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David Baddiel to tell us about online abuse

Started by Famous Mortimer, August 02, 2021, 05:32:22 PM

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wrec

If you ever need a thumbnail definition of British blue tick ideology, that believes itself to be a transcendent lack of ideology, and anyway, it's all just a debating game so who cares? The previous tweet is deleted so not sure what he's replying to.

QuoteThat rumour is incorrect. I am no wing, I have no pre-prepared politics that I map onto the world, preferring instead to consider each issue as individually as I can. Or ignore it, and watch Cartoon Network.

Exactly the mindset required for a smug racist to smear anti-racists as racist, while professing oneself to be the Most Oppressed, followed by much "how did we get here" handwringing. No pre-prepared politics but be careful how you pronounce "Epstein".

Edited due to incoherent rage


Quote from: idunnosomename on August 11, 2021, 11:37:38 AM
wow he really pulled himself up by his bootstraps after his time at *checks wikipedia* Haberdashers' Aske's Boys' School?? is that posh?!?!
He claims to have got there via a scholarship that covered most of the fees. His father was a scientist at cuddly chemical company Unilever according to Wikipedia, so I guess the family wasn't poor, although not millionaires. (This is dull but not as dull as what I'm being paid to do.)

mr. logic

Every person that went to one of those places gained it through their own academic talent. Funnily enough, I never heard of these schemes at my primary school.

Brundle-Fly

Quote from: Jackson K Pollock on August 10, 2021, 11:23:54 PM
That sort of privileged laziness is such a pet peeve of mine!

I remember when he was on Hancock-era Room 101 and he'd chosen 'the FA Cup draw' as one of his items. Nick Hancock (who love him or hate him, clearly put a ton of effort into that show) pulled out a piece of paper and said "You've just written 'can't tell if it's really bad or not' for your reasons" and seemed almost genuinely angry with him. Before being (effortfully) funnier than Baddiel would have been about it anyway.

It's Baddiel's usual incredulous/ sardonic schtick though, no? Whether anybody finds him funny or not, that's his comic persona. Well, back then it was. If Nick Hancock was genuinely angry with him, that bit would've been lost in the edit.

Lisa Jesusandmarychain

Quote from: robhug on August 11, 2021, 01:41:25 PM
90% of posters in that thread are either dead or in prison or died in prison

I like how the person in that comment who got annoyed by Baddiel's nicking of his gag is our very own frantic planet, still with us and being praised for his blog on the thread that's now having a go at the Mr. Bobby book.

Autopsy Turvey

Quote from: Endicott on August 11, 2021, 11:29:45 AM
What makes you think his appearance on the show was for free?

I'd guess there was a fee for his appearance, but that fee wasn't conditional on him wading through a dossier of fly facts in his own time? Besides, surely the comedy celebrity guest on this show takes on a kind of pupil role, or a representative of the listening layman?

Quotelest us not mention the time on Unplanned in 2003 where they made a whole bit out of David's astonishment that a "blackbird" was actually a species of bird, and not just a "black bird" like a crow. He was thirty-eight. And he didn't know what a blackbird was.

Everyone in the world has gaps in their knowledge that their less scrupulous and more desperate opponents can use as evidence for their inherent wrongness and stupidity. Bringing up a confusion over avian taxonomy from 18 years ago verges on self-parody.

Quote from: Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth on August 11, 2021, 12:49:29 PM
This looks bad for corvid.

That's more like it!

phantom_power

I hate that whole "I am a true clear thinker. I have no "wing"" thing. Not everyone who identifies as left wing agrees with everyone else who does (that is pretty clear) and not everyone who identifies as such agrees with everything that might be called "left wing" (especially when that definition has been abused so much by the right wing it should be taken into care). What it does is give an indicator of what you stand for, what your beliefs are, what sort of standards you hold yourself and others to. If you don't have a "wing" you don't stand for anything

Of course it doesn't help that most people on the internet who take that stance are clearly right wing

Shoulders?-Stomach!

People who vocally claim online to not be politically partisan are invariably FBPE (a clearly partisan political group) middle class centrists who like things just the way they are so long as the child mutilation, bombings, floods, drought and horror in the Global South is pushed to the back pages while their house prices continue to rise.

