Woody Allen comes out fighting

[notjosh]

Yeah false memory syndrome is the main suggestion I guess. Obviously it's totally understandable that both Dylan and a Ronan believe her memory to be correct (and it might be!) but there certainly seems to be a lot of examples of false memories especially from that young.

There was a massive scandal in the 80s/90s around psychoanalysts using regressive memory techniques to uncover supposedly repressed memories of child abuse which turned out to be false. Bit different from what's being alleged here, but I don't think it's impossible that someone could go on believing a lie their whole life if it was implanted in them at an early, impressionable age. Obviously it feels very uncomfortable to suggest that someone recounting a first-hand experience of child abuse is just repeating a fantasy (and I would never go as far as to say this is definitely the case), but humans are capable of far stranger things than this.

[El Unicornio, mang]

I liked Match Point and Scoop although I think that was more to do with Scarlett Johanssen and the weird fantasy London settings which actually made the place look quite exotic. I think the last one I saw was Blue Jasmine, which featured a supermarket cashier living in a fancy apartment in the middle of the most expensive city in the world.

[Huxleys Babkins]

Fair enough. But the word used by the expert was "coached", which gave a different impression to "brainwashed", the former implying knowing deceit. I'd better read the Moses account.

That was solely in relation to the statements given at the time when Ronan was 7, though. God knows what happened before or since then.

[dontrunyoullfall]

If only there was an investigative journalist in the family who could get to the bottom of the whole darn thing.

[Twit 2]

An impartial, purely objective one who's not involved in the events?

[dissolute ocelot]

what's baffling is that he doesn't seem to have much trouble financing his shit films while worthier filmmakers are struggling.

The whole issue of where he gets the money to keep making films is depressing. His films haven't made a lot of money since the early funny ones; 30 years ago he was funded for studio prestige and Oscar bait. And this continued even as the films got worse (in fairness, not uniformly). But since the 00s he has depended increasingly on European money, because they still consider him an artist not a pervert.

In 2017, well after allegations started, and even longer after the decline in quality, Amazon threw a ton of money at him as part of the general "buy up everyone" Amazon/Netflix contest, changing their mind a couple of years later when even Jeff Bezos realised Woody Allen's a sleaze. "Rainy Day in New York" (out in the UK this summer) was made with Amazon money, though not released by them. His next film "Rifkin's Festival" is funded by Spanish and Italian money. Presumably if they get a moral conscience he'll move to China or Japan.

[chveik]

Presumably if they get a moral conscience he'll move to China or Japan.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6gNONRR8Qk

[SavageHedgehog]

I recently watched this fairly exhaustive video on the matter. While I wouldn't praise the video itself too highly, there's a strong sense of mealy mouthed "now I'm a liberal but" to the whole thing and there are many distasteful attempts at humour (I'm sure some posters would be even more bothered by his other videos praising George Lucas and criticising Red Letter Media), it did leave me fairly convinced of his innocence. I've always leaned that way but this did shed light on some of the more suspicious things I'd heard regarding Allen, e.g. the idea that he got "his own" lie detector test administered.

Of course I can't say it didn't happen, as hardly anyone can.

[Retinend]

This family tree is such a headache. Farrow adopted a new child (or bore one) virtually every year through the 70s. That's 8 children adopted (4) or born to her (3) in the decade of her first marriage, and this brood includes Soon-Yi.

What were the circumstances of the uprbinging of all these children by the time Farrow was living with Allen? Did they all live with her ex husband, Previn? A sort of fresh start?

(It is said in the OP article that Soon-Yi did not grow up in the same house, so presumably so.)

[up_the_hampipe]

Ronan Farrow's dismissal of Moses' allegations didn't sit right with me. It's the opposite approach to what he's been championing.

