Lost - Season 6 [The Final Season]

[Ja'moke]

I just realised that the actor who plays Jacob in Lost also plays Lucifer in Supernatural. Is he getting typecast as archetypal deities?

He played an ex-drug addict/wife-beater in Dexter, I'm not sure which religion has the deity of spousal abuse? ;)

[Artemis]

Well my dad's did.*



*It didn't actually, my dad's a lovely bloke.

[Ja'moke]

This is pretty funny, people who have never seen Lost get to watch certain key scenes:

http://www.newsweek.com/id/40211#?t=64735611001&l=1785302026

[JesusAndYourBush]

...or Jack may even manage to "fix" him so he can walk again?

Since we don't yet know whether Jack met his wife and performed his miracle operation on her in the other timeline it's quite possible that he doesn't and yet is destined to perform a miracle operation and ends up fixing Locke.  Presumably they're going to keep on showing us scenes from the other timeline all the way through the season and we'll probably find out that things in their past happened differently.  We already know a little, like Sun & Jin not being married.

[Custard]

[Rev]

- INTERMISSION -

Will anyone bother with Lost after the final episode has aired?

This is, of course, a pub conversation that took place at the weekend and is now spilling onto here.  I'm really not convinced that anyone will.  This time next year, the box sets will be heavily discounted, and in five years, they'll be regular fixtures in charity shops because nobody will be particularly bothered about taking them with them when they move house.  Once the final episode has aired, the spell will be broken.

It's no Twin Peaks, is what I'm saying.  Exciting as it was to wait a week for the next episode of that one, and deflating as the later episodes were, it's still compelling when revisited.  It's the closest comparison I can come up with to Lost, and Lost really comes up short in comparison. 

[Ja'moke]

- INTERMISSION -

Will anyone bother with Lost after the final episode has aired?

This is, of course, a pub conversation that took place at the weekend and is now spilling onto here.  I'm really not convinced that anyone will.  This time next year, the box sets will be heavily discounted, and in five years, they'll be regular fixtures in charity shops because nobody will be particularly bothered about taking them with them when they move house.  Once the final episode has aired, the spell will be broken.

It's no Twin Peaks, is what I'm saying.  Exciting as it was to wait a week for the next episode of that one, and deflating as the later episodes were, it's still compelling when revisited.  It's the closest comparison I can come up with to Lost, and Lost really comes up short in comparison.

I totally disagree, I think Lost will be discussed for a long time after its gone, perhaps forever. I've never seen Twin Peaks so I can't make a fair comparison, but from what I know Twin Peaks was 'made up as it went along' right? And I don't think the show had as much fandom, theorising and speculation than Lost does now, although to be fair Lost has had the use of the internet which has allowed for these theories and ideas to grow and grow. But regardless, Lost has such a dedicated fanbase that I'm sure the mysteries of the show will be discussed forever, because I doubt they are going to answer everything this season.

Also, if this season does have a satisfying ending I think that will secure its place as the best mystery drama ever created, and will leave behind such a strong legacy that future generations can enjoy just as much as we have.

I re-watched the entire series before Season 6 started, and as I said in the other thread, the show stands up really well to repeat viewing, with only those first few episodes of Season 3 dropping in quality.

I think Lost towers above its counterparts such as Heroes, FlashFoward and V, and that will show in years to come.

[Marv Orange]

I totally disagree, I think Lost will be discussed for a long time after its gone, perhaps forever.

Think its completely dependent on the ending, they wrap up too much and there is nothing to discuss wrap up too little and people will be resentful of it. My feeling is that they'll go for a Sopranos type ending where they leave a big enough question open to keep people talking but not to sully the time people have invested in the show.

Or it will turn out everyones dad wasnt as bad as the show made out, they have all been brought back to life and the ending is a montage of hugs and teary eyes with the final shot of them standing on beach waving at the camera.

[purlieu]

I still think the father thing has something to do with it.

[Ja'moke]

There was a nice theory on the Jay and Jack podcast, that Desmond is the one trying to somehow join the two timelines together. The idea being that the island sunk after the hydrogen bomb exploded in 1977, that means Eloise and Charles Widmore went down with the island and drowned, meaning that Penny was never born and therefore never met Desmond and they never fell in love. Desmond, being uniquely and miraculously special, has access to both timelines and can jump in and out of both, hence why he seemed to appear and then disappear on the plane. He has to get things back to one timeline, preferrably the one where Penny is alive and well.

[purlieu]

Y'know what, if that's true, I'm going to love this season a lot.  On the other hand, the surprise won't be there, so I'll be severely disappointed.
Mixed emotions here.

