Starmer VIII: Labour will set you free

[idunnosomename]

About three times the likes and retweets at the moment lmao

holy lmao

[Johnny Yesno]

nm

[Zero Gravitas]

The Labour Party summer raffle has officially launched! You can get involved today.
First place wins a trip to our Annual Conference in Liverpool this September for two, second place wins £5,000 and two third place winners will receive £1,000.

Let's play to win - enter the raffle for a suggested donation of £2 per ticket, or for free, today!

Totally normal hierarchy of prizes.

[Buelligan]

Everyone should buy a ticket and donate first prize to Audrey White.

[king_tubby]

Leadership challenge from Nandy on the way?

https://twitter.com/NWCWU/status/1554030292184219648

Thanks @lisanandy for taking the time to visit the
@cwugmersey Wigan picket line this morning to speak to #TheCWU BT & Openreach members on strike and show solidarity

[jobotic]

Totally normal hierarchy of prizes.

Blimey. Imagine how gutted you'd be to get first prize.

[Blumf]

Leadership challenge from Nandy on the way?

https://twitter.com/NWCWU/status/1554030292184219648

More like a show of power and disdain for the left. "You're guys can't do this, only us"

[shoulders]

That will be deemed 'meeting the picketers' rather than picketing herself, and she will be reprieved.

[J Peasemould Gruntfuttock]

4 days after I challenged Starmer to his face about lying to party members, I receive this letter from Labour HQ terminating my membership. Shameless & vindictive. A party rotten to the core, that can't tolerate being held to account by a 71 year old. Even Stalin might've blushed



_{6:23 pm · 30 Jul 2022}

I saw Audrey White's confrontation with Starmer on Youtube and was mightily cheered. But then I read one or two posts on Twitter and elsewhere claiming she's 'a landord who opposes social housing', and even that she's 'a milionaire landlord'.

Any truth in this? Or is it just fake news meant to smear her name?

[shoulders]

https://www.morningstaronline.co.uk/article/b/jewish-labour-members-slam-lack-of-justice

How long before the usual crew who perpetuated the antisemitism smears claim these Jews should be silent as factionalism prevents Labour from gaining power?

[Buelligan]

I saw Audrey White's confrontation with Starmer on Youtube and was mightily cheered. But then I read one or two posts on Twitter and elsewhere claiming she's 'a landord who opposes social housing', and even that she's 'a milionaire landlord'.

Any truth in this? Or is it just fake news meant to smear her name?

I know she's been smeared before, so I'd suggest checking stuff.  Had a look but can't see much there, without links it's impossible to check, audrey white is a pretty common name.  And, like I said, she's been smeared before.

https://mobile.twitter.com/SimonWi62124344/status/1553490933441871872

[shoulders]

As we've established, if Ben & Jerry's can be called an antisemitic business with no supporting evidence other than boycotting Israel due to the actions of its government, pretty much everyone can. There is no way of avoiding it. If you support Palestinians vocally that will suffice.

[Buelligan]

Tell me about it.  I have a small (less than A5) Freedom for Palestine thingy outside my house.  Old English shops-lift fellow growled at me You should take that down, it's the kind of thing that'll get you in trouble.


^{Actual size}

I pointed out it was a dove of peace advocating freedom but he would not be calmed.  This is where we are now.  And I say, not another fucking inch.

And, of course, here, many many moons ago, here, I was called an antisemite for not agreeing about the wrongness of a mural.

[BlodwynPig]

Here's a tip. Next time he growls, put him down with a 12 bore.

[Sebastian Cobb]

Looks like Nandy's popped down to the picket line at the CWU strikes.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/aug/01/bt-and-openreach-strike-lisa-nandy-visits-picket-line-in-wigan

A cynical view could be they sent her down there to 'visit' (not join) and 'talk to' strikers re-enforcing the notion that Tarry's crime was talking out of turn.

[Zero Gravitas]

Looks like Nandy's popped down to the picket line at the CWU strikes.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/aug/01/bt-and-openreach-strike-lisa-nandy-visits-picket-line-in-wigan

A cynical view could be they sent her down there to 'visit' (not join) and 'talk to' strikers re-enforcing the notion that Tarry's crime was talking out of turn.

Given the fact she's also broadcasting the line:

In today's Daily Mirror @Keir_Starmer couldn't be clearer. People have every right to go out on strike for better wages and conditions. Now they need a Labour Government to hand power to working people again.

Seems accurate.

[shoulders]

I must have mislaid the pamphlet explaining which Labour policy hands power back to working people.

One of the funny things about centrists arguing that ONLY STUPID PEOPLE would believe Starmer's pledges is that what few policies he has uttered are presumably of equally worthless value, and, as even Johnson managed to correctly witheringly criticise, this means Starmer is a pointless bollard, unless you are so enraptured by his vacuity you implant something into him as though by doing so he will fulfil your dreams.

Imagine being so pathetic that Starmer is the person you choose for that.

Sadly, I find the adults in the room rarely manage to make it past a sentence or two of basic reading.

