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Cost Of Living Crisis (COLC) - How fucked are ye?

Started by shoulders, August 04, 2022, 07:11:31 PM

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superthunderstingcar

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on August 06, 2022, 08:49:27 AMGoing to eat some Shreddies for breakfast any alphas or misanthropes able to tell me how I'm going to do it wrong and what the real tactics should be here?
Post pics of any joined-up Shreddies you encounter, especially 2x2 or larger (you should be so lucky). They're one of the few remaining little things that makes life worth living.

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: superthunderstingcar on August 06, 2022, 02:00:22 PMPost pics of any joined-up Shreddies you encounter, especially 2x2 or larger (you should be so lucky). They're one of the few remaining little things that makes life worth living.

I'll level with you, in the pursuit of comedic baiting alliteration I lied, I don't actually eat Shreddies but Sainsbury's own brand "Malties" (theeeeeirrrr Ggggggoood value).  I just wanted to pretend to be a big shot.

M-CORP

Quote from: Poobum on August 06, 2022, 12:41:41 PMTwo years in to a uni course, being a middle aged mental who has never worked, the terror spikes that I'm throwing myself from miserable yet relative safety into utter chaos that will break me. I'm all soft and supple and have never had to grind at a miserable job to earn enough to not pay bills.

See, this is me as well, apart from the middle aged bit. Only 21. About to enter final year of uni, do have a bit of money put aside from working last summer as a temp General Assistant in uni halls of residence, but then again, all the paid work I've ever done has so far been with my university. I wasn't as lucky this summer. And the perks of campus life have been the best thing about uni, so yeah, not looking forward to getting out of that and having to find a job without being choosy. That said, not too keen on returning home either (get on well with parents but it would feel like lockdown again and a step backwards from independence), so yeah. It has terrified me on occasion. I sympathise.

On another note, went shopping in Sainsbury's today. Could have sworn 640g chicken breasts weren't as steep as £4 before - 6 days worth of food came to £35, which used to cover 7 and a bit of chocolate or household cleaner or whatever - but there we are.

TrenterPercenter

@M-CORP don't let fear dictate your life (not saying you are just prerequisite to this old man sage advice I'm about to give).

I graduated a few years before the big one 2008, in remember being terrified at the time, pouring through the Guardian everyday and thinking the worst but it doesn't help worrying about it too much.  I was working with people then that told me "lived through loads of them" and they were right, so had I in fact, I just not in a working capacity.  This is what happens, it is cyclical so it's best to accept it, not accept it as in it should happen (that's another thing), just that it happens and it can have impacts on people beyond their control.  It's perfectly normal to be fearful but don't let it terrorise or dictate your life, if you can't keep your independence and have to move back home know that it's only temporary and lots of others will have to do the same (also some advantages of saving and helping out the folks).

I guess I'm saying keep positive and alert but also recognise somethings are out of our control, easy to get overwhelmed in all the misery.

M-CORP

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on August 06, 2022, 02:36:33 PM@M-CORP don't let fear dictate your life (not saying you are just prerequisite to this old man sage advice I'm about to give).

I graduated a few years before the big one 2008, in remember being terrified at the time, pouring through the Guardian everyday and thinking the worst but it doesn't help worrying about it too much.  I was working with people then that told me "lived through loads of them" and they were right, so had I in fact, I just not in a working capacity.  This is what happens, it is cyclical so it's best to accept it, not accept it as in it should happen (that's another thing), just that it happens and it can have impacts on people beyond their control.  It's perfectly normal to be fearful but don't let it terrorise or dictate your life, if you can't keep your independence and have to move back home know that it's only temporary and lots of others will have to do the same (also some advantages of saving and helping out the folks).

I guess I'm saying keep positive and alert but also recognise somethings are out of our control, easy to get overwhelmed in all the misery.

Absolutely, I should say the worry stage is something that's happened for me, currently in a state of acceptance till I have to actually think about plans after next year (Graduate schemes open up in September, and I've got Edinburgh Fringe and birthdays before that!). I just sympathised with Poobum's current predicament stated earlier.

Whenever there's a bad economical forecast, my dad always goes on about how high unemployment and inflation was in the Thatcher era. It's quite amusing, really. But yeah maybe we allow bad economy predictions to dictate and depress us too much.