If only there was a third way that wasn't the Tories or Labour they cry, while ignoring the Liberals who they comfortably belong in, hypocrites, handwringers and milquetoast no marks with no imagination and no capacity to envisage what real change is and no courage to fight for it.

Zetetic

Quote from: Shoulders?-Stomach! on August 11, 2021, 02:45:52 PM
middle class centrists who like things just the way they are so long as the child mutilation, bombings, floods, drought and horror in the Global South is pushed to the back pages while their house prices continue to rise
I suspect this - omitting the FBPE bit - describes 80% of voters for every party.

gilbertharding

Quote from: Autopsy Turvey on August 11, 2021, 02:26:43 PM
I'd guess there was a fee for his appearance, but that fee wasn't conditional on him wading through a dossier of fly facts in his own time? Besides, surely the comedy celebrity guest on this show takes on a kind of pupil role, or a representative of the listening layman?

Everyone in the world has gaps in their knowledge that their less scrupulous and more desperate opponents can use as evidence for their inherent wrongness and stupidity. Bringing up a confusion over avian taxonomy from 18 years ago verges on self-parody.

That's more like it!

Fucking hell - I hope he sees this mate.

The year is 2021, and 'fly facts' are available more or less on tap from the small black box you carry in your pocket. No-one has to spend a week in the library of the Zoological Society anymore. But no-one was expecting him to have become an expert on flies. As a comedian, booked onto a show to be funny about flies for a few minutes, surely most people would have a go at preparing a few lines (perhaps he did - you tell me).

And a nearly 40 year old soi-disant intellectual not knowing that a blackbird is a type of bird is bit more than a 'knowledge gap' about obscure 'avian taxonomy' - though I'm more inclined to worry for him than laugh at him on that score. His Taskmaster performance strongly suggested someone suffering a significant brain injury.

idunnosomename

Avian taxonomy? It's one of the most familar British garden birds mate. It's like not knowing what a duck is.

Anyway it was just poking fun at a bloviating pseud who gets high on his own farts. More critically his children's books are criminally shit.

g0m

Quote from: Wayman C. McCreery on August 11, 2021, 05:34:11 AM
On a similar note, I've searched and searched and can't find any evidence for it but I'm certain he went on Charlie Brooker's TV panel show You Have Been Watching and crowdsourced his jokes beforehand. I'm summarising here, but he went on Twitter before filming, asked "What do you guys think about [subject he'd been asked to prepare]?" and then passed the jokes off as his own on the show.

I'm sure people on here rightly kicked off about it but there doesn't seem to be a thread for the series he was on.

Anyone remember that happening?

yeah, but germaine greer was on that show too. so not the worst of the panelists

Cold Meat Platter

Didn't he nick someone's joke from the internet and have to cop to it? Can't remember if it was a tweet or what.

Autopsy Turvey

Quote from: gilbertharding on August 11, 2021, 03:25:01 PM
As a comedian, booked onto a show to be funny about flies for a few minutes, surely most people would have a go at preparing a few lines (perhaps he did - you tell me).

Dunno, I didn't hear it, hopefully he just did a joke about trouser flies and relatable observational stuff about how hard it is to swat the cunts. Don't mind me, I have an irritating instinct to stick up for whoever's being slagged off. (Apart from Andrew Lawrence and Graham Linehan of course, just ain't worth it.)

QuoteAnd a nearly 40 year old soi-disant intellectual not knowing that a blackbird is a type of bird is bit more than a 'knowledge gap' about obscure 'avian taxonomy' -

I'm reminded of Watson's exasperation at Holmes knowing nothing about philosophy, politics or Copernican theory, and Holmes' rebuttal: "A fool takes in all the lumber of every sort that he comes across, so that the knowledge which might be useful to him gets crowded out, or at best is jumbled up with a lot of other things, so that he has a difficulty in laying his hands upon it. Now the skilful workman is very careful indeed as to what he takes into his brain-attic." Or to paraphrase the Great Detective, "who gives a shit if a crow is a black bird not a blackbird"?

