Old Doctor Who - Part 5

[Ambient Sheep]

With the fourth thread having reached 102 pages, it's time once again to start a new one.  So here it is.


Sheepy's guide to Doctor Who threads

New/changed entries marked with an asterisk.

Main threads about the new series, in chronological order of creation:
2004/03/04 - 2004/03/20:  Izzard as Dr Who ? (Rampant speculation)
2004/03/20 - 2005/02/21:  And the new Doctor Who is... (Eccleston's announcement to the start of Series 1 (27))
2005/02/27 - 2006/10/10:  New Doctor Who (Series 1 (27) & 2 (28))
2006/11/01 - 2007/05/21:  Newer Doctor Who  (Series 3 (29) part 1)
2007/05/24 - 2009/10/21:  The New Doctor Who thread (Series 3 (29) part 2, Series 4 (30), 2009 up to but not including The Waters Of Mars)
2009/10/21 - 2010/03/26:  The "New" Doctor Who Thread (2009 just before The Waters of Mars to just before Series 5 (31/Fnarg) aired)
2010/03/18 - 2010/07/27:  Doctor Who - Series 5 Discussion (No Spoilers) (Series 5 (31/Fnarg))
2010/06/13 - 2011/01/15:  So, Doctor Who. (started as Fry's questions thread, mutated halfway down page 12 into general post-Series-5-(31/Fnarg) discussion, including the 2010 Christmas special (A Christmas Carol))
2011/01/20 - 2012/01/05:  Doctor Who Series 6 (Series 6 (32))
2012/01/07 - 2012/12/29:  Doctor Who Series 7 and beyond (may contain spoilers) (S07(33)E01 (Asylum of the Daleks) - S07(33)E05 (The Angels Take Manhattan) plus Christmas Special (The Snowmen))
2012/12/29 - 2013/07/11:  Doctor Who, Series 7 (part two) (S07(33)E06 (The Bells of Saint John) - S07(33)E13 (The Name of the Doctor))
2013/01/07 - 2014/01/05:  Doctor Who - 50th anniversary year (overlaps with the previous thread)
2013/12/26 - 2014/08/11:  Doctor Who - Series 8 (101 pages before Series 8 (34) had even aired!)
2014/08/09 - 2014/10/21:  Doctor Who - Series 8 (Part 2) (S08(34)E01 (Deep Breath) - S08(34)E09 (Flatline))
2014/10/21 - 2015/01/14:  Doctor Who - Series 8 (Part 3) (S08(34)E09 (Flatline) - S08(34)E12 (Death in Heaven) plus Christmas Special (Last Christmas))
2015/01/05 - 2015/10/27:  Doctor Who - Series 9 (S09(35) speculation and E01 (The Magician's Apprentice) - E06 (The Woman Who Lived))
2015/10/26 - 2016/01/21:  Doctor Who - Series 9 (continued) (S09(35)E07 (The Zygon Invasion) - S09(35)E12 (Hell Bent) plus Christmas Special (The Husbands of River Song))
2016/01/22 - 2017/04/15:  Doctor Who - Series 10 (Pre-S10(36) speculation)
2017/04/15 - 2017/08/07:  Doctor Who - Series 10 (Part 2) (S10(36)E01 (The Pilot) - S10(36)E12 (The Doctor Falls))
2017/08/07 - 2018/01/07:  Doctor Who - Series 10 (Part 3) (Christmas Special (Twice Upon a Time) and general chatter about the impending Chibnall era)
2018/01/07 - 2018/11/02:  Doctor Who - Series 11 (Part 1) (62 pages of pre-S11(37) speculation, then S11(37)E01 (The Woman Who Fell to Earth) to S11(37)E04 (Arachnids in the UK))
2018/11/02 - 2019/06/13:  Doctor Who - Series 11 (Part 2) (S11(37)E05 (The Tsuranga Conundrum) to S11(37)E10 (The Battle of Ranskoor Av Kolos) plus New Year's Day Special (Resolution), then whatever the thread equivalent o f "The entire thousand-mile-long bridge spontaneously folded up its glittering spans and sank weeping into the mire, taking everybody with it." would be)
2019/06/13 - 2020/03/03: Doctor Who - Series 12, Chibnall's Revenge (24 pages of Pre-S12(38) speculation, then Ballad's review of S12(38)E01 (Spyfall, Part 1), then two-and-a-half pages later, everyone else's, then all of Series 12 up to and including S12(38)E10 (The Timeless Children).
2020/03/03 - 2021/08/10: Doctor Who Series 12B: The Timeless Chibnall (Xmas special & pre-Series 13(39) chat) (What it says on the tin)
2021/08/10 - 2022/02/20: Doctor Who Series 13: Goodbye, Mr. Chibs (More pre-Series 13(39) chat, then Series 13(39)/Flux itself starts here with The Halloween Apocalypse, ending here with The Vanquishers, with the New Year's Day special (Eve of the Daleks) here)
* 2021/09/24 - 2022/11/25: RTD back for Doctor Who (Announcing and discussing the incredible news that Russell T. Davies will be coming back to run the show after Chibnall buggers off)
* 2022/02/20 - 2022/12/01: Doctor Who Series 13 continued: RTD2, Chib nil (Coverage of Chibnall's final but futile efforts to kill the show.  You think I can be arsed to link his eps?)
* 2022/11/22 - 202?/??/??: Doctor Who - Series 14: Tennant's extra / Ncuti stars (Looking forward to Tennant's Specials Brew, then the Fifteenth Doctor's adventures)