[TotalNightmare]

I presumed that whatever happened with the explosion triggered something worse. I'm thinking its got something to do with the volcano on the island - once mentioned but never discovered. It was the episode that had Samantha Mathis as a teacher at Dharma and she was talking about said volcano... It was initially what i thought the ash was involved in, but a massive eruption could sink the island...

I'm also hoping that Desmond is flitting between universes and is the bridge for one to help the other... that would be 'most good'!

[purlieu]

"The island isn't finished with you yet, Desmond".

[Artemis]

I'd absolutely love it if it somehow hinges on Desmond and Penny. That's such a weirdly wonderful relationship, I'm not even sure why I like it so much. I definitely think it'll be down to something human and character based as opposed to physics and space time.

[purlieu]

I like them because they have such chemistry on screen, because they're both massively important to the plot and its characters in different ways, and yet neither of them was on the 'plane or was even seen in the first series.  And because Desmond's a fucking dude.

[Ja'moke]

The only problem with it is that Desmond isn't a main cast member this season, so I'm not sure how big his role will be, but regardless I'm sure he'll have some impact on the alternate timeline.

[Rev]

I totally disagree, I think Lost will be discussed for a long time after its gone, perhaps forever. I've never seen Twin Peaks so I can't make a fair comparison, but from what I know Twin Peaks was 'made up as it went along' right? And I don't think the show had as much fandom, theorising and speculation than Lost does now

Christ almighty, you've got to be kidding.  The public and press penetration of that first series of Peaks was the kind of thing that you only see once in a lifetime, and probably not the kind of thing that could ever happen again.  Lost fans seem rather disinterested and prone to a tiny bit of casual speculation in comparison.  But there is indeed the internet now, and it does tend to blow these things out of proportion.

It was probably 'made up as it went along' to the same extent as Lost, really.  'Darlton' have been reasonably open about the fact that they've made stuff up on-the-fly, and their insistence that they've always known how it will end has always sounded like they've had an idea for a final scene or image, rather than an end point for the story.  Remember when they said that the revelation of what the smoke monster is would be the very last mystery to be explained at the end of the final series?  That could still be true, but I think we've got as much as we're going to get in that department.

None of which is a criticism, of course.  I like the idea of the writers thinking on their feet, and continually painting themselves into corners.  It is rewatchable...  now.  But even now, most of the second and third series, and even a fair whack of the first, feel like water-treading.  I have a feeling that we'll be assembling lists of about a dozen key episodes to bother with when this wraps up, and I very much doubt that anyone will be ploughing through the whole run again.  Could be wrong, but it's a hunch.

Anyway:  Desmond.  There's no credible way of making him a main cast member for this series, but he must be crucial, surely?  Either that or his brief appearance was just a nod, and one of many cameos we'll no doubt be seeing.  Personally I'd have preferred him to have fucked off forever when his natural storyline was concluded, much as I like the character.

[kidsick5000]

Desmond is more than a cameo. You'll have to take my word on that. But he's in it a lot more

[vrailaine]

It was probably 'made up as it went along' to the same extent as Lost, really.

Asides from not really concluding anything. I've found Twin Peaks to be mainly known now due to it being David Lynch's television show, as opposed to being some great speculative show... which it really isn't, definitely aged and all.

[Ja'moke]

Christ almighty, you've got to be kidding.  The public and press penetration of that first series of Peaks was the kind of thing that you only see once in a lifetime, and probably not the kind of thing that could ever happen again.  Lost fans seem rather disinterested and prone to a tiny bit of casual speculation in comparison.  But there is indeed the internet now, and it does tend to blow these things out of proportion.

Like I say, I don't know enough about Twin Peaks to really make a fair comparison. I think you discredit Lost unfairly though, I think the fans are completely involved and engrossed in the show and its mysteries, they have been from the start and even more so today, and I think this will continue for years to come. The depth that some theories go in to, the research made, is outstanding, and I can't remember a show that has garnered that much in depth discussion and theorising. No other show that I can recall has been scrutinized as closely as Lost, every detail, no matter how mundane or insignificant, is put under the microscope and anaylsed by the fans, and its for those reasons that Lost will never fade away. And remember that first season was huge! Although viewership is down now (its still a popular show), back in the first season it was the most talked about show, definitely in America, and perhaps worldwide too. "How did Locke end up in the wheelchair?" "What's the monster?" "Where did the polar bear come from?" "What's up with Walt?" "Who are The Others?" - these questions entered pop culture, as did the many brilliant characters from the show.

It is rewatchable...  now.  But even now, most of the second and third series, and even a fair whack of the first, feel like water-treading.  I have a feeling that we'll be assembling lists of about a dozen key episodes to bother with when this wraps up, and I very much doubt that anyone will be ploughing through the whole run again.  Could be wrong, but it's a hunch.