[peanutbutter]

The whole scenario always reminds me of how after my dad died I discovered a LOT of what I had accepted as fact about his family were at best seriously questionable. Family dynamics at the best of times are confusing messes to anyone from the outside and attempting to figure them out when all the individuals have such totally different interpretations of events is a nightmare.
With the Woody Allen/Mia Farrow family I can't even figure out who the family is, it comes across as though they were living very busy totally different lives with fuck knows who (carers, I assume?) doing most of the actual parenting. Watching their films together I could never understand how the two were together, there was no evidence of it on screen whatsoever; the best I can guess is that it was just a several year long ego-trip for both of them to be dating the other that became so ludicrously casual neither of them could justify ending it.


Woody Allen is 85, he's had a very successful career and is well enough off that the only thing this serves to harm for him is his legacy. Regardless of whether he done it or not it seems like (a) it's far too hard to say conclusively but public opinion is set in one direction and it's only gonna go more in that way and (b) he seems like he'll be more than capable of weathering that.
This whole memoir thing seems totally out of character for how he has been dealing with this stuff for the past 30 years though, if I were to guess it was at the behest of his current family to "lay the facts out" (i.e. whatever the fuck they've been told by him for their whole lives).

[Ballad of Ballard Berkley]

Watching their films together I could never understand how the two were together, there was no evidence of it on screen whatsoever; the best I can guess is that it was just a several year long ego-trip for both of them to be dating the other that became so ludicrously casual neither of them could justify ending it.

I don't understand what you mean by that. The only Allen film in which you might reasonably presume to gain any insight into their actual private life is Husbands and Wives. That film aside, Farrow, a talented actor, played a fairly wide range of fictional characters. She was particularly good in The Purple Rose of Cairo, one of Allen's best films.

Also, she and Allen didn't star together that often, but whenever they did - e.g. Broadway Danny Rose and Crimes and Misdemeanors - their chemistry was palpable.

As for what was going on behind the scenes, God knows, but I never detected anything odd or awkward about their professional collaborations.

[peanutbutter]

I don't understand what you mean by that. The only Allen film in which you might reasonably presume to gain any insight into their actual private life is Husbands and Wives. That film aside, Farrow, a talented actor, played a fairly wide range of fictional characters. She was particularly good in The Purple Rose of Cairo, one of Allen's best films.

Also, she and Allen didn't star together that often, but whenever they did - e.g. Broadway Danny Rose and Crimes and Misdemeanors - their chemistry was palpable.

As for what was going on behind the scenes, God knows, but I never detected anything odd or awkward about their professional collaborations.

She's perfect in the Purple Rose of Cairo, cannot imagine a better person for the role, I've never seen any chemistry between them though, or even a clear sense of how to write characters that worked for her even though she should be a pretty good fit in his world, outside of that one role she always seemed a bad fit in his films imo (asides from Husbands & Wives for obvious reasons).

I would say it's perhaps a bit unfair to claim that RE chemistry when it's Diane Keaton I'm comparing her too, mind.

[Keebleman]

Of course I can't say it didn't happen, as hardly anyone can.

That's right - what you have to be able to say with confidence is that it did happen.  That's the issue, and in this case the doubt seems considerably more than reasonable.  I think that in years to come cunts like Timothee Chalamet who have tried to advance their careers and public profiles by denouncing him will have to do some serious backtracking.  My guess is that by mid-century the settled narrative will be that Allen was a genius who was castigated by cynical celebs for their own ends.

And as for his recent (ie last 30 years) movies, yeah most have been poor but Midnight in Paris is as good as anything he's done and Blue Jasmine is not far behind.

[peanutbutter]

Blue Jasmine is not far behind.

I feel like it's one of his worst written efforts carried by some inspired casting and performances.


Comedy seems to age itself out of the mainstream consciousness in a way other formats don't as much. I would imagine by the mid-century the only people who care to investigate Woody Allen will be people who are likely to enjoy his work. As it stands right now his name and rep are high enough that he gets quite a lot of people checking him out outta a begrudging sense that they should to prove their credentials as a film buff.