[dannyfc]

Tell me about it.  I have a small (less than A5) Freedom for Palestine thingy outside my house.  Old English shops-lift fellow growled at me You should take that down, it's the kind of thing that'll get you in trouble.

I like that your friendship with this gentleman persists despite the obvious differences in opinion.

[bgmnts]

Nice little poster you have here, shame if anything were to happen to you if it stays up.

[Johnny Yesno]

https://www.morningstaronline.co.uk/article/b/jewish-labour-members-slam-lack-of-justice

How long before the usual crew who perpetuated the antisemitism smears claim these Jews should be silent as factionalism prevents Labour from gaining power?

Poor Michael Howard (not that one).

Jewish Labour members slam lack of justice
Campaigners back call from John McDonnell to address 'unjust treatment of party activists'

Jewish campaigners backed calls today for the Labour Party leadership to urgently address its "brutal" and "unjust" treatment of a pro-Palestinian Jewish group within the party.

Jewish Voice for Labour (JVL) said that Labour's "malevolent machine," against the left has been "very painful" for Jewish activists accused of anti-semitism for supporting Palestinian rights.

The group was responding to a letter sent by former shadow chancellor John McDonnell to Labour leader Keir Starmer and general secretary David Evans last week.

In it, he said the treatment of JVL members by Labour had been "disregarding, disrespectful, at times uncaring, even brutal, and, some have argued, has amounted to discrimination."

He claimed that the recent Forde report into allegations of bullying, racism and sexism within Labour, published last month, showed that the party had "abused" disciplinary processes for "factional purposes," including to target members of JVL.

Mr McDonnell noted that there had been a disproportionate number of JVL members suspended, expelled and disciplined.

Out of 54 Jewish members of the party subjected to disciplinary proceedings, 47 belonged to JVL, he said, adding that JVL were 35 times more likely to face investigations than other members of the party.

Mr McDonnell said the Forde report also shows failures in the party's disciplinary processes, demonstrating that JVL members who faced punishments should have them rescinded or given the right to have their cases reviewed under a reformed procedure.

He called on Sir Keir to "urgently address" the "injustice meted out to JVL and its members."

JVL was formed in 2017 when Jeremy Corbyn was Labour leader with aims including standing up for the "rights and justice for Jewish people everywhere, and against wrongs and injustice to Palestinians and other oppressed people anywhere."

JVL said yesterday it welcomed Mr McDonnell's bid to pressure Sir Keir to act on the findings of Martin Forde QC's inquiry into the contents and leaking of an internal Labour dossier in 2020.

The shocking report found that senior Labour staff had "covertly" diverted funds towards "largely anti-Corbyn MPs" and concluded that there was an "undoubted overt and underlying racism and sexism apparent in some of the content of the WhatsApp messages between the party's most senior staff."

JVL co-founder Mike Cushman told the Star: "It has been very painful for so many of our Jewish members to be accused of anti-semitism merely for believing that the current Israeli state is oppressing Palestinians and breaking international law and human rights conventions on a daily basis — or just for questioning what the party calls its successful anti-racism campaign.

"It is worse when these accusations are made and left hanging for months or even years.

"Forde doesn't tell us if this is because of incompetence or from a deliberate policy of hurt and humiliation. Either is unacceptable."

Mr McDonnell's letter refers to three cases which he says highlight the "harsh brutality" of the treatment against JVL members. They include Michael Howard, whose family had fled the pogroms in Lithuania and Poland and who was suspended after 40 years of party membership on the basis of anonymous anti-semitism allegations.

Mr Howard died last November after an appeal against his suspension was ignored, Mr McDonnell said. "It's hard to appreciate fully the distressing impact this type of allegation can have on a member of the Jewish community and a lifelong socialist like Mike," he said.

Mr Cushman said the party's failure to acknowledge Mr Howard's appeal or his death "should be beyond belief.

"Such callous behaviour added greatly to the distress of his family at their difficult time," he said.

Labour said in response to Mr McDonnell's letter: "We're proud of the changes that have been made under Keir Starmer and David Evans's leadership but there is no room for complacency so we will always look at ways to improve our culture and practice to support all protected characteristics."

[Armed Traffic Warden]

Labour really is ensuring the next election won't be about voting between good and evil and instead simply voting for the lesser of two evils. It will be undoubtedly preferable that they get in over the tories but Christ alive they want us to resent voting for them.
 The only hope in the short/medium term for true progress (rather than slowing the decent as per a Starmer win) is a left wing counterplot/revolt against the labour right but I don't see it happening. Maybe the next 12/18 months sees the mass union movement change the landscape? We can only hope and be ready to march when called on.

[Johnny Yesno]

Labour really is ensuring the next election won't be about voting between good and evil and instead simply voting for the lesser of two evils. It will be undoubtedly preferable that they get in over the tories but Christ alive they want us to resent voting for them.
 The only hope in the short/medium term for true progress (rather than slowing the decent as per a Starmer win) is a left wing counterplot/revolt against the labour right but I don't see it happening. Maybe the next 12/18 months sees the mass union movement change the landscape? We can only hope and be ready to march when called on.