Mr Vegetables

Quote from: Poobum on August 06, 2022, 12:41:41 PMTwo years in to a uni course, being a middle aged mental who has never worked, the terror spikes that I'm throwing myself from miserable yet relative safety into utter chaos that will break me. I'm all soft and supple and have never had to grind at a miserable job to earn enough to not pay bills. Also just spent a horrible amount of money after being fucked by post Brexit visa issues, still, am going to Italy for three months on Monday, so if it really goes to shit while I'm away, claim asylum?

For some reason I don't remember I subscribe to a self-help podcast for American girl bosses, despite belonging to none of those three categories themselves. Mentioning because I thought this episode on uncertainty was really good, despite my being in entirely the wrong demographic.

So many of these things are about trying to convince yourself things won't be so bad, but this one is about saying "how can you cope with the idea they might be?" I find that a lot more useful really, and frankly something of a relief. You have to do a lot of convincing yourself with an anxiety disorder, so a different approach to it is a lot less work

TrenterPercenter

#156
I suffer with an anxiety disorder (GAD), I was pretty bad at one stage but I've recovered quite a bit since and know how to manage things.

Anxiety imo is the root of a lot of problems (I think I mentioned in the SSRI thread the theories around the active agent actually being the anxiolytic with depression being referred "exhaustion" of the adrenal system).  This is also why CBT or "thinking in words to convince yourself" can be difficult because anxiety is more involved in your HPA-Axis which includes much older parts "none thinking/language" parts of the brain (CBT is all about the PFC language/thoughts/reasoning) as well as your kidneys (where the adrenal is secreted).  In this sense multi-sensory and emotional-based therapies I've found more useful alongside exercise (burning off adrenaline) and anxiolytics (though diminishing returns from opioids eventually).

The rumination on doom and despair is a well known aspect of anxiety - its the embedded survival technique of attuning to risk and there are bodily incentives in doing so i.e. it can make it feel good pre-threshold, morbid fascination etc...but it also spills into anger which is a survival response in itself.

Btw Mr Veg what you are describing there from the podcast "how can you cope with the idea they might be?" is literally CBT how can you cope (behaviour) with the idea (feelings) they might be (thoughts).  Anyway, I think what I was alluding to was acceptance which kind of comes into that, anxiety often increases with resistance to it eventually leading in some cases to anxiety about being anxious therefore acceptance can give people the emotional space to escape these feedback loops.

Pranet

Whenever people say maybe things will not be so bad I find I myself wondering if, for example, there were people in Poland in the summer of 1939 saying the same thing. This probably isn't very helpful for anyone.

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: M-CORP on August 06, 2022, 02:58:40 PMWhenever there's a bad economical forecast, my dad always goes on about how high unemployment and inflation was in the Thatcher era. It's quite amusing, really. But yeah maybe we allow bad economy predictions to dictate and depress us too much.

Our bodies have evolved to protect us, and as such we can catastrophes things that doesn't mean things can never be really bad (like Poland 1939) just that often they are not.

Quote from: Pranet on August 06, 2022, 03:36:15 PMWhenever people say maybe things will not be so bad I find I myself wondering if, for example, there were people in Poland in the summer of 1939 saying the same thing. This probably isn't very helpful for anyone.

Funny to bring up ze war because the psychological areas of resilience and coping, a big chunk of the original evidence base is literally from survivors in concentration camps.   People that survived against the odds and went on to live largely unimpaired lives and in many cases thriving.  The studies identified ways of thinking and acting that help promote psychologically protective factors for individuals - one of them being not giving into despair and believing the worst would happen (aka hope).

jamiefairlie

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on August 06, 2022, 03:33:04 PMI suffer with an anxiety disorder (GAD), I was pretty bad at one stage but I've recovered quite a bit since and know how to manage things.

Anxiety imo is the root of a lot of problems (I think I mentioned in the SSRI thread the theories around the active agent actually being the anxiolytic with depression being referred "exhaustion" of the adrenal system).  This is also why CBT or "thinking in words to convince yourself" can be difficult because anxiety is more involved in your HPA-Axis which includes much older parts "none thinking/language" parts of the brain (CBT is all about the PFC language/thoughts/reasoning) as well as your kidneys (where the adrenal is secreted).  In this sense multi-sensory and emotional-based therapies I've found more useful alongside exercise (burning off adrenaline) and anxiolytics (though diminishing returns from opioids eventually).

The rumination on doom and despair is a well known aspect of anxiety - its the embedded survival technique of attuning to risk and there are bodily incentives in doing so i.e. it can make it feel good pre-threshold, morbid fascination etc...but it also spills into anger which is a survival response in itself.