plus:

* 2021/05/03 - 2021/11/09 (so far): Doctor Who 2005-2017 : The RTD & Moffat Years (a.k.a. Old New Doctor Who - a thread for chat about old episodes from the re-booted series)

which, although not officially closed, seems to have been largely replaced by:

* 2022/05/22 - 202?/??/??: The big CaB Doctor Who (2005) rewatch thread - starts May 30, 2022 (does exactly what it says on the tin)


Threads about the old series, in chronological order of creation:
Old Doctor Who (Original thread, 2005/05/11 - 2010/06/08)
Old Doctor Who (Second thread, 2011/01/14 - 2016/10/21)
Old Doctor Who - Part 3 (Third thread, 2016/10/21 - 2020/06/04)
* Old Doctor Who - Part 4 (Fourth thread, 2020/06/04 - 2023/04/28)
* Old Doctor Who - Part 5 (Fifth thread, 2023/04/28 - 202?/??/?? – you're reading it now!)


Threads about both, but for your ears only:
Doctor Who Audio Adventures (Big Finish etc.)


Other Doctor Who related broadcast threads, also in chronological order:
Torchwood Series 1
The Sarah Jane Adventures (just the pilot, not Series 1, there was no S1 thread)
Torchwood Series 2
Sarah Jane adventures- Series 2
Torchwood Series 3 (aka Children of Earth)
Sarah Jane Adventures Series 3
Doctor Who and the SPOILERS OF DEATH (aborted Series 5 (31/Fnarg) thread)
Junior Masterchef with Doctor Who
Doctor Who: The Adventure Games
Torchwood: The New World (one-page thread presaging Series 4 / Miracle Day)
Torchwood return date.... (three-post thread announcing Series 4 / Miracle Day)
Torchwood: Miracle Day (aka Series 4)
Torchwood: Miracle Day (US airings)
Class (Doctor Who spin-off) series 1

There wasn't a Sarah Jane Adventures Series 4 thread, let alone a Series 5 one. :-(


The Doctor Who Radio Times Project - with thanks to Replies From View
A Radio Times History of Doctor Who: 01 William Hartnell