QuotePeople who vocally claim online to not be politically partisan are invariably FBPE (a clearly partisan political group) middle class centrists

Of course centrists by definition, of course middle class because working class people don't generally have jobs that allow them to sit around on the internet all day, but the reference to FBPE is puzzling, this is a fraction of a faction. Might just be the ones you've had specific dealings with.

QuoteIf you don't have a "wing" you don't stand for anything
Of course it doesn't help that most people on the internet who take that stance are clearly right wing

This might be because of the differing approach to the nature of the state; people with conservative tendencies seem less likely to want to shout and fight for an ideology and allow politics to dominate their lives and minds as utterly as socialists, and would rather minimise their interactions with any government, not go agitating for or against any policies. I suppose from one perspective, effectively what this means is that apolitical people are instinctively conservative by default.

Quote from: idunnosomename on August 11, 2021, 03:50:35 PM
Anyway it was just poking fun at a bloviating pseud who gets high on his own farts. More critically his children's books are criminally shit.

100% fair dos.

olliebean

Quote from: Endicott on August 11, 2021, 11:29:45 AM
What makes you think his appearance on the show was for free?

He'd have got an appearance fee for his appearance. I guess it's arguable whether doing homework in advance to prepare for it counts as extra unpaid work, or included in the fee.

notjosh

Quote from: gilbertharding on August 11, 2021, 03:25:01 PM
As a comedian, booked onto a show to be funny about flies for a few minutes, surely most people would have a go at preparing a few lines (perhaps he did - you tell me).

In my experience a lot of comedians just treat a booking fee for a show like that as a 'turning up' fee and will be happy with a quick briefing over the phone or in the green room so nothing takes them by surprise. Only a rare few will appreciate that they are being paid to bring 'content' to the show and will spend enough time on prep that they come into the record with some solid, funny ideas in their heads. These are the ones that get booked again.

Quote from: Cold Meat Platter on August 11, 2021, 04:28:32 PM
Didn't he nick someone's joke from the internet and have to cop to it? Can't remember if it was a tweet or what.

Covered earlier in the thread. Famous Mortimer found the original discussion here: https://www.cookdandbombd.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,23742.0.html

Brundle-Fly

Quote from: notjosh on August 11, 2021, 05:23:08 PM
In my experience a lot of comedians just treat a booking fee for a show like that as a 'turning up' fee and will be happy with a quick briefing over the phone or in the green room so nothing takes them by surprise. Only a rare few will appreciate that they are being paid to bring 'content' to the show and will spend enough time on prep that they come into the record with some solid, funny ideas in their heads. These are the ones that get booked again.

A BBC producer mate once told me why we see the same faces on panel shows over and over again. "It's because it's fucking hard to be amusing for three hours on set and many, albeit very good, comedians just don't cut the mustard in this context. They either don't prep or don't have the impro chops"

Echo Valley 2-6809

Quote from: gilbertharding on August 11, 2021, 03:25:01 PM
And a nearly 40 year old soi-disant intellectual not knowing that a blackbird is a type of bird is bit more than a 'knowledge gap' about obscure 'avian taxonomy' - though I'm more inclined to worry for him than laugh at him on that score.

WEMBLEY ARENA, 1993

BADDIEL: Black bird singing in the dead of night... A beautiful song, right. But the thing is... how did he know? It was the dead of night - you can't see a thing in the dead of night!
Does Paul McCartney have superhuman vision all of a sudden, so he can tell that a bird IS BLACK even in pitch darkness? When he died in 1966 was he reanimated with infrared vision robot eyes?

10,000 TEENAGE GIRLS: Fuck off, we want Rob Newman


BeardFaceMan

Quote from: notjosh on August 11, 2021, 05:23:08 PM
In my experience a lot of comedians just treat a booking fee for a show like that as a 'turning up' fee and will be happy with a quick briefing over the phone or in the green room so nothing takes them by surprise. Only a rare few will appreciate that they are being paid to bring 'content' to the show and will spend enough time on prep that they come into the record with some solid, funny ideas in their heads. These are the ones that get booked again.