Btw Mr Veg what you are describing there from the podcast "how can you cope with the idea they might be?" is literally CBT how can you cope (behaviour) with the idea (feelings) they might be (thoughts).  Anyway, I think what I was alluding to was acceptance which kind of comes into that, anxiety often increases with resistance to it eventually leading in some cases to anxiety about being anxious therefore acceptance can give people the emotional space to escape these feedback loops.

Yeah spot on. I'm a perfectionist and developed that habit as a protection against criticism, which hurts me deeply. It ended up utterly exhausting me and the fear of failure became more damaging than failure itself. After I went through a series of traumatic personal disasters, I'm less fearful of what might be as I've been through the real thing.

Pranet

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on August 06, 2022, 03:58:45 PMFunny to bring up ze war because the psychological areas of resilience and coping, a big chunk of the original evidence base is literally from survivors in concentration camps.   People that survived against the odds and went on to live largely unimpaired lives and in many cases thriving.  The studies identified ways of thinking and acting that help promote psychologically protective factors for individuals - one of them being not giving into despair and believing the worst would happen (aka hope).


Great I look forward to it then.

Memorex MP3

I'm okay, I'll get by, think there's a small chance I'll lose my job but I can vanish for a couple of years and have the mental breakdown I've been putting off. Mostly just really struggling to connect with anyone, I've very little to add to most conversations beyond talking about how everything is going to get much worse so it generally seems better to just not bother anyone unless there's something I can help out with (and that seems to mostly be fiscal help at the moment, very much feels like it's past the point where emotional support is worth a shit when people are just getting buried in expenses)

Quote from: shoulders on August 06, 2022, 09:34:46 AMI can't speak for everyone but I'd be surprised if I was the only person sick of you overrunning so many threads
Does have remarkable form for it; honestly not even sure if I ever agree or disagree with them, the discussion just seems to descend into mildly unpleasant white noise for me.

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: Memorex MP3 on August 06, 2022, 04:13:10 PMDoes have remarkable form for it; honestly not even sure if I ever agree or disagree with them, the discussion just seems to descend into mildly unpleasant white noise for me.

Is that really necessary? just seems utterly nasty dredging that back up now - is it about hoping to create a ruck of some sort? Not even given a name, "white noise", I'm just talking to people the same as anyone else.

Seriously sorry for whatever you feel I've done to you, I don't even know who you are but I'm sorry for just using the forum as most other people do, and I'm sorry for the pain/situation you are going through right now.

Poobum

Quote from: Mr Vegetables on August 06, 2022, 03:03:37 PMMentioning because I thought this episode on uncertainty was really good


This was very interesting. I find it utterly pointless going down the route of 'things might not be so bad' I've lived too much otherwise. She touched on a thing I have in that I don't really fear something going wrong, I fear the self loathing and vicious attack that I punish myself with if it does, cause that's where the blame is gonna go. Definitely something I'm trying to change and often failing. Want to get to that stage of 'that happened, what now?' and being proactive. And, to be honest, everything that can go wrong has gone wrong with my Italy placement and I'm still going. Getting anxious putting my bins out and now I gotta cope getting myself from Rome to some mountain village. A more interesting thing to fuck up at least.

TrenterPercenter

@Poobum and others you might find this site useful there is loads of stuff on here that can help for Anxiety sufferers (got me through some rough times).

https://www.nomorepanic.co.uk/forum.php


shoulders

https://youtu.be/8cpcjd37Xug

Asking bankers how to cope with the cost of living crisis

Trigger warning: May make you want to punch through entire walls

Mr Farenheit

Quote from: TrenterPercenter on August 06, 2022, 08:52:08 AMThat was the plan but now I'm informed there is more life in dead things than live things so I'll probably just burn a load of cats.

Youre switching from vandalism of a nature reserve to theft to murdering animals. Which is it? These are not justified, I don't care how cold you are.

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: Mr Farenheit on August 07, 2022, 09:58:26 AMYoure switching from vandalism of a nature reserve to theft to murdering animals. Which is it? These are not justified, I don't care how cold you are.

Sorry for the late reply thought I'd forgo the Malties this morning and start work on a seasoning stack of cats and canal driftwood.  The cats are fidgety little blighters so have taken to nailing them through the beavers onto the planks.