Still more Doctor Who related threads, again in chronological order:
Fanzines (Comedy, Doctor Who and in general)
The Best And Worst Of Doctor Who... Ever
Doctor Who - where does everyone stand now ?
Mong Doctor Who series 5 (H.S. Art thread)
Recommend me some Old Doctor Who (a really good thread, IMHO)
Doctor Who Mongs (H.S. Art thread)
Beeb to show unseen interview with Dr Who theme creator (Delia Derbyshire)
Doctor Who film (November 2011 thread about film rumour)
Watching Doctor Who no 1. The Time Meddler (1965)
Why i don't like modern Doctor Who
Doctor Who leaked scripts thread (but still no spoilers) (July 2014)
Doctor Who: The Movie (April 2015 thread about another film rumour)
K9: Timequake (new movie coming 2017, allegedly... very allegedly, by now)
Doctor Who World (should it become an expanded franchise like Marvel?)
Doctor Who to spurt cum right up The Queen's vagina (Actually a short thread about the first series of The Crown, but with a title like that it has to make this list)
Dr Who Re Dooooo (would it be worth refilming some early stories?)
Doctor Who or Chips? (addressing the burning issue of the day)
Tom Baker is still alive (General Tom Baker appreciation thread)
Lost WHO script. (Spoon of Ploff writes a Doctor Who story in H.S. Art)
BRADLEY WALSH will be Doctor Who's companion (Two-and-a-half pages of mild jaw-droppage from 2017/08/21-24, however this comment fails to be "very sarky")
Radiophonic Prom (featuring the music of Delia Derbyshire, among others)
Watching Doctor Who (2005) from the middle of the beginning (madhair60 sparks discussion about the RTD era -- includes a superb Sheepy-has-to-up-his-game-now list by Talulah, really! to every individual episode discussion of the first three series; many thanks for that!)
Doctor: 'Who?' (Short but enjoyably silly H.S. Art thread)
Clive Swift has died (and much of the thread is about that DWM interview)
giant blue penis bloke from doctor who (the Moxx of Balhoon gets his own thread, then lives it up with Balok and friends)
Wanting to get into old Doctor Who (madhair60 enquires again; lots of good answers)
The big stupid Doctor Who companion face-mashing project (Mister Six uses face-mashing website Artbreeder in a fascinating quest to figure out what the "average" Doctor Who companion looks like)
I hear you're a pest now, Noel Clarke? (...and John Barrowman)
Flying wheelie bin compared to Tardis. (I can see the resemblance)
* A fresh start with Doctor Who (Wolfie's turn for a "recommend me some Old Doctor Who" thread, and a short but good one it is.  Includes discussion of various cliffhangers.)


^{_{(See here for sources.  Further additions & corrections welcome.)}}

[Midas]

recursive occlusion

[Replies From View]

we do rather like Doctor Who in this joint

[A Hat Like That]

The Daemons is great

[McDead]

Look out, Dr Who! It's the Daleks!

[Bad Ambassador]

Day of the Daleks: Episodes One and Two. Diplomat Sir Reginald Styles is working late when confronted by an armed man who then disappears. His secretary, Miss Paget, hears the commotion and enters, where a disturbed Sir Reginald babbles about ghosts. She calls UNIT over concerns that the vital peace conference Styles is organising is under threat, and Lethbridge-Stewart ropes in the Doctor and Jo. Another armed man appears in the grounds of Styles' house, but flees at the sound of a whistle to a railway tunnel, where he is attacked by ape-like soldiers.

Miss Paget briefs the UNIT gang while Styles, about to leave for Peking, blusters that it was a nightmare, though the muddy footprints the Doctor spots suggest otherwise. A search finds the unconscious gunman with a cache of futuristic equipment, but he vanishes while being taken to hospital. The Doctor identifies his weapon as 200 years ahead of them, but the metal used was mined on Earth. He also discovers that a black box in the gunman's possession is a kind of time machine, which reactivates. This is detected in the 22nd century, where the ape soldiers report their progress to the Controller, before he reports in turn to the Daleks.