Depends what you are watching for, if you are strictly in it for "answers", then no, you probably won't be interested in re-watching most of the show. But to be honest, those viewers should have, and did, give up a long time ago. But if you want to watch a compelling, interesting, well-written and on the most part well acted drama, with engaging storylines and fantastic characters, then the entire series will always be of worth to old fans and new fans.

That's my opinion anyway. I imagine the complete boxsets will be selling a lot this Christmas, with many fans that have never seen the show, or those that abandoned it after Season 1, deciding to buy the series now that they can watch it all in one go, especially if it has a satisfying ending.

[Moribunderast]

Hrm...

Spoiler alert

Well, for starters, I was absolutely taken out of Lost-world when fucking Mac from Always Sunny showed up!

That aside, I was a little underwhelmed by that episode. Kate-centric episodes always seem to be a little dull and this almost seemed like it was treading water. The Sayid/Jack/Others plot could have been resolved with a three minute conversation but instead we got strung along with tediously vague dialogue until the episode was ready to end.

Definitely hoping that next episode follows Ben and fake Locke because I'm much more intrigued by that story than I am by Jack and co.

[close]

Looking forward to reading where everyone thinks this is all going. This thread is a big help in clarifying my ideas (and reminding me of important scenes/relationships/theories that I've long forgotten about.)

Also, I just found out (which I'm sure is very old news to everyone here) that this season has 18 episodes. I'm in two minds about this as I'm happy to be getting such a significant amount of Lost but I've really enjoyed the past two shorter seasons.

Anywho, thoughts on this week? Am I too negative?

[Custard]

Yeah, not very good this week. A huge drop in quality from last week, anyway.

Actually got quite bored in places. The Kate-centric episodes just do nothing for me, either.

Hope the pace picks up next week, as this seemed vehhhhhry slow, and plodding.

[Ja'moke]

Yep, quite poor this week, I was hoping we wouldn't get any episodes like that in the last season, but unfortunately we did, hope its the only one. It really didn't do or say anything until the last two minutes.

Sawyer was great though, he's really developed as a character and as an actor. We give all the praise to Michael Emerson and Terry O'Quinn, but I think Josh Holloway is right up there with them, he's leaps and bounds ahead of Jack and Kate in the acting stakes.

[purlieu]

There was half an episode's worth of stuff there.  A few 'recognition' moments for the alternative timeline, the Sawyer/Kate scene which was necessary, some very interesting plot stuff - what was the guy going to say about Rousseau?  More hints about what's happening with Claire, the 'infection' being possession by the smoke monster, and I liked the word 'claimed' - but it did leave me wanting a lot more.
"Black pillar of smoke, makes a ticker-ticker noise, looks really pissed off" was probably my highlight.

[Ja'moke]

what was the guy going to say about Rousseau? 

I don't think it was anything about Rousseau was it? I think he was about to say "Rousseau has been dead for years, these are Claire's traps." So it was just a hint that Claire was alive and has taken up a Rousseau type role on the island.

[Slaaaaabs]

Evangeline Lily will give up acting for a while after Lost finishes apparently.

I guess her own brand of Joey-from-Friends "Smell the fart" acting must be gruelling. The scene on the dock was ruined by her stupid fucking gurning.

[purlieu]

I don't think it was anything about Rousseau was it? I think he was about to say "Rousseau has been dead for years, these are Claire's traps." So it was just a hint that Claire was alive and has taken up a Rousseau type role on the island.

Oh, yes, that's sensible.

[Artemis]

I've never understood the widespread disappointment with Kate and her episodes. I enjoyed this more than many parts of last week's première, and thought the friendship between Kate and Claire in the parallel world was quite touching. Good turn from Sawyer as well, with the 'I was going to ask her to marry me' monologue.

I like that Kate's purpose/redemption is obviously closely linked to Claire and Aaron. That's so much more rewarding than a romantic destiny of some kind.

Darlton have said that our patience will be required before the pay off comes between the two realities, and mine won't last much longer if week on week we have 'oh, it's him' and 'oh, so he obviously remembers something' moments - this is the final season, for Christ's sake!

Anyway, yes. More Alpert, Widmore, Fake Locke, Ben, Penny and Desmond next week, please!

Claire's 'infection' must be related to her being in the cabin that time with Christian & Locke. She's probably on the side of the MiB without knowing it, although she's obviously taken up Rousseau's role which I like.

Spoiler alert

Next week's promo looks good!

[close]

[Ja'moke]

Darlton have said that our patience will be required before the pay off comes between the two realities, and mine won't last much longer if week on week we have 'oh, it's him' and 'oh, so he obviously remembers something' moments - this is the final season, for Christ's sake!