Lemming

Funny that Nestle™ Shreddies® were mentioned because I was desperately trying to think of what to eat the other day and landed on them, went to Tesco and was shocked to discover they were like £3 for a shitty mid-sized box. The shelf of Nestle™ Shreddies® was almost full, but just below it, Tesco's own "Malt Wheats" were nearly sold out. Everyone forced to accept the inferior option, defeated. Bought one of the last remaining Malt Wheats with a sigh, gritty and nasty as expected. I bet Rishi was munching down on his Nestle™ Shreddies® at the exact same moment, the cunt. Having a bath of Nestle™ Shreddies®. Bastard.

On topic, there was a guy on the radio just now who gave a series of desperately depressing snippets of advice, ranging from "try only filling the kettle as much as you need to avoid wasting extra electricity" to "consider cold showers", but still concluded with "but obviously, none of these are really going to help anyone against the coming storm". Desolation. Let's all try to fill our kettles to the exact millilitre necessary while the ground erodes out from under us regardless. I love how it's still "the coming cost of living crisis" - what the fuck is this meant to be if not a currently in-progress COLC?

Alberon

This is just the sea unexpectedly going out, the tsunami will be along shortly.

greencalx

Such is the general innumeracy among the political and media classes that they think a 150% increase in fuel bills can be counteracted by a 0.1% reduction in energy usage. Or tax cuts.

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: Lemming on August 07, 2022, 05:29:07 PMFunny that Nestle™ Shreddies® were mentioned because I was desperately trying to think of what to eat the other day and landed on them, went to Tesco and was shocked to discover they were like £3 for a shitty mid-sized box. The shelf of Nestle™ Shreddies® was almost full, but just below it, Tesco's own "Malt Wheats" were nearly sold out. Everyone forced to accept the inferior option, defeated. Bought one of the last remaining Malt Wheats with a sigh, gritty and nasty as expected. I bet Rishi was munching down on his Nestle™ Shreddies® at the exact same moment, the cunt. Having a bath of Nestle™ Shreddies®. Bastard.


Saino's Malties are pretty close (just less sweet which I prefer) and still £1.20 for 100g

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: greencalx on August 07, 2022, 06:01:22 PMSuch is the general innumeracy among the political and media classes that they think a 150% increase in fuel bills can be counteracted by a 0.1% reduction in energy usage. Or tax cuts.

Which makes you wonder what exactly are they up to.  They can't be seriously thinking they will just sit aside whilst 25-50% of people will not be able to pay their bills.

Either they want this to happen OR they will come up with some "war time" solution they are just haggling over what this is going to be at the moment.

Alberon

Truss supporter Penny Mordaunt said today that when Truss ruled out handouts she didn't actually mean she'd ruled out handouts.

Truss is going to borrow to fund tax and National Insurance cuts. Beyond that I doubt she has a plan.

Buelligan

Quote from: Pranet on August 06, 2022, 03:36:15 PMWhenever people say maybe things will not be so bad I find I myself wondering if, for example, there were people in Poland in the summer of 1939 saying the same thing. This probably isn't very helpful for anyone.

Facing disaster and believing you can beat it is a great advantage.  Have a friend, who lives in my village, her grandmother was a young pregnant woman living in Poland during the war and she walked, with just what she had on her back, alone, to Free France.  Had her kid and made a new life for them both.

TrenterPercenter

Quote from: Alberon on August 07, 2022, 06:13:13 PMTruss supporter Penny Mordaunt said today that when Truss ruled out handouts she didn't actually mean she'd ruled out handouts.

Truss is going to borrow to fund tax and National Insurance cuts. Beyond that I doubt she has a plan.

This is why this ridiculous leadership contest should be brought to a close.  It's a shortened version and it still seems like it has gone on forever.   It is quite possible that they will be looking to use this as some form of shock doctrine, perhaps something like, "we can give you all money to pay the bills but we've had to pawn the NHS in order to do so".

superthunderstingcar

Quote from: greencalx on August 07, 2022, 06:01:22 PMSuch is the general innumeracy among the political and media classes that they think a 150% increase in fuel bills can be counteracted by a 0.1% reduction in energy usage. Or tax cuts.
Haven't you heard, every time you take a cold shower you're allowed to write to your energy provider and then they have to take 10% off your standing charge?



Jerrykeshton

Quote from: superthunderstingcar on August 06, 2022, 02:00:22 PMPost pics of any joined-up Shreddies you encounter, especially 2x2 or larger (you should be so lucky). They're one of the few remaining little things that makes life worth living.
Livin' la Vida Lidl