The Doctor and Jo head to the house to investigate, while UNIT keeps the building under guard. Three more guerrillas - Anat, Boaz and Shura - arrive at the tunnel and disintegrate two soldiers. They head into the house and take the Doctor and Jo at gunpoint, assuming him to be Styles until he shows them a newspaper. Yates and Benton enter the house looking for the missing men, so the captives are taken to the cellar and tied up. The Doctor speculates on their motives for wanting to kill Styles, while the Controller activates a magnetron, which will attract anyone operating the time machine. Anat sends Shura to the tunnel to radio back to the future for orders, but he is attacked by an ape soldier and flees.

Lethbridge-Stewart phones, so Anat drags the Doctor up to answer it. They hear Styles is returning to the house to host the conference, and the Doctor assures him everything is fine and that he can "tell it to the Marines". Jo escapes her bonds and grabs the time machine, threatening to smash it, but it projects her 200 years into the future and into the Controller's lap. He says the apes are called Ogrons and function as policemen, acting the cordial host and gently extracting information about the guerrillas. She is shown to guest quarters before the overhearing Daleks announce an ambush in the tunnel. The house is attacked by Ogrons and Anat and Boaz flee, while Lethbridge-Stewart arrives in time to shoot an Ogron dead. The Doctor follows the guerrillas to the tunnel, but is confronted by a Dalek...

A solid plot - but don't tell Harlan Ellison about it - and some very strong performances are marred by Paul Bernard's truly appalling direction. There are fluffed lines, blown cues, bizarre staging and weird edits throughout, although the work on film is far better and more creative than that in studio. Combined with some unnatural dialogue that sounds like it was written by AI and you get a very underwhelming return for the Daleks after five years away, not helped by their awful new voices.

[Gurke and Hare]

Were there any complications?

[Norton Canes]

Spurred on by yesterday's season 18 talk I realised it was a few years since I'd seen a lot of it, so I dived in with episode one of Full Circle. What a sumptuous 25 minutes of television, as lush and luxurious as the woodlands in which it was filmed. The attention to detail in the exterior locations is exceptional - the alien plant props and pastel colour dusted native foliage is up front but when characters are moving through the undergrowth they're uplit with lurid purples; and perhaps most impressively, when the Doctor stands outside the TARDIS realising they're not on Gallifrey a flock of birds takes sudden flight behind him. By chance? Surely more likely another touch added by the production team. (In a lovely bit of prescience, the peach and primrose hues sported by the Starliner citizens are incredibly redolent of the colours worn by the natives of Ferrix in the Star Wars spin-off Andor.)

And those wanting plot and dialogue to match the quality of the visuals aren't in for a disappointment. Before we even see Alzarius there are continuity-laden introductory scenes in the TARDIS including this heartbreaking moment, the succinct nature of which doesn't do justice to the way it's sold by Tom and Lalla:

ROMANA: The Time Lords want me back.
DOCTOR: Yes. Well, you only came to help with the Key to Time.
ROMANA: Doctor, I don't want to spend the rest of my life on Gallifrey. After all this.
DOCTOR: Well, you can't fight Time Lords, Romana.
ROMANA: You did, once.
DOCTOR: Hmm. And lost

This is not a Tom who's off-form. This is a Tom who's firing.

The Outlers inject the outsider trope with a twist in the form of their talk of Elites, and who Decides their fate (at this point we don't know Matthew Waterhouse is going to stink out the next ten stories so we accept him as another ineptly-performed guest character to be endured in the short term). The authority theme is continued with Romana's confident denunciation of the regime as a  "a type D oligarchy. Typical use of propaganda" and when Mistfall does descend and the citizens are instructed, upon some spurious scientific knowledge and half-remembred folklore, to isolate for what could be a very long time... well.

