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SPOILERS Fascinated by the first Mad max film

Started by Fambo Number Mive, July 18, 2022, 09:53:24 PM

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Fambo Number Mive

This post and thread will be full of spoilers for the Mad Max films. If you dont want spoilers, dont read any further.

I know the second and fourth films are more popular but I am fascinated by the world building in the first Mad Max film. My understanding is in the second film there was an energy crisis, and is this the reason for the societal decay in the first one as well, with the second one just further along the energy crisis?

It does seem odd that despite there still being some kind of a functional society such as diners and law courts, and television, there seem to be almost no police. I realise that Mad Max doesn't take place in a big Australian city, but even so the police are completely outgunned. There are at least two MFP stations - Sun City, which we never see, and Max's one - but the MFP seem to be low on personnel, equipment and morale. There seem.to be five officers at Max's station and they have to patrol a vast expanse of lawless countryside.

It feels very much like a Western in that the MFP are the only thing standing between the civilians and a group of depraved scoot jockeys or whatever you call them who pretty much just do what they want. Aside from Max and to an extent Goose, the other police officers are useless. There is very little co ordination on the Nightrider pursuit. The MFP already feel like some kind of post apocalypse types trying to bring law to the lawless rather than actual law enforcement officers. And of course Roop is a pervert who cant drive properly while Goose skives off when meant to be on patrol.

You do wonder, if there is an energy crisis that is so serious it is causing societal collapse, how can television stations still keep running? Or is it that they are owned by the wealthy and can bribe or influence the government as it brings in energy rationing?

I prefer the first half of the film, I think the revenge scene featuring the foot solider bikers is over too quickly and the scenes with Max and Jessie canoodling in the country drag a bit.

The first film is also the only film that doesn't have some kind of a hopeful ending, although I suppose killing a vicious biker gang that rapes and murders is somewhat hopeful theres no restoration of some kind of civilisation like there is with the others.

beanheadmcginty

I just assumed that was what Australia was like.

Fambo Number Mive

Another thing I wonder is how come Roop and Charlie have time to skive off in the first place. I know they are working in a rural area but given how dangerous the world is you would think they would be going from call to call. Unless they've done a Reg Hollis and claimed they were dealing with a call when in reality they are either having a rest or watching a couple have sex.

Mister Six

I believe there's a nuclear war between 1 and 2, precipitated by the energy crisis. Which is why everything is even more fucked up from that film onwards (insofar as there's any actual continuity).

samadriel

I believe the Mad Max films aren't meant to have a consistent continuity, they're all stories told throughout the history of the wasteland about a fictional hero called Max. I quite like this, and it explains the gulf between the original and part 2. Plus I don't have to think about Thunderdome!

13 schoolyards

The feeling I always got with the first film was that things were falling apart across the board, and a lot of people were just pulling out of society in general.

The MFP are undermanned because almost everyone has just taken their cars and driven off (or stopped answering calls) - some things still work because people are still coming into work, but it's all pretty much at random. That's why Max's chief keeps going on about needing a hero to inspire people or whatever, that's his big plan to motivate society when everyone else is like "sod this, this isn't working any more".

Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth

Mad Max 2 is better than Fury Road and I will fight anyone who says otherwise.

Quote from: samadriel on July 19, 2022, 06:34:28 AMI believe the Mad Max films aren't meant to have a consistent continuity, they're all stories told throughout the history of the wasteland about a fictional hero called Max. I quite like this, and it explains the gulf between the original and part 2. Plus I don't have to think about Thunderdome!
I think they're based on several different people's adventures. The storytellers amalgamate them all to be Max because we don't need another hero.

Shaky

Quote from: Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth on July 19, 2022, 10:00:38 AMMad Max 2 is better than Fury Road and I will fight anyone who says otherwise.

Of course it is - I love Fury Road but who the hell thinks it's better than 2?

Continuity in these films is deliberately vague so it's futile trying to reconcile them. The director gleefully doesn't bother in any interview so I don't understand why fans keep trying to. I mean, the third film throws a nuclear apocalypse into the equation when the first two films make no reference to anything like that. Societal collapse due to oil wars, innit?

Then iun the fourth film, Miller has said it's meant to be some 50 years since the, again, deliberately vague collapse of civilisation - which doesn't really work with Hardy's age or pre-apocalypse cop status.

Fambo Number Mive

I always thought there was meant to be a nuclear apocalypse after the oil wars - I had assumed that the oil wars had led to a conflict between two nuclear powers who probably were more at the first Mad Max stage of societal collapse while Australia was at Mad Max 2 stage, and they'd both fired off a load of nukes affecting other countries including Australia.

I don't know much about nuclear weapons as you can probably tell. I take the point that there isn't meant to be any continuity between the films, although this makes them a bit less enjoyable for me - perhaps I'm too focused on the worldbuilding.

Would love to see the deleted scenes from the first Mad Max film.

Famous Mortimer

Quote from: Shaky on July 19, 2022, 10:31:55 AMOf course it is - I love Fury Road but who the hell thinks it's better than 2?
Not a lot of sense arguing taste, but if I had a choice of both films to watch, I'd probably pick Fury Road.

13 schoolyards

Mad Max 2 and Fury Road are clearly the two highpoints of the series, but they're pretty different films. The wackiness that's so central to 2 feels a little tacked on in Fury Road - you wouldn't have to remove a whole lot to make Fury Road work as a full-on chase movie completely separate to the Mad Max series, while Mad Max 2 *is* the Max Max series to all intents and purposes (and not a lot of people would say the first film is the best example of what a Mad Max film should be).

Thunderdome at least has the Thunderdome, which in my childhood led to at least a dozen playground fights based entirely on chanting "two men enter, one man leave" while trapping a couple of kids inside a climbing frame


Pavlov`s Dog`s Dad`s Dead

Quote from: Famous Mortimer on July 19, 2022, 12:47:07 PMNot a lot of sense arguing taste, but if I had a choice of both films to watch, I'd probably pick Fury Road.
I'd maybe agree, but probably only because I've seen MM2 so many times. If pushed, I'd argue that MM2 is a much tighter film: fewer locations and characters to follow, and an apparently straightforward chase scenario at the climax. It sets up Max's motivation for driving the big rig - he basically has no other option after his first attempt to leave the refinery compound ends in failure and injury. So as a narrative, it's a more effective story than Fury Road, I reckon.

Perhaps more importantly, though, is how the movie set the tone for the post-apocalyptic environment: the two words "Mad Max" have become a short-hand for the kind of world depicted in MM2 in the way that Blade Runner set the tone for dystopian future worlds. Fury Road doesn't have anything like that novel impact: it's the same world, just dialled up to eleven. Don't get me wrong, it's a way better sequel than we had any right to expect, given the amount of time that passed since the first three, and I'm excited for the next movies set in that world to emerge, but 2 is still the pinnacle of what I suppose I'm going to have to call a franchise, now.

Rizla

Quote from: Fambo Number Mive on July 18, 2022, 09:53:24 PMthe other police officers are useless
You'd be useless if you'd just copped a saucepan in the throat.



Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth

I've tried with Fury Road. Lord knows I've tried, but it just leaves me cold.

It certainly didn't help seeing people wet themselves over the most inconsequential crap. "Oh my god! There was a car with spikes on it! How do they think of this stuff?! Waaaaaaggh!!!!"

Contemptible bastards!

Gulftastic

Surely most folks recognised that vehicle as a shout out to 'The Cars That Ate Paris'?

bgmnts

Quote from: Claude the Racecar Driving Rockstar Super Sleuth on July 19, 2022, 03:03:48 PMI've tried with Fury Road. Lord knows I've tried, but it just leaves me cold.

It certainly didn't help seeing people wet themselves over the most inconsequential crap. "Oh my god! There was a car with spikes on it! How do they think of this stuff?! Waaaaaaggh!!!!"

Contemptible bastards!

In an era of absolute shit fuck films, Fury Road was a breath of fresh air for me but different strokes.

Blumf

I think the problem with Fury Road is that it tries to intellectualise the situation too much. The concept of ownership and bodily autonomy, whilst valid, detract from the world building a bit too much. You don't need that depth in a Mad Max film, the immediate situation is clear and that's all that matters when you're trying to survive in a hostile world.

I still rate it up there with MM2.

Dex Sawash


No idea what the fuck is happening in any of them but haven't seen 2 or 3 in 20 years. Not sure I've seen the first one without the dub.

13 schoolyards

Quote from: Blumf on July 19, 2022, 10:02:34 PMI think the problem with Fury Road is that it tries to intellectualise the situation too much. The concept of ownership and bodily autonomy, whilst valid, detract from the world building a bit too much. You don't need that depth in a Mad Max film, the immediate situation is clear and that's all that matters when you're trying to survive in a hostile world.

I still rate it up there with MM2.

Yeah, the thing that makes the Mad Max movies work is that the world building is so vivid and immediate they can jump right into the action - every time they slow down to really explain anything (such as the back half of Thunderdome) it all falls apart.

It's interesting that they came up with a load of backstory for Fury Road and then cut it all out (and used it in the spin-off comic books, which are skippable) - the whole "how did Max get his car back" and "who are the ghostly figures haunting him" had concrete answers, which they wisely realised nobody sensible gave a shit about.

That said, it's a bit of a worry that Miller is working on a prequel. All the backstory the series has needed until now has been "world's fucked".

beanheadmcginty

Always got very strong Gary Glitter vibes from the baddie in Mad Max 2. This was long before finding out Glitter was a wrongun.

madhair60

Really liked Fury Road but I have a friend who says it's the best film ever which is just not correct on any level

Friend if you see this post I am sorry

JesusAndYourBush

Quote from: 13 schoolyards on July 20, 2022, 07:38:44 AMThat said, it's a bit of a worry that Miller is working on a prequel. All the backstory the series has needed until now has been "world's fucked".

For me, the first Mad Max film is the prequel.

I was familiar with the 2nd two films having seen them a bunch of times but I think I'd only seen the first film once sometime in the late 80s/early 90s and so by now I'd forgotten all about it.

So when it was on tv earlier this year I watched it (without reading anything about it beforehand) I was expecting to see the same world as in the 2nd film, and so I was surprised.  I only remembered a few scenes from my much earlier viewing.

So for me I don't need a prequel as we already have one.

druss

I find it difficult to choose between MM2 and Fury Road, probably lean towards MM2 as the madness seems more authentic. The action scenes definitely peaked with Fury Road though, it is mental what they got on film without the use of CGI.

The first half of Thunderdome is brilliant, falls apart when it turns into Mad Max goes to Neverland.

MM1 is a bit too normal, feels like a Mad Max pilot episode.

Pavlov`s Dog`s Dad`s Dead

Quote from: druss on July 20, 2022, 09:08:22 PMMM1 is a bit too normal, feels like a Mad Max pilot episode.
One of the things I love about MM1 is that sense of normality tottering: the opening sequence is astonishingly kinetic, but also sets the tone well - society is more dangerous, sure, as the road sign tells us, but people still feel safe enough to take the caravan away for the weekend. I mean, Max takes his family off in their panel van for a road trip, and he's a traffic cop. Roadside diners still function.

The business with the station master is very well-judged, I reckon, in terms of illustrating the seams of society fraying, but that small town seemed to be rubbing along ok before the Toe-cutter and his mob bring the ultraviolence.

To bring things back on-topic from the sequels, MM1 is overshadowed by 2, but it's an amazing B-movie in its own right, set in a well-observed and credible world.

13 schoolyards

One of the things the first Mad Max really taps into is the emptiness (not desolation - that's the later films) of stretches of the Australian countryside. I've traveled more than once through some of the locations outside Melbourne where they filmed the road sequences, and despite being only half an hour or so from the city fringe there's just nothing there but fences and the occasional farm house.

Even today it's not hard to believe that if society was crumbling a bunch of lunatics with enough petrol could cruise around wreaking havoc. Especially as the only serious development out there since the 70s has been building a bunch of prisons

Shaky

That bleak beauty really stuck with me as a kid, so much so that I moved from the UK to, er, Brisbane as an adult. But I've been on those sorts of roads and sparse landscapes and they do have a certain brutal romanticism to them. They can be both incredibly isolating and great places to breathe and contemplate. It's a cliche to say it now but they really do function as another character in the MM movies, one that changes over the first three films (Fury Road having been filmed in South Africa, natch). Looking foward to Furiosa in part because they're filming at a lot of the old locations.

Dex Sawash


I think Fury Road would have made a pretty good episode of Bluey as long as they had cuddles at the end.

Bluey: we should have three cars stacked on each other

Bandit: where should the guitar player go?

Bluey and Bingo: <jumping up and down> ON THE FRONT ON THE FRONT

Bingo: I have to do a wee

Poobum

Love Fury Road, it's just relentless and implies at a fascinating world. MM2 is fine but the last time I watched I couldn't help but notice how poorly paced and disjointed the last chase sequence is. People just blip out of existence when it's not their scene and the bad guys do dumb and illogical things. In contrast, Fury Road's chase scenes are perfect. I know it's all budget and the artistry is there in both, but I can't go back now, Fury Road is obviously the realized vision and I love it.

The original Mad Max is a very weird film in some way - because of the ultra low budget they obviously couldn't depict the collapse of civilisation on screen, so it's just implied through the escalating violence and chaos and we have to kind-of accept that the world is falling apart everywhere else, which gives it a very strange vibe.

I also didn't realise until re-watching it recently that the actual killing of Max's family and him hunting down the gang happens really late in the film, like in the last twenty minutes or so. It always felt like a much bigger part of the story, but by the time he goes proper mad, it's nearly over! It's still great though.

It's also interesting to think about in context of the wider Ozploitation genre, which really kicked off in the seventies with all kinds of films pushing the envelope in terms of sex and violence content, but for some reason MM was the one that broke through and became a huge cult classic. Notably, Stone from 1974, a film about biker gangs which I suspect was a big influence on Miller, and also featured Hugh-Keays Berne in a prominent role.