[Satchmo Distel]

I think it's an open secret since 'Manhattan' that his sexuality regarding teenage girls is borderline (not sure if that would fall above or below the age of consent) but I don't buy that he's into pre-pubescent children, except that perhaps he had boundary issues on how much cuddling was appropriate. I don't think he's Humbert Humbert as portrayed in the book but he could be as portrayed by James Mason in the film of that book.

[Andy147]

This family tree is such a headache. Farrow adopted a new child (or bore one) virtually every year through the 70s. That's 8 children adopted (4) or born to her (3) in the decade of her first marriage, and this brood includes Soon-Yi.

What were the circumstances of the uprbinging of all these children by the time Farrow was living with Allen? Did they all live with her ex husband, Previn? A sort of fresh start?

I don't think Farrow and Allen ever did live together, did they?

[Lisa Jesusandmarychain]

No, they both had separate apartments in New York. Pair of weirdos, if you ask me.

[Keebleman]

I think that in years to come cunts like Timothee Chalamet who have tried to advance their careers and public profiles by denouncing him will have to do some serious backtracking. 

Hadn't even read the interview when I wrote that, and when I did I found this:

"Timothée afterward publicly stated he regretted working with me and was giving the money to charity. But he swore to my sister he needed to do that as he was up for an Oscar for Call Me By Your Name, and he and his agent felt he had a better chance of winning if he denounced me, so he did." (Chalamet's people did not return requests for a comment.)

Of course, hearsay, one person's word against another's, etc, but I hope it makes the fucker sweat.

[thecuriousorange]

One of the most cancelled celebrities of our times and the current Twitter reaction to that Guardian article suggests that's not going to change within the rest of his lifetime.

[damien]

.

[Brundle-Fly]

Zombie Sinatra leaves thread

[marquis_de_sad]

That's how brainwashing works, though, isn't it?

Depends what you mean by brainwashing.

[Keebleman]

Some questions - and only questions, there could be some good answers - about his son.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/17/business/media/ronan-farrow.html#click=https://t.co/hdGpQHSNtL

[steveh]

This is worth a read on how little work he puts into his films: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2017/10/woody-allen-wonder-wheel/537876/

None of them cost much, most of them recoup what was spent and some of them do very well so why wouldn't he keep on with the same model that has always worked.

[SavageHedgehog]

I found that a little short on insight (I suspect you could search and replace Clint Eastwood for a lot of it), but it does make me wonder just how bad Bruce Willis must have been in that film he got fired from.

[dontrunyoullfall]

The Farrows played the PR game well when they relaunched the accusation. To make it seem like it was something that had been hidden like other revelations that were being uncovered at the same time. It hadn't been hidden, it was a huge story in the early 90s and investigated at the time whether or not people want to accept that outcome.

I don't know what it says that some people can't even grasp one of the most basic facts about the entire imbroglio, Soon-Yi was never his daughter, step-daughter or any other configuration thereof.

As for the substantive accusation there are only two/three people that know the answer.

[Retinend]

No, they both had separate apartments in New York. Pair of weirdos, if you ask me.

Totally weird. And so far, after reading Moses's account, I just don't know why she would adopt so many children if she didn't really have good relationships with the ones she had. Is it a thing to be addicted to adoption?

[chveik]

Is it a thing to be addicted to adoption?

for some rich people it is. they have maids to take care of them, so it's like having a lot of sophisticated pets to play with once in a while.

[notjosh]

I found that a little short on insight (I suspect you could search and replace Clint Eastwood for a lot of it), but it does make me wonder just how bad Bruce Willis must have been in that film he got fired from.

Bruce Willis is even lazier than Woody Allen nowadays.

https://www.denofgeek.com/movies/bruce-willis-examining-his-recent-straight-to-dvd-movies/

There's definitely a pattern to how he's cashing these cheques – he puts in a few days' work on a 20-30 day shoot and, in exchange, the distributor gets to sell the movie based on his name, positioning him as the main character in another explosive thriller. By the time you get to the end of the movie and realise you've been duped, who cares? They've already taken your time and money. It's a nice little system for everyone involved.