Finally the one thing a classic story lacks appears, as monsters emerge from the swamps. The cliff-hanger is skilfully edited so we only see them thrashing around in the seething marsh, looking for all the world (and with chilling possibility, since that's where Decider Draith just ended up) like decayed corpses reanimated.

A glorious episode, that wouldn't have been at all out of place in season 14. And part two would get the show's lowest ratings until Battlefield (and since episode eight of The War Games).

[Bad Ambassador]

Were there any complications?

[Alberon]

Yeah, liked that too.

As to the season 18 ratings, this was when ITV was playing Battlestar Galactica or Buck Rodgers. Doctor Who didn't have much of a chance against that.

[superthunderstingcar]

I bet you do, Brigadier, you dirty old bollocks. I bet you fucking do.

[Deanjam]

The Daemons is great

And off they run before Benton sees them.

[Ambient Sheep]

Day of the Daleks: Episodes One and Two.
::
::
A solid plot - but don't tell Harlan Ellison about it...

Which is quite ironic, given that he was a MASSIVE Doctor Who fan:

Star Wars is adolescent nonsense; Close Encounters is obscurantist drivel; 'Star Trek' can turn your brains to purée of bat guano; and the greatest science fiction series of all time is 'Doctor Who!' And I'll take you all on, one-by-one or in a bunch to back it up!'

You can read his full, incredibly enthusiastic, piece about it on Reddit here.

...and some very strong performances are marred by Paul Bernard's truly appalling direction.

Hah, I didn't realise it was him!  A few months ago I listened to the DVD commentaries for the first season of The Tomorrow People - he did all of The Slaves of Jedekiah and The Vanishing Earth - and they were absolutely scathing about him.  A very shouty man, apparently, and Peter Vaughan-Clarke ("Stephen") actually called him "a bully".

[Replies From View]

Big shame that when Nicholas Briggs came in to record new Dalek voices he saw fit to give them his RTD Dalek sound rather than something more Classic.

[Gurke and Hare]

Is it Day that has the reprise of the scream at the end of the cliffhanger recap? That was a choice.

[Bad Ambassador]

Day of the Daleks: Episodes Three and Four. The Doctor runs and encounters Anat and Boaz as they activate their time machine, taking all three to the future. Pursued by Ogrons, they split up and the Doctor heads outside into a wasteland and towards a concrete complex, where he finds a ragged workforce before being knocked out by an Ogron. The Controller reports to the Daleks, but they panic upon hearing someone called "the Doctor" was with the guerillas. He continues to feed Jo a line about their utopia being at risk from "terrorists" and gets a message that the Doctor is in custody. He is interrogated by a senior guard and then a factory manager, who sends away the others before revealing he is a guerilla spy. They are interrupted by the Controller, who says the whole thing has been a mistake and takes the Doctor to Jo. The manager radios Anat and Boaz's cell leader, Monia, telling them about the Doctor, but he is killed by an Ogron.

The Controller, the Doctor and Jo talk over wine, with the Time Lord baiting the official over the factory, Earth's circumstances and who is really in charge. The Controller excuses himself, and the Doctor tells Jo about the Daleks before an abortive escape attempt. The Daleks confirm his identity in the mind analysis machine, and the Controller persuades them to let him work on him using psychology. The Doctor says he knows nothing anyway, and calls him a traitor. The Controller calmly recounts the centuries of war and suffering that led to the Daleks taking over without a shot fired, and that he has used his position to improve conditions and save lives, but the Doctor is dismissive while the Controller is similarly unregarding of the guerillas. Based on the manager's intel, the guerillas mount a raid and rescue the Doctor, who stops them from killing the Controller, leaving the shell-shocked quisling alone with his conscience.

