

[Neil]

Some extremely interesting and valid points made here, I'll just make a note of them so as not to forget:  Never post a thread about something you've been interested in for ages on a Saturday fucking night.

[/Bruce Forsyth]

[Darrell]

Comedians attacking other comedians, eh?

Do Rod Hull and Emu count?

If they don't, that's my post buggered.

[Cambrian Times]

Didn't Bill Hicks have a major spaz at Dennis Leary for nicking his act? I think I read something about that in another thread. Maybe.

[mook]

Didn't Bill Hicks have a major spaz at Dennis Leary for nicking his act? I think I read something about that in another thread. Maybe.

The only thing I can remember is Hicks saying something along the lines of."The only reason i would consider quitting smoking is to see if Leary does too."

Didn't someone here say that Hicks and Leary were quite matey at one point?

[Neil]

Just as he never made a stink about his some of his material ending up in Denis Leary's "little skitshow." Many would have sued and made a "name" and a stink and found a way to "promote" themselves. He just joked, privately, that Leary had been invited to Bill's parents' house for Thanksgiving instead of Bill this year, and moved on.

Jimmy Carr, on the other hand...

Anyway, full post here.  

Amusingly this clip: Victor Lewis-Smith - Doctor Rolfington Harris just turned up in amongst my music playlist.  Vaguely coincidental...although he doesn't attack any comedians in this he does have a go at lazy radio show producers who use show prep services or whatever to cover up for a basic lack of creativity or thought.  It strikes me as the sort of attitude there's very little of these days...or am I wrong?  I watch very little telly, but I don't get the impression that very few people in the media are prepared to attack it these days.  Anyway it's a great clip, I was trying to find it the other day for jutl's Comedy Du Jour thread.

The use of Eugene Fraser does remind me a bit of MASJ.  Not implying any theft on CM's part this time, just saying.  Thought the same thing when I saw the TV Offal episode with the original Associated-Rediffusion continuity announcer on the end and that's obviously waaay too late.

"Back in my Luxury York Penthouse Cliche..."  There are plenty of times when VLS has a go at his own stuff, saying he's nicked jokes off Bob Monkhouse or whatever.  Jimmy Carr, on the other hand...

[alan strang]

Ah, yes, Lewis-Smith playing Stravinski on a Stylophone. Wonderful stuff.