Yeah, see Jamali Maddix saying he'd never watched Taskmaster before doing it. And it showed, too.

gilbertharding

However - that is a legitimate way of approaching that particular show. You can be funny by trying really hard. You can be funny by failing hard, every time. You can be funny by being nonchalant, absurd, daft... whatever. As long, I think, as you are being genuine, and funny, whatever. Because a lot of the comedy in the show comes from the contrast between different approaches.

BeardFaceMan

Not really, he said he regretted it and you could see his attitude change as the shows went on and he understood what the show was about and got more into it. Its just all a bit low effort, a 'I can just turn up and be funny, I don't need to do any prep' kind of attitude, that's not easy to pull off. And in the case of Baddiel that ends up with him reusing the same material. Over and over. For decades.

Old Nehamkin

Quote from: Brundle-Fly on August 11, 2021, 05:28:49 PM
A BBC producer mate once told me why we see the same faces on panel shows over and over again. "It's because it's fucking hard to be amusing for three hours on set and many, albeit very good, comedians just don't cut the mustard in this context. They either don't prep or don't have the impro chops"

They should probably make fewer panel shows in that case. can you tell them I said that please.

gilbertharding

August 11, 2021, 08:13:46 PM #84 Last Edit: August 11, 2021, 08:52:31 PM by gilbertharding
Quote from: BeardFaceMan on August 11, 2021, 07:00:27 PM
Not really, he said he regretted it and you could see his attitude change as the shows went on and he understood what the show was about and got more into it. Its just all a bit low effort, a 'I can just turn up and be funny, I don't need to do any prep' kind of attitude, that's not easy to pull off. And in the case of Baddiel that ends up with him reusing the same material. Over and over. For decades.

Maybe in his (Jamali's) case, but others have been good using the same 'strategy'.

Quote from: BeardFaceMan on August 11, 2021, 05:43:52 PM
Yeah, see Jamali Maddix saying he'd never watched Taskmaster before doing it. And it showed, too.

I thought Jamali Maddix was great on Taskmaster, but Baddiel himself went on it having only seen a handful of YouTube clips (he didn't even bother to watch the six episodes Frank was on) and was remarkably unfunny.

The problem is Baddiel, not the approach. His "do something preposterous with this chickpea" task was one of the most painful few minutes of TV I've ever seen.

king_tubby

Quote from: Echo Valley 2-6809 on August 11, 2021, 05:35:44 PM
WEMBLEY ARENA, 1993

BADDIEL: Black bird singing in the dead of night... A beautiful song, right. But the thing is... how did he know? It was the dead of night - you can't see a thing in the dead of night!
Does Paul McCartney have superhuman vision all of a sudden, so he can tell that a bird IS BLACK even in pitch darkness? When he died in 1966 was he reanimated with infrared vision robot eyes?

10,000 TEENAGE GIRLS: Fuck off, we want Rob Newman

I am not in any way an avian scholar, but even I know that birds can be distinguished by their different calls.

Echo Valley 2-6809

Quote from: king_tubby on August 11, 2021, 09:51:17 PM
I am not in any way an avian scholar, but even I know that birds can be distinguished by their different calls.

Well that's the joke. Baddiel doesn't know what a blackbird is, even when the sound of one is part of the song.

Famous Mortimer


Shoulders?-Stomach!

Quote from: Brundle-Fly on August 11, 2021, 05:28:49 PM
A BBC producer mate once told me why we see the same faces on panel shows over and over again. "It's because it's fucking hard to be amusing for three hours on set and many, albeit very good, comedians just don't cut the mustard in this context. They either don't prep or don't have the impro chops"

That and they most belong to the same two or three agencies, who in themselves only belong to that agency because they fit certain audience demographics and not primarily because of their talent. So the guy is really complaining that the only agencies they use have a mediocre pool of talent, without joining the dots as to why or considering the alternatives.

Regardless, if someone hasn't prepared they shouldn't be invited back and should be getting their arses kicked by their agent. Yet apparently this is no guarantee, you see them smugly consuming the oxygen week after week while offering very little.