Monia and Anat explain their version of history, that the wars started when Styles blew up the conference, hence their mission to kill him and avert the Dalek conquest, but the Doctor and Jo find this hard to believe. He asks if anyone is left in the 20th century, and Anat mentions they left Shura for dead. The Doctor realises he would stop at nothing to complete his mission. The guerillas won't avert the wars - they caused them. The Doctor and Jo head back to the tunnel, but are cornered by the Controller and his Ogrons, but the Doctor appeals to him, stating he can end the Daleks' control of Earth. He sends the Ogrons away, then notes the Doctor could have let the guerillas kill him, so lets them go. He is summoned to the Daleks, and defiantly answers back before they shoot him.

They now plan to lead a force to exterminate the conference and ensure history is not changed. The Doctor and Jo rush to the house as the delegates arrive and order an evacuation. They find Shura in the cellar, ready to detonate the bomb, as Daleks and Ogrons pour from the tunnel, engaging the UNIT troops in battle and slowly pushing them back. As they approach the house, Shura says to let them in, and he will take care of them. The Daleks enter and Shura presses the button, destroying the house and resetting the timeline. The Doctor assures Styles the conference has been saved, adding he's seen what will happen if it fails.

It really comes to life in these two episodes, with Bernard's direction settling down - though there are still the occasional visible boom shot - and the dialogue become more natural. The two major scenes between Pertwee and Aubrey Woods as the Controller crackle, and the latter's performance is one of the best in some time, as a lifetime of slavery and self-justifying arrogance are slowly stripped away to reveal a ray of hope. It's a shame that the battle scenes let it down, with three immobile Daleks taking on the might of UNIT. There are some odd details, like the officials in the future all having shiny pale faces and silver fingernails, as well as Andrew Carr's weird, arch performance as the guard who betrays the Controller, which I remember the Discontinuity Guide comparing to Michael Palin in the Spanish Inquisition sketch. Rather better than it promised at the start, with several scenes worth transcribing (or copying from an existing page) below.

The Doctor goads the Controller

"I quite like it here, I must say. Everyone's been most kind."
"Well, I met some people today who were far from kind."
"That was a simple mistake, Doctor, I assure you. You must not jump to conclusions."
"Better than jumping from the crack of a whip from some security guard. Do you run all your factories like that, Controller?"
"That was not a factory, Doctor."
"Oh? Then what was it?"
"A rehabilitation centre. A rehabilitation centre for hardened criminals."
"Including old men and women? Even children?"
"There will always be people who need discipline, Doctor."
"Now that's an old-fashioned point of view, even from my standards."
"I can assure you that this planet has never been more efficiently, more economically run. People have never been happier or more prosperous."
"Then why do you need so many people to keep them under control? Don't they like being happy and prosperous?... When I meet a regime that needs to import savage alien life forms as security guards, I begin to wonder who the real criminals are."
"They are simply guard dogs. They just do what I tell them."
"You mean there aren't enough humans around that will follow your orders so blindly?"
"That is not what I was saying."
"Isn't it? Then what you're saying is that the entire human population of this planet, apart from a few remarkable exceptions like yourself, are really only fit to lead the life of a dog. Why?"
"You have no right to say that!"
"Haven't I? Who really rules this planet of yours?"

[close]

The Controller lays out the futility of fighting the Daleks

"I am trying to help him! I've already save his life."
"Yes, for your own purposes."
"Look, if you do not tell me everything that manager knew about these criminals, where they operate from, what their plans are, then the Daleks will destroy both of you."
"I don't doubt it."
"Do you value life so little?"
"On that contrary, I value it enormously. The Daleks will kill us whatever we tell you."
"Not if you cooperate with them."
"As you cooperate with them? Do you really think that makes any difference?"
"They can be reasonable."
"Reasonable? They tolerate you as long as you're useful to them."
"I am a senior government official!"
"You, sir, are a traitor! You're a quisling!"
"Silence! You do not understand. Nobody who did not live through those terrible years can understand. Towards the end of the 20th century, a series of wars broke out. There was a hundred years of nothing but killing, destruction. Seven eighths of the world's population was wiped out. The rest were living in holes in the ground, starving, reduced to the level of animals."
"So the Daleks saw their opportunity and took over."
"There was no power on Earth to stop them."
"They turn the Earth into a giant factory, with all the wealth and minerals looted and taken to Skaro."
"Exactly. Men who were strong enough, of course, were sent down the mines, the rest work in factories... They need a constant flow of raw materials. Their empire is expanding... They chose a few humans to help them get things going again, to organise the remaining population. My family have been controllers in this area for three generations."
"A family of quislings, eh?"
"We have helped make things better for the others. We have gained concessions. I have saved lives!"
"Wouldn't you have helped more by organising the fight against them?"
"No one can fight against the Daleks."