That's the problem with this two realities thing isn't it? I'm sure once we get the pay-off that re-watching the alternate timeline scenes will be much more rewarding, and you will probably be able to pick up clues in them, but until that pay off comes they could be very tedious, like this weeks.

Next week's episode does look like a good one though, judging by the short preview. It seems this season is following the order of the first season when it comes to the character centricity of the episodes.

[DJ Solid Snail]

The only thing dumber than the fact that Kate rang up to meet some stranger she'd robbed and threatened with a gun whilst wearing handcuffs, not expecting her to call the police, is the fact that this person did indeed not call the police. You can just hear the reasoning going 'round in Claire's head after Kate offers her a ride; "Well, she is an armed fugitive who scared me silly by sticking a gun in my face and stealing my purse - a gun she probably acquired by kiling a cop - buuuuut...I'll probably have to wait around for ages for another cab..." Either that or the ridiculously brief questioning and particularly casual searching by the crack squad of two detectives, or possibly the insane loyalty Claire showed to some violent fugitive - handing over her credit card! - just because she'd driven her to the hospital?! And the mechanic simply letting Kate go about her merry business... Why? Because he's blue collar, so he'll be happy to stick it to The Man by not reporting her? Poor, sloppy writing all-round. Very dull flashbacks - or whatever you'd call them this season - and the entire Temple plot could have been done in about a scene and a half.


<WORST LOST DIALOGUE THIS WEEK> (imagine this in a TV Burp-style flashing logo)

[Japanese Bloke spins a baseball around on his desk. Jack walks in.]

JACK: What's that?

JAPANESE BLOKE: It's a baseball.

</WORST LOST DIALOGUE THIS WEEK>


How long has it been - Island-time - since Claire disappeared, anyway? Is it for certain that it's the Black Smoke that's 'infected' her, and Sayid, or is that just speculation? Seems odd that it'd turn her into a new Rousseau, since Rousseau was the only one not infected. But why would she just walk out on her kid? I always assumed the actress got bored and split, given the abrupt nature of the thing, and this new direction is weird, like she's fast-tracked Rousseau's 15 (was it 15?) years of isolated craziness. Last time we saw her she was making friends with Christian, wasn't it? Was Christian being controlled by the Man in Black? Why would Smokey suddenly be recruiting people when he's been content so far with quite easily ripping everybody to bits?

I'm guessing the big 'thing' - or one of them - the Losties will find themselves getting flustered over this season will be that there's some obscure way to destroy Smokey that somebody important knows but hasn't mentioned yet, and they've got to do that or somebody else - a manipulated Ben, perhaps - will help him get off the Island and destroy the world or something equally sinister. Or they'll team up with Ben to do it, but who'll be on Smokey's side?

It might be corny but to be honest I'd love to have them drag Locke's carcass to the miracle fountain and bring him back, leading to an ace Locke on Locke showdown. The opener really set a great momentum but they've already pissed it away. I can't believe they're still having shows with this much filler so late in the game - what's to lose? Go nuts. You're not going to end up answering half of the 'weird' stuff you've hinted at in the past anyway, so what difference does it make? They're too used to writing in that style I guess, like the tedious dragging-out's what makes good tension, rather than the reality of it being rather dull. The two main guys might as well write every show - it's not that hard. They get captured, they escape, somebody goes AWOL, they track them through the jungle, they get attacked in the jungle by some unknown force, they run through the jungle, somebody's sick and the one hope is a long jog away, they run more, it looks like they're in trouble but, no-sir, they're saved by somebody from about 50 episodes ago! Dong! Lost logo...

During stuff like the Kate/Sawyer angstiness, I just think, "Why are they getting so upset? These people haven't sat down for a chat since about season one - how do they even know they care about each other?" The only communication they've had since then is arguing about the best way to deal with whatever big problem's popped up that day, invariably they disagree, there's another power struggle and subsequently massive amounts of shoutiness, putting guns on each other and endless bouts of backstabbing. Then they'll be power-walking through the jungle, not talking to each other, just looking stern and detemined, not even singing group songs to pass the time, just brainlessly heading for their next task. They've never had a good time with these people - with the kind of feelings they convey 99% of the time, you'd think they'd be delighted to rid themselves of them.

I'm half-expecting the heavy-handedly 'mysterious' Japanese fella to say something along the lines of "I find adherence to fantasy troubling and unreasonable," and he might as well use identical intonations.

I'm sure it'll pick up next week though. Kate episodes are usually lousy - but to think: we'll probably never have to watch another one ever again! Ace!

[Post pulled out of brain verbatim - too lazy to edit, sorry]