This.

[Paul Calf]

Why do you think the Labour Party has been so silent and acquiescent about the Tories' moves to ban protest?

[Buelligan]

Anyone with eyes and a brain knows that, Paul.  Same as the behaviour over spycops and the price of Rwanda these days.

Labour really is ensuring the next election won't be about voting between good and evil and instead simply voting for the lesser of two evils. It will be undoubtedly preferable that they get in over the tories but Christ alive they want us to resent voting for them.
 The only hope in the short/medium term for true progress (rather than slowing the decent as per a Starmer win) is a left wing counterplot/revolt against the labour right but I don't see it happening. Maybe the next 12/18 months sees the mass union movement change the landscape? We can only hope and be ready to march when called on.

I'm hoping that the unions are able to reignight the fire Corbyn lit and carry the torch away, far away from the smothering Labour Party.  They had their chance.  You can't trust people like that to keep the sacred flame.  Let's burn their house down.

[Paul Calf]

He won't. He can't. Corbyn and McDonnell are wrong about the Labour Party and all signs are that they will continue to be wrong. Truss will fuck up beyond the ability of the 'independent' media to protect her because she's shit at absolutely everything she does and the Labour Party might scrape home or take power with a coalition that will shoot down everything they try to do. Regardless, this will be seen as a new dawn for sadface austerity neoliberalism and the wreckers of 2017 and 2019 will spin it as a victory.

Or perhaps they won't, and the Tory plan to use their 80-seat majority to cement their power to maintain long after they've lost the ability or will to govern (imagine Major's government with their hands on a system that allowed them to stay in power indefinitely) will succeed. The prize of indefinite government by an organisation with a compulsion to maintain power at all costs will also be their punishment. And it will be ours too.

I joined a Trade Union and cancelled my Labour Party membership on the same day. Labour Isn't Working.

[Buelligan]

Not sure I fully understand who you mean but am in general agreement with the sentiment.

[Paul Calf]

Corbyn. He's not a revolutionary in any way at all. He still appears to believe that you can negotiate with people implacably opposed to absolutely everything you represent, and make progress through electoralism in a system designed from the root up to suppress any effort by ordinary people to change it to serve them, and by people bred to maintain their privilege over a dozen centuries.

He's a decent man, but I don't think he's built for the task ahead.

[pigamus]

As Owen Jones has pointed out, lefties aren't seen as legitimate political actors in this country. The only way I can see to change that is a new political party.

[Armed Traffic Warden]

I agree that a new party, led by a trustworthy, charismatic leader is the only viable alternative to Labour, outside perhaps massive investment and transformation in say, the Green Party.
  The one thing Labour are doing well is setting themselves up to share the Tory vote should a left wing party enter the race. However the money involved in setting up such a party would have to be huge as you'd need to ensure you really came across as a genuine alternative and not just a protest vote. I say they'd need a charismatic leader because, yeah, you need to win pretty much every battle in style against the media. You need to make it clear that the media ARE the establishment but do so with a touch of charm or else you'll cease to be promoted.
  Sadly, we either need to immediately start work on founding this party, or pray that it happens for us quickly. The fires of the unrest to come will hopefully be such as to forge such a party. However, unless we DO something about it, until it happens, I think we're stuck begrudgingly voting labour as to do otherwise would be wholly fruitless. It's better to slow our descent into hell than laugh as we glare t the driver.
  That said, the scales are slipping from peoples eyes. Their perception dulled by comfortable secure living is starting to return as that comfort gives way to nagging uncertainty. We are, I believe, heading towards a zeitgeist. Come the moment come the person. Whatever form the inevitable pushback to the increasing tyranny takes, we must be ready both to support it and to guide it in the right direction. It cannot be wasted in anger/violence alone. It must be channeled into change. Genuine change. Stripping the state of the dagger it holds to our throats; replacing it with a mighty sword with which to fight the enemies of its people. The systematic greed of capitalism, the bureaucracy that chokes our systems, the cultures of repression and segregation that permeate society  etc.


I'm so sorry. I got carried away tapping away on my phone. I'll post because I took a while writing it but I don't expect you to waste time reading it! Reading back it's amusing seeing my descent from, comparatively reasoned debate into rhetoric. I'm always happy to be the example of what NOT to do.

[Buelligan]

Corbyn. He's not a revolutionary in any way at all. He still appears to believe that you can negotiate with people implacably opposed to absolutely everything you represent, and make progress through electoralism in a system designed from the root up to suppress any effort by ordinary people to change it to serve them, and by people bred to maintain their privilege over a dozen centuries.

He's a decent man, but I don't think he's built for the task ahead.

Is anyone saying that above? 

But I do think you're slightly wrong.  He is a revolutionary or at least a catalyst for revolution.  He started this current fire of Hope.  It's up to us to be the revolutionaries.  Guard its flame from the hisses and stamping feet of the establishment be they tories or Labour or anyone else.  Carry it forward, spread it, support unions and everyone else who stands up and shows which side they're on.