[close]

Electrifying stuff.

[superthunderstingcar]

I've always loved Dave the Daleks since it was the first Pertwee-era story I ever saw on VHS. I love the way the initial "ghost" story gradually gives way to the time travel plot - one of the best uses of such in the old series, IMO. Of course in those days it was edited into one 90 minute story, not episodic like Bad Ambassador watched it here.

[Bad Ambassador]

Which is quite ironic, given that he was a MASSIVE Doctor Who fan:

You can read his full, incredibly enthusiastic, piece about it on Reddit here.

Quoted on the back of the US edition of Doctor Who and the Day of the Daleks, as I recall.

Bernard comes across very poorly in the new making of for The Time Monster, and he was sacked after buggering up the ending of Frontier in Space. I don't think he made many friends.

Day was one of the first "old" Who stories I saw, rented from Ritz Video in 1991. It was then the second story I ever had in video, after The Hartnell Years. I still can't get used to seeing it as individual episodes.

[Norton Canes]

Day of the Daleks was the first Doctor Who story I remember. At least, it might have been...

The bit in question was the Ogrons materialising for the first time on present-day Earth. I was so petrified of them, I ran upstairs and refused to watch the rest of the episode. But, here's the thing - I'm sure that back then I remembered the Ogrons; that I recalled having been scared by them previously.

Day of the Daleks was first broadcast from 1st January 22nd January 1972. But of course it got an omnibus repeat, on 3rd September 1973, so there's every chance that I really did remember the Ogrons. Trouble is, if it was the repeat I'm remembering, then my earliest Who memory becomes the Doctor using the sonic screwdriver to set off landmines in The Sea Devils, broadcast from 26th February to 1st April 1972 (though it's a surprise that nothing from the intervening Curse of Peladon impressed itself on my memory).

Also - if the Ogrons were so frightening, and I remembered them second time round from the original broadcast, why don't I remember being scared by them both times?

Complications. 

[Replies From View]

Removing "no complications" from the updated version was a criminal act.

[Deanjam]

I've got that US edition of Talons with the Harlan Ellison quote.

[Replies From View]

DOCTOR WHO and the HAUNT OF THE NON-CANONICAL FONT

[Alternative Carpark]

Day of the Daleks was the first Doctor Who story I remember. At least, it might have been...

The bit in question was the Ogrons materialising for the first time on present-day Earth. I was so petrified of them, I ran upstairs and refused to watch the rest of the episode. But, here's the thing - I'm sure that back then I remembered the Ogrons; that I recalled having been scared by them previously.

Day of the Daleks was first broadcast from 1st January 22nd January 1972. But of course it got an omnibus repeat, on 3rd September 1973, so there's every chance that I really did remember the Ogrons. Trouble is, if it was the repeat I'm remembering, then my earliest Who memory becomes the Doctor using the sonic screwdriver to set off landmines in The Sea Devils, broadcast from 26th February to 1st April 1972 (though it's a surprise that nothing from the intervening Curse of Peladon impressed itself on my memory).

Also - if the Ogrons were so frightening, and I remembered them second time round from the original broadcast, why don't I remember being scared by them both times?

Complications. 

The Sea Devils did also get an omnibus repeat, in December 1972 and May 1974, so it could be either of those you're remembering?

