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Norcott vs Hound: Guardian blind date woke wars

Started by dissolute ocelot, July 30, 2022, 10:53:47 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

dissolute ocelot

The Guardian has a series where it puts people on opposite sides of politics together for a meal. This week it's "britain's only centre-right comic" Geoff Norcott, and Rufus Hound who is opposed to starving the unemployed into work. (Sidebar: most people on benefits are in work.)

Norcott talks about trying and failing to write a trans joke that people will laugh at; it's obvious that he has found a USP but is struggling to write the jokes to go with it. He comes out with some stupid, ill-informed opinions like blaming Labour for everything that's wrong with Britain, and how people on benefits get too much money.

It's not very informative. There's little evidence that they actually had a conversation about politics, as opposed to telling a Guardian journo stuff before or after. I imagine they spent the whole evening bitching about how they can't get on TV, and other things comedians say. They agree at the end that being a comedian is a sacred bond that politics cannot sunder.

jobotic

There was one of Billy Bragg and Tim Wetherspoons Cunt.

It was so badly done that they just seemed to say thing unrelated to what the other said. Utterly pointless.

Fambo Number Mive

QuoteGeoff I suppose I was naturally Labour. My parents were disabled, I lived on a council estate. But in the 00s I saw a lot of people out of work and nothing happening to them.

What would you like to have "happen" to them? More access to affordable training? CV and interview courses? Attempts to create more jobs? Improved public transport locally to make it easier for people to get to and retain jobs?

QuoteBenefits were at a level where there was a slight disincentive to work.

Oh.

QuoteMy mum was on disability allowance and there was no meaningful effort to get her back into the workplace – she was really smart and that was a shame.

Right, what "meaningful effort" would you like to have seen and how is that taking place under a Tory government?

Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse

QuoteMy mum was on disability allowance and there was no meaningful effort to get her back into the workplace – she was really smart and that was a shame.

In the absence of companies being made to provide all the necessary accommodations for someone with a disability to work for them (or hell, just a lack of jobs that are suitable for someone with a disability to perform), maybe give people a generous disability allowance??? Like anyway????? So they don't have to fucking worry about rent and bills and food on top of everything else?

Kankurette

Is his mum capable of working, and what job does he envisage her doing? I ask because one of my mum's mates from Brighton had to retire due to chronic back pain - she worked with kids, I think she was a nursery school teacher, and there was a lot of lifting involved - and she got her benefits cut despite being genuinely disabled. She and Mum and another friend do an annual trip to the Royal Academy and recently, she's had to take a lot of breaks because she's in so much pain.

Lockdown proved that companies can accommodate disabled people, they just don't want to. And while I'm here, fuck whoever came up with the Bradford Scale. They use it in the NHS. The HR people fucking KNEW I had fibro, I was even under one of the rheumatology consultants at the hospital I worked in, and I still got penalised for taking too many days off. I was on Stage 2 or whatever it's called.

bgmnts

The problem with the notion of debate is that for most people, they are just set in their ways and they will not change their mind, especially nowadays.

You could get Gore Vidal, Noam Chomsky and Slavoj Zizek in a room to explain things to these cunts and they'd still come out complaining about lazy unemployed, dirty forrins and woke culture.

BritishHobo

It is an odd article. As some of you have said, it just reads like two individual Q&A sessions being stitched together.

Definitely some intrigue in there though - Geoff saying audiences aren't actually that interested in offence, and Rufus not really being on board with the reaction to Carr's Holocaust joke both imply more of a middle ground than the headline suggests.

Kankurette

And so many people are OBSESSED with getting randos to debate with them on the internet. I had a friend try to make me debate with him about trans people. I don't like debating. I never did it at school, I don't know all the Latin terms he threw at me except ad hominem. I've only changed my mind about things after someone argued with me on the internet very occasionally. Maybe it's the fact that I'm a wuss about confrontation but I don't get the appeal. Am I supposed to say 'why yes, it is you who are in the right'?

Poirots BigGarlickyCorpse

Quote from: Kankurette on July 30, 2022, 03:34:15 PMAnd so many people are OBSESSED with getting randos to debate with them on the internet. I had a friend try to make me debate with him about trans people. I don't like debating. I never did it at school, I don't know all the Latin terms he threw at me except ad hominem.
why am I not surprised it was a man?

bgmnts

Quote from: Kankurette on July 30, 2022, 03:34:15 PMAnd so many people are OBSESSED with getting randos to debate with them on the internet. I had a friend try to make me debate with him about trans people. I don't like debating. I never did it at school, I don't know all the Latin terms he threw at me except ad hominem. I've only changed my mind about things after someone argued with me on the internet very occasionally. Maybe it's the fact that I'm a wuss about confrontation but I don't get the appeal. Am I supposed to say 'why yes, it is you who are in the right'?

You just say listen there is no debate here you will never change your mind and I do not want to waste my time with your biases and bad faith arguments.

somersetchris

Quote from: dissolute ocelot on July 30, 2022, 10:53:47 AMIt's not very informative. There's little evidence that they actually had a conversation about politics, as opposed to telling a Guardian journo stuff before or after.

If a genuine discussion did take place between the two of them, Rufus Hound would absolutely run rings around Norcott, I would imagine.

poodlefaker

guess where Billy Bragg and Tim Martin had dinner


Stoneage Dinosaurs


Rizla

Quote from: poodlefaker on August 01, 2022, 06:54:56 PMguess where Billy Bragg and Tim Martin had dinner
Not in glasgow, that's for sure - you'd be hard pushed to get a Billy and a Tim in the same room there!!!!

dothestrand

Still think Rufus Hound's best contribution to comedy in CBeebies' Waffle the Wonder Dog.

Ambient Sheep

Quote from: bgmnts on July 30, 2022, 03:30:53 PMThe problem with the notion of debate is that for most people, they are just set in their ways and they will not change their mind, especially nowadays.

Agreed in general, but there was one of these a few months ago where the leftie actually managed to change the rightie's mind on something.

Wish I could remember where... ooooh, browser history to the rescue:

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/jun/02/dining-across-the-divide-labour-tory-brexit-corruption-jk-rowling

Blimey, only two months ago!  Would have sworn it was longer ago than that.  And the issue he changed his mind on?  Trans people!


phantom_power

Quote from: dissolute ocelot on July 30, 2022, 10:53:47 AMNorcott talks about trying and failing to write a trans joke that people will laugh at; it's obvious that he has found a USP but is struggling to write the jokes to go with it

I saw him on a bill with a few other comedians a while ago. He started doing some material about trans people but the reaction was so bad that he gave up and quickly changed the subject