If you watched the repeat of Day of the Daleks in September 1973, you might have already seen the Ogrons in Frontier in Space, shown earlier in that same year.

[Norton Canes]

"Hi mum. Yeah, good ta. Yeah they're good too.

Look, you know that time when I was little I ran upstairs because I was scared by the Ogrons in Doctor Who? Yeah. Could you tell me what date that was?"

[Norton Canes]

"Ogrons. O-G-R-O-N-S"

[Norton Canes]

"Yes, nocomplications! That's the ones"

[Norton Canes]

"Well surely you must at least remember if it was 1972 or 1973..."

[Norton Canes]

"Okay never mind. Look say hi to the carers"

[Bad Ambassador]

The Curse of Peladon: Episodes One and Two. On the medieval planet Peladon, traditionalist high priest Hepesh and progressive chancellor Torbis argue about the planet's accession into the galactic federation as the delegates arrive. The King stops the fighting and Torbis heads off, but is killed by an animal identified by royal champion Grun as Aggedor, the warthog-bear symbol of royalty. The TARDIS lands on a ledge outside the castle, with the Doctor having taken Jo on a quick test flight before she goes out on a date with Yates - yeah, right. The ship falls down the mountain and they find a tunnel into the castle. Alpha Centauri, a six-armed alien with one big eye, meets another delegate, skull-in-a-box Arcturus and notes only the Earth delegate is still to arrive. Hepesh thinks the delegates regard Peladonians as savages, as he rambles about curses and supernatural monsters to their unelected king, while the Doctor and Jo enter the castle and see a Martian.

The latter's superior, Izlyr, is another delegate, and the Doctor and Jo are caught and taken to the throne room, where they pretend to be the Earth delegation and that Jo is a princess. The King immediately has an eye for Jo, and Alpha tells him about Torbis' death and the supposed curse. They adjourn to the delegation room and narrowly avoid having a statue of Aggedor pushed onto them by an unseen guard. Hepesh dismisses the need for investigation as Aggedor's will, really making his planet look modern and normal. The King assures them of his intentions, and everyone pads out the running time by arguing over what to do next. He privately asks Jo for her support and she is keen to befriend him but leaves when he asks her to be a political ally. The Doctor examines a piece of Martian technology Jo found on the statue's ledge, and assumes the Martians are still warlike and aggressive, despite being on a diplomatic mission with other civilisations.

Arcturus is attacked, and the Doctor rewires his life support to keep his hideous self alive. Hepesh blames Aggedor and the Doctor blames Izlyr, while Jo finds the component in the Martian's quarters. His aide, Ssorg, finds her and locks her in, as the Doctor is intercepted by Grun. Everyone continues to argue about who's responsible, with Arcturus unable remember who attacked it. Jo escapes as Grun takes the Doctor into the tunnels before running off at the sound of a roar. Jo meets Izlyr again, who is highly suspicious, but notes the missing component would not have killed Arcturus. He says Mars has rejected the mountain of conflict and now walks the road of peace, but thinks the Doctor is responsible. The Doctor chases after the animal and finds himself in a shrine, where he is arrested by Hepesh and taken to the King. He faces the highest charge of heresy, for which the only penalty is death...

I don't care about any of this. The story makes little sense, the mystery is blindingly obvious with no intrigue or engagement for the audience, David Troughton is wet as the Atlantic as the King - who bizarrely is also called Peladon - and everyone else is a space alien. Arcturus looks disgusting, and is very obviously the villain, and there's no reason to be engaged in the political squabbles of an alien planet. There's an undercurrent in parallelling the Doctor's mistrust of the Martians and Hepesh's of all outsiders, but this is going nowhere, and could not have lower stakes.

[BritishHobo]

I really loved this one, on my original watchthrough and this time around. But I'm honestly not sure I could justify it with anything deeper than "I think Alpha